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davieG

The EU referendum - IN / OUT or Shake it all about.

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I don't think anyone thinks we can't get a trade agreement. They worry that many trade agreements won't be as good for the UK as they would from within the EU.

We are well inside the EU too.

Yeah but maybe they would be better if we didn't have to go with EU tariffs. I don't think anyone really knows until the details are thrashed out.

The most important thing for most brits, rightly or wrongly, is the free movement of people and the strength of feeling on that come referendum time will be the decider imo.

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Yeah but maybe they would be better if we didn't have to go with EU tariffs. I don't think anyone really knows until the details are thrashed out.

The most important thing for most brits, rightly or wrongly, is the free movement of people and the strength of feeling on that come referendum time will be the decider imo.

 

Leaving the EU could (probably will) make it more difficult for British people to move. It'll certainly be a lot slower through customs in Europe for the Brits. Can you imagine having to queue as long to get to Amsterdam or France as it is when you go through some African/American/Asian border controls?

 

Or do you mean that for some Brits the most important thing is to stop some Europeans getting into Britain? 

 

Do "they" realise that it won't change the "movement" of all those Africans and Asians?

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Like all things there are pluses and minuses . Leaving would make some things worse but I wouldn't want to be part of a United States of Europe for any price.

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Like all things there are pluses and minuses . Leaving would make some things worse but I wouldn't want to be part of a United States of Europe for any price.

 

More Media/UKIP/Tory scaremongering.

 

That isn't the case, as you should well know

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Why not?

Because I don't want the policies this country follows decided by foreigners who don't live here, don't have the same traditions/priorities and might not even speak the same language. Plus I'm British, not European.

More Media/UKIP/Tory scaremongering.

 

That isn't the case, as you should well know

Ever closer union means just that.

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Because I don't want the policies this country follows decided by foreigners who don't live here, don't have the same traditions/priorities and might not even speak the same language. Plus I'm British, not European

If you believe some on here that already happens, but that isn't a reason why not, nationality is not a qualification for rule, Gordon Brown was Scottish, and British and shit for this country.

Would you not prefer the best minds of a whole continent deciding our economic future rather than Osbourne and his history of arts degree, or even Ed Balls.

I'm not saying that the EU is that at all, but that is what it could be a huge pool of resources and power acting together for the good of everyone. Why does it bother you if they are foreign?

Would you extend that to relinquishing all of our power of other countries we still rule/own/have a common interest in?

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If you believe some on here that already happens, but that isn't a reason why not, nationality is not a qualification for rule, Gordon Brown was Scottish, and British and shit for this country.

Would you not prefer the best minds of a whole continent deciding our economic future rather than Osbourne and his history of arts degree, or even Ed Balls.

I'm not saying that the EU is that at all, but that is what it could be a huge pool of resources and power acting together for the good of everyone. Why does it bother you if they are foreign?

If you believe some on here that already happens, but that isn't a reason why not, nationality is not a qualification for rule, Gordon Brown was Scottish, and British and shit for this country.

Would you not prefer the best minds of a whole continent deciding our economic future rather than Osbourne and his history of arts degree, or even Ed Balls.

I'm not saying that the EU is that at all, but that is what it could be a huge pool of resources and power acting together for the good of everyone. Why does it bother you if they are foreign?

If you read my post you'll see that I've explained that already.

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So you would rather have Balls in charge of our economy ahead of any other foreigner because he is British?

I can vote for or against Balls, I can't vote for some foreigner.

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Because I don't want the policies this country follows decided by foreigners who don't live here, don't have the same traditions/priorities and might not even speak the same language. Plus I'm British, not European.

Ever closer union means just that.

 

You are European!

 

And no it doesn't. You're more intelligent than you are making out here Webbo. Are you aware that a large block of the European parliament is made up of people like UKIP? There will always be people who want extremes but closer union means working together to stop paedos and international criminals, to stop people trafficking, to better protect citizens from outside forces and a million other things long before it means a Federal Europe. Stop opening the Daily Mail and open your mind.

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I can vote for or against Balls, I can't vote for some foreigner.

 

Haven't you heard of European elections? and just because you can vote against him doesn't mean that he won't be your leader.

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You are European!

 

And no it doesn't. You're more intelligent than you are making out here Webbo. Are you aware that a large block of the European parliament is made up of people like UKIP? There will always be people who want extremes but closer union means working together to stop paedos and international criminals, to stop people trafficking, to better protect citizens from outside forces and a million other things long before it means a Federal Europe. Stop opening the Daily Mail and open your mind.

Better carbon emissions across the Union too.   There's a lot of profligate behaviour that needs addressing though, like the monthly upheaval to Strasbourg for starters, and things like their fishing policies need a vast amount of work done on them too.  Overall though I agree we're better off as a whole in the Union than out of it.

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Leaving the EU could (probably will) make it more difficult for British people to move. It'll certainly be a lot slower through customs in Europe for the Brits. Can you imagine having to queue as long to get to Amsterdam or France as it is when you go through some African/American/Asian border controls?

Or do you mean that for some Brits the most important thing is to stop some Europeans getting into Britain?

Do "they" realise that it won't change the "movement" of all those Africans and Asians?

I'm sure we can sort something out re. the immigration queues. That's perhaps the least complicated of all the issues we would be faced with.

