The Year Of The Fox Posted 10 September 2012 Share Posted 10 September 2012 10:35pm tonight, ITV1. Documentary about Hillsborough. Wonder whether Hugh Robertson will be watching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashley Posted 10 September 2012 Share Posted 10 September 2012 Anyone watching this on ITV? All information about that sad day gets released on Wednesday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voll Blau Posted 10 September 2012 Share Posted 10 September 2012 Anyone watching this on ITV? All information about that sad day gets released on Wednesday. Let's hope that's the case... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexikokopops Posted 11 September 2012 Share Posted 11 September 2012 There was a good article in the Observer about it on Sunday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 September 2012 Share Posted 11 September 2012 There was a good article in the Observer about it on Sunday Cheers for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexikokopops Posted 11 September 2012 Share Posted 11 September 2012 Cheers for that. There's a couple more here which I haven't had time to read yet. David Conn usually writes excellent stuff. Hillsborough - how stories were altered Could the Hillsborough lies ever happen again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Year Of The Fox Posted 11 September 2012 Author Share Posted 11 September 2012 Watching it at the mo. So so tragic. What's worse is the cover up by the police that began immediately after. Scum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purpleronnie Posted 11 September 2012 Share Posted 11 September 2012 Watching it at the mo. So so tragic. What's worse is the cover up by the police that began immediately after. Scum exactly what I thought, I couldn't believe in the face of such tragedy that the very same day the cover up started...its almost unhuman...no morality at all...it beggars belief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Year Of The Fox Posted 11 September 2012 Author Share Posted 11 September 2012 exactly what I thought, I couldn't believe in the face of such tragedy that the very same day the cover up started...its almost unhuman...no morality at all...it beggars belief. I don't know as much about what happened as I perhaps shouldve, but if last night's program laid all the facts down and wasnt one sided against the police then the Liverpool fans have every right to want justice. On the same train of thought, not one time (I dont think) was a reference made regarding standing being q factor of the tragedy. I really hope the report tomorrow unveils everything the families want it to, as its frankly disgusting. Police thinking they're above the law and looking after their own Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 Did they mention that thousands of ticket less Liverpool fans were trying to force their way in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Year Of The Fox Posted 12 September 2012 Author Share Posted 12 September 2012 Did they mention that thousands of ticket less Liverpool fans were trying to force their way in? They mentioned that that in fact wasn't the case. Just that they opened those gates to release the pressure from outside the ground whereupon the vast majority made their way through that tunnel into the pens immediately behind the goal. Either side towards each corner flag there was plenty of room. Though how they can open that gate (and allow people to climb over the turnstile building though they I guess we're panicking fans rather than opportunists) yet say that the majority had tickets I'm not sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 They mentioned that that in fact wasn't the case. Just that they opened those gates to release the pressure from outside the ground whereupon the vast majority made their way through that tunnel into the pens immediately behind the goal. Either side towards each corner flag there was plenty of room. Though how they can open that gate (and allow people to climb over the turnstile building though they I guess we're panicking fans rather than opportunists) yet say that the majority had tickets I'm not sure! There were loads without tickets trying to get in. Liverpool fans were and are still known for doing that. Their tactic was to turn up late and surge the turn styles because they knew under the pressure of it the authorities would just open the gates and let them in to avoid a catastrophe. So what you had was a situation where thousands of fans some with and some without tickets were all converging on the turn styles at once. I agree that the police were at fault for how they handled that huge crowd, but there is blame on all sides in my opinion. Just to add to this, the Champions League final in Athens 2007, just 5 years ago, as a half Greek I read the Greek papers and watch the news. There was loads of Liverpool fans without tickets that jumped the fences around the Olympic stadium and got in, and the Greek Stewards were left with hundreds of Liverpool fans WITH tickets outside the stadium they could not let in as it was now full. I've just checked my facts on this, it was 5000 fans who they estimate jumped the fences without tickets in Athens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Year Of The Fox Posted 12 September 2012 Author Share Posted 12 September 2012 Fair enough! Point taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MooseBreath Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 Didn't realise that was aong standing technique of Liverpool fans. What a bunch of *****. Even to do that in the knowledge that other paying fans would miss out makes them total scum. To do it knowing its going to cause danger is inhumane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 Didn't realise that was aong standing technique of Liverpool fans. What a bunch of *****. Even to do that in the knowledge that other paying fans would miss out makes them total scum. To do it knowing its going to cause danger is inhumane. It's been Whitewashed over. Ah well the RIP brigade can get stuck in now. The old bill were out of order that day for sure, but the stampede in the first place was not their creation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 Agree with you Mack, poorly handled by the cops, shocking cover up afterwards also. But the seeming refusal to accept their part by Liverpool fans I do find a bit galling. Those that died weren't to blame, as being near the front I would imagine they had tickets, but other Liverpool fans aren't blameless in the whole mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purpleronnie Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 It was shown that ticketless fans were not the cause and at most aggrevated the situation but the main contribution to the disaster was the failure of police control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 It was shown that ticketless fans were not the cause and at most aggrevated the situation but the main contribution to the disaster was the failure of police control. Hmmmmm... well I'm not sure the police forced these people into the ground. They all went in willingly knowing that a) they didn't have tickets and b) there would not be enough room for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 It was shown that ticketless fans were not the cause and at most aggrevated the situation but the main contribution to the disaster was the failure of police control. I agree the police were to blame for the end result, and the way it was dealt with was out of order after also. However a sea of fans were stampeding the gates, tickets, no tickets the lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryn Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 This is currently live on BBC Parliament. The Liverpool fans have been emphatically cleared of wrongdoing. There is evidence of a police coverup and that the media "aided and abetted" it (the words of the Leader of the Opposition). The Government was not involved in the coverup but did not act to protect the victims as they should. The most shuddering announcement is that many of the victims were still alive after the time by which the Coroner stated all had died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purpleronnie Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 Hmmmmm... well I'm not sure the police forced these people into the ground. They all went in willingly knowing that a) they didn't have tickets and b) there would not be enough room for everyone. But there was only a small number that didnt have tickets and the actual pen was estimated after the disaster to be either under its limit or only marginally over...making the number that should have been allowed too high...nothing to do with the ticketless fans. didnt you watch it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purpleronnie Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 This is currently live on BBC Parliament. The Liverpool fans have been emphatically cleared of wrongdoing. There is evidence of a police coverup and that the media "aided and abetted" it (the words of the Leader of the Opposition). The Government was not involved in the coverup but did not act to protect the victims as they should. The most shuddering announcement is that many of the victims were still alive after the time by which the Coroner stated all had died. Good...but some it seems are still wanting to blame liverpool fans despite the evidence...from this thread alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexikokopops Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 But there was only a small number that didnt have tickets and the actual pen was estimated after the disaster to be either under its limit or only marginally over...making the number that should have been allowed too high...nothing to do with the ticketless fans. didnt you watch it? If you're not careful you'll get branded the "RIP brigade". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan LCFC Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 I never realised the Sun's headlines were that bad. I'm never touching it again, not that I ever used to buy it anyway. SYP are a disgrace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 12 September 2012 Share Posted 12 September 2012 But there was only a small number that didnt have tickets and the actual pen was estimated after the disaster to be either under its limit or only marginally over...making the number that should have been allowed too high...nothing to do with the ticketless fans. If they opened the gates and people flooded in how do they know how many were in there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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