Wasilewski

[Babylon]

Not scoring enough goals is as big a problem if not more so. As our game philosophy is to attack we were bound to concede a goal or two but it should have bought us goals against Crystal Palace and Newcastle.

Indeed.

[Dickov22]

Time for him to get a start?

God help us if he does

[Fox Ulike]

I was going to mentioned how Liam could have been at fault for quite a few goals already this season back I can;t be arsed with the backlash 

 

In which case name just one goal Moore has been at fault for this season?

[Fox Ulike]

Away from home, we've got the 3rd best defensive record in the league... but the worst attacking record. 

 

So Foxestalk say CHANGE THE DEFENCE!!

 

 

Foxestalk: Defying logic since 2004.

[Bert]

Away from home, we've got the 3rd best defensive record in the league... but the worst attacking record.

So Foxestalk say CHANGE THE DEFENCE!!

Foxestalk: Defying logic since 2004.

Who said change? A question was asked. That's it.

A defence that's served Us well the past two away games though.

[Bert]

In which case name just one goal Moore has been at fault for this season?

First goal v Burnley he he lost his man who was able to provide an assist for the goal. Go back and watch it and if you don't think he should've done better then i will give up on life.

Man Utd. Look how easily he loses track of RVP as he's ball watching.

[Fox Ulike]

Who said change? A question was asked. That's it.

A defence that's served Us well the past two away games though

 

So were you planning on playing Was up front?

 

I'm out.

[ScouseFox]

First goal v Burnley he he lost his man who was able to provide an assist for the goal. Go back and watch it and if you don't think he should've done better then i will give up on life.

Man Utd. Look how easily he loses track of RVP as he's ball watching.

 

grandad point out to me that if you watch the arsenal goal he goes a bit nuts, too. harsh to say he's directly at fault but he doesn't seem aware of what's around him, just charges to the ball and a bit of clever play by cazorla and we've been done. 

[Bert]

grandad point out to me that if you watch the arsenal goal he goes a bit nuts, too. harsh to say he's directly at fault but he doesn't seem aware of what's around him, just charges to the ball and a bit of clever play by cazorla and we've been done.

Yeah I've just had a look at that goal now as well. I love Liam and he's gonna be great in the future. But he's still a lot to learn.

You can't buy experience.

[Fox Ulike]

First goal v Burnley he he lost his man who was able to provide an assist for the goal. Go back and watch it and if you don't think he should've done better then i will give up on life.

Man Utd. Look how easily he loses track of RVP as he's ball watching.

 

No true I actually had a convo on here blaming him for Burnley's first goal. So I'll give you that one.

 

You might want to review this one though: "he loses track of RVP". That's Robin. van. Persie you're talking about. Not Ricky van Wolfswinkel. De Laet to blame for that one for his rash challenge on the wing leaving Moore exposed. You can't blame Moore for not winning every single cross into the box against a world class opponent. That's just impossible and unrealistic.

 

So OK, one goal he's to blame for. And so he's out?

[filbertway]

If we were to drop him then I'd want him out on loan as it's a waste for him to sit on the bench during the most important years of his development.

 

The fact we need him playing to improve is the main reason I wouldn't want him dropped. I do agree he can be accused of ball watching a bit, he's part of what is probably one of the most worked defences this season though and he's done a lot more good than bad, I wouldn't say he deserves to lose his place for a few lapses of concentration. Especially to a player who is probably equally as likely to make errors and cost us with his mental actions.

 

It's not crazy to question the situation though.

[Fox Ulike]

grandad point out to me that if you watch the arsenal goal he goes a bit nuts, too. harsh to say he's directly at fault but he doesn't seem aware of what's around him, just charges to the ball and a bit of clever play by cazorla and we've been done. 

 

"He goes a bit nuts" !!

 

I've just watched that goal about five times. I've no idea how any City player is really to blame. If anybody, it's the defensive midfielder (Hammond?) who has left Carzorla unmarked. Moore just goes up to cover the gap.