Yes I do think that for some brits the most important thing is to regain control over the flow of immigrants. I see immigration regularly voted towards the top of lists of issues people are concerned with.

Your last sentence is a point I've made on here before. I think where people do have a problem with the effects of immigration, the cause is often not EU immigration in the first place.

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Haven't you heard of European elections? and just because you can vote against him doesn't mean that he won't be your leader.

It is different, you know it is. i don't want a larger less accountable political system, im happy for trade agreements, even trade legislation but beyond that is too much.

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If you believe some on here that already happens, but that isn't a reason why not, nationality is not a qualification for rule, Gordon Brown was Scottish, and British and shit for this country.

Would you not prefer the best minds of a whole continent deciding our economic future rather than Osbourne and his history of arts degree, or even Ed Balls.

I'm not saying that the EU is that at all, but that is what it could be a huge pool of resources and power acting together for the good of everyone. Why does it bother you if they are foreign?

Would you extend that to relinquishing all of our power of other countries we still rule/own/have a common interest in?

We as a nation, put more money into the European fund than anyone else, and get the least out of it, That is an undisputed fact, accepted by all parties. We currently have the largest economic growth in Europe, and the "Independent Economy Think Tank", about six months ago, said we would be better off out of Europe, and could happily improve without their interference. 

 

The two most influential  countries are France and Germany, both of whom have extremely abrasive attitudes towards towards Britain, much of it based on passed history.

 

Anyone who seriously believes we should remain in Europe, must be happy to see our nation pushed around, by these and other countries

 

I certainly do not.

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Haven't you heard of European elections? and just because you can vote against him doesn't mean that he won't be your leader.

If he's voted for by my fellow countrymen I can live with that. I don't want someone in charge of me because France and Germany have voted for him.

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If he's voted for by my fellow countrymen I can live with that. I don't want someone in charge of me because France and Germany have voted for him.

Do you really see politicians as being in charge of you? I work within the systems in place but if I don't like them I can always move on, I like to think that I am in charge of me (or the wife is in charge of me) and if I ever feel I'm not changes will be made.

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We as a nation, put more money into the European fund than anyone else, and get the least out of it, That is an undisputed fact, accepted by all parties. We currently have the largest economic growth in Europe, and the "Independent Economy Think Tank", about six months ago, said we would be better off out of Europe, and could happily improve without their interference. 

 

The two most influential  countries are France and Germany, both of whom have extremely abrasive attitudes towards towards Britain, much of it based on passed history.

 

Anyone who seriously believes we should remain in Europe, must be happy to see our nation pushed around, by these and other countries

 

I certainly do not.

Don't be absurd, whatever misgivings the French and Germans have about us, it's got a lot more to do with our fiscal reluctance than "ze war"...

 

As for being the largest contributor. Poppycock.

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Don't be absurd, whatever misgivings the French and Germans have about us, it's got a lot more to do with our fiscal reluctance than "ze war"...

 

As for being the largest contributor. Poppycock.

 

True.  But.  In 2013 the UK put 17bn Euros in to the EU, yet received 6.2bn Euros back, in other words we received less than Germany, France, Italy, Spain, Belgium, Poland, Greece, Portugal, Romania and Hungary.  In terms of NET contribution the UK is in fact the second largest contributor the EU when taking this in to account (behind Germany). 

 

For what it's worth, if the EU was to stay as it is right now I'd personally vote for us to remain in (especially so if we get the necessary reforms), however those in the Eurozone know that the only future for the bloc is ever closer union, as it was suicidal to ever think that the Eurozone could allow countries like Greece, Cyprus & Portugal to do whatever the hell they wanted thinking that the supply of free money would never run out.  

 

That is something I would not vote for.  Nearly a thousand years of sovereignty consigned to history just so people don't have to queue when trying to get into Amsterdam for their annual fix of weed and Hungarian hookers?  No thank you.

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Do you really see politicians as being in charge of you? I work within the systems in place but if I don't like them I can always move on, I like to think that I am in charge of me (or the wife is in charge of me) and if I ever feel I'm not changes will be made.

I don't want to emigrate, at my age not many countries would want me anyway.

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True.  But.  In 2013 the UK put 17bn Euros in to the EU, yet received 6.2bn Euros back, in other words we received less than Germany, France, Italy, Spain, Belgium, Poland, Greece, Portugal, Romania and Hungary.  In terms of NET contribution the UK is in fact the second largest contributor the EU when taking this in to account (behind Germany). 

 

For what it's worth, if the EU was to stay as it is right now I'd personally vote for us to remain in (especially so if we get the necessary reforms), however those in the Eurozone know that the only future for the bloc is ever closer union, as it was suicidal to ever think that the Eurozone could allow countries like Greece, Cyprus & Portugal to do whatever the hell they wanted thinking that the supply of free money would never run out.  

 

That is something I would not vote for.  Nearly a thousand years of sovereignty consigned to history just so people don't have to queue when trying to get into Amsterdam for their annual fix of weed and Hungarian hookers?  No thank you.

Why annual?  With free movement you can go whenever you like!  :thumbup:

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I don't want to emigrate, at my age not many countries would want me anyway.

Skills and education are in demand at any age, having a bit of money behind you also helps. Become someone who get off their arse and makes things work for them, location shouldn't be a block.

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