[Sooper Steve's shin]

I wouldn't say no to Was coming in on Saturday. Moore has been getting a lot of praise and has played some decent stuff this season, but he is not the finished article. A goal for England U-21s and talk of a £10m bid from Arsenal in January is all well and good, but I think a little rest might be a good thing to calm down any hype and keep him working for his place. Wasilewski was brought in for our Championship push to add some steel and he did that. I don't think the management would have given him a contract this season if they didn't think he had a role to play, so I think he'll be in the mix.

 

Having said all that, I can also see the arguments that defence is not necessarily where our problems lie and Moore has probably not been the worst of the back five. I think, though, that a more experience and aggressive central defender like Was could influence (or scare) his full-backs and midfielders into defending better.

[Bert]

No true I actually had a convo on here blaming him for Burnley's first goal. So I'll give you that one.

You might want to review this one though: "he loses track of RVP". That's Robin. van. Persie you're talking about. Not Ricky van Wolfswinkel. De Laet to blame for that one for his rash challenge on the wing leaving Moore exposed. You can't blame Moore for not winning every single cross into the box against a world class opponent. That's just impossible and unrealistic.

So OK, one goal he's to blame for. And so he's out?

I've not singled him out for not winning every cross that comes into the box. I've done it on two occasions. Both times I feel justified. You say "Robin. Van. Persie." Surely more of a reason to get as tight to him as possible? There was only one place that ball to RVP was going and that to the far post. Morgan went to close down Falcao so Moore should then drop off as he's already lost his man on the edge of the box. Correct me if I'm wrong there.

Did you go to Newcastle on Saturday? Lost his man and let a long ball go over his head only getting himself out of jail by absolutely nailing the bloke.

He's got great potential, puts his body on the line for us week in week out. He makes some great tackles, blocks but a lot of them are last ditch and for a centre back you have to ask yourself why?

Again I'm not slating him, just pointing out what I see as a big weakness to his game. As he grows as a player and a footballer he will get better.

[Dickov22]

Moore won't be in the team once Upson is fit. Fact

[Bert]

Moore won't be in the team once Upson is fit. Fact

And people are worried about Wasilewski not being quick?

[Dan LCFC]

I'm not entirely convinced by Wasyl. It's an absolute myth that he's aerially dominant.

 

He isn't a poor defender but I'm not sure we'd be any more solid with him playing at the minute. Only one way to find out though.

 

I thought the same about Upson. I'd imagine he'll be getting games when he returns as long as he's fit enough. He's actually aerially dominant.

[Fox Ulike]

I've not singled him out for not winning every cross that comes into the box. I've done it on two occasions. Both times I feel justified. You say "Robin. Van. Persie." Surely more of a reason to get as tight to him as possible? There was only one place that ball to RVP was going and that to the far post. Morgan went to close down Falcao so Moore should then drop off as he's already lost his man on the edge of the box. Correct me if I'm wrong there.

Did you go to Newcastle on Saturday? Lost his man and let a long ball go over his head only getting himself out of jail by absolutely nailing the bloke.

He's got great potential, puts his body on the line for us week in week out. He makes some great tackles, blocks but a lot of them are last ditch and for a centre back you have to ask yourself why?

Again I'm not slating him, just pointing out what I see as a big weakness to his game. As he grows as a player and a footballer he will get better.

 

Hmmm OK just watched the RVP goal, admittedly Moore is a bit ball-watchy.

 

That’s twice then. Are there others?

 

In terms of the Newcastle incident sounds like he did the right thing. I think you're wrong to see it as a big weakness, I think you're just over-analysing his game and identifying the errors. But you could do the same to any other player in the country. If nobody ever made a mistake, then 90% of games would finish 0-0.

[Bert]

Hmmm OK just watched the RVP goal, admittedly Moore is a bit ball-watchy.

That’s twice then. Are there others?

In terms of the Newcastle incident sounds like he did the right thing. I think you're wrong to see it as a big weakness, I think you're just over-analysing his game and identifying the errors. But you could do the same to any other player in the country. If nobody ever made a mistake, then 90% of games would finish 0-0.

I'm not here to slate him - but if I can see it as a weakness then I'm sure football teams coaches that know a lot more than I do about the game will be able to see it too.

Granted its only actually lead to two goals but that doesn't mean that's the only times that it's happened.

[Fox Ulike]

I'm not here to slate him - but if I can see it as a weakness then I'm sure football teams coaches that know a lot more than I do about the game will be able to see it too.

Granted its only actually lead to two goals but that doesn't mean that's the only times that it's happened.

 

Yeah I know you're not slating him...

 

I mean take the RVP goal…

 

Moore moves to cover RVP but then RVP just moves again, constantly creating the space for himself. This scenario is played out over-and-over in the course of a footy match between an attacker and defender. 

 

This means that it is physically impossible for Moore  to ‘close down’ or ‘get tight’ to RVP 100% of the time.

 

You’re arguing that Moore should constantly overcome the basic laws of physics and motion, like a faster-than-light neutrino.

 

I think that’s asking a lot.

[Jacnah]

I am a fan of Wasyl but I'm not sure Morgan or Moore have done anything that warrants being dropped. Also I'm not sure whether Wasyl has played at all since last season, possibly in Development games so I certainly don't think it's the correct time to start him yet.

I'm a fan of Wasyl as well, but unfortunately for all the wrong reasons...

 

he looks like he's on the run from the Siberian Gulag after having been confined to solitary confinement for 15 years having murdered his pedo cell mate by stabbing him in the neck with a warm bakewell tart -  some of his tackles look like he's 'reverting to type' make you want to cover your eyes even though you're in the stands. I'm sure he scares the sh*t out of the opposition, but, unfortunately, these aren't considered desirable traits or reasons to replace our current pairing, who, actually, are doing pretty well all things considered. 

[Bert]

Yeah I know you're not slating him...

I mean take the RVP goal…

Moore moves to cover RVP but then RVP just moves again, constantly creating the space for himself. This scenario is played out over-and-over in the course of a footy match between an attacker and defender.

This means that it is physically impossible for Moore to ‘close down’ or ‘get tight’ to RVP 100% of the time.

You’re arguing that Moore should constantly overcome the basic laws of physics and motion, like a faster-than-light neutrino.

I think that’s asking a lot.

Well not really as he's not even the right side of his man... Which is why he loses him.

[StanSP]

Still happy with the Moore/Morgan combination but if one were to be dropped, I can only see it being Moore. I wouldn't be totally against it but they've actually played fairly well and stepped up for the majority of games this season. So I can't really see it happening.

[Callabinho]

Agree 100% with Bert. Liam has been brilliant so far, however he is young and his nativity has forced him to make one or two of these impressive blocks. To be a success you need to be able handle everything your profession throws at you.

Resting him for a few games will not hurt him, and despite what a lot of people may think he has been at fault for some of the goals. Now, for me Was has to start against Swansea, and all of this wet talk about him not being fast enough for the premier league is bollocks, he has experience playing in the champions league for crying out loud, the premier league will suite him more than the championship in terms of pace. Two experienced heads is what we need, plus Was has played at a much higher level than Wes for most of his career, maybe Wes needs someone more mature along side him for a while.

[Kitchandro]

I think both centre backs have performed admirably so far. Moore's made a few errors but he's been far from shit, it's a learning curve for him remember.

 

I'd rather us persevere with Moore, he could go on to be a great defender, Wasyl and Upson are coming to the end of their careers. It took him a while to get used to Championship football but then he ripped it up last season until his injury.

 

I don't think it's the time to start dropping defenders personally. We have conceded goals too easily at times but I think that's more of a collective issue than individual. Of course, if Moore has a nightmare against Swansea I might change my mind.