The Politics Thread

[Alf Bentley]

6 hours ago, KingGTF said:

I used to enjoy reading and contributing to the politics discussion on here but not been around much lately. Glad to see the usual suspects are still going strong, however. It's great to see discussion that isn't solely coming from some academics, educated fantasist students and most of the crap in the media. Maybe I should frequent this place more often but I find the uni bubble has sapped all desire for political discussion.

 

It probably says something positive about your life that you're in here less - and something negative about the lives of "the usual suspects" (like me) that we're still here gassing on. Best idea is probably to pop in occasionally but not as often as rut-dwellers like me. Good to hear from you anyway. Did you end up studying history or politics at the LSE or somewhere in London or is my aging brain misremembering?

[Guest MattP]

8 hours ago, KingGTF said:

I used to enjoy reading and contributing to the politics discussion on here but not been around much lately. Glad to see the usual suspects are still going strong, however. It's great to see discussion that isn't solely coming from some academics, educated fantasist students and most of the crap in the media. Maybe I should frequent this place more often but I find the uni bubble has sapped all desire for political discussion.

Having seen a couple of professors recently on the TV I can't imagine how the debate is going in the Uni's.

 

Bit of political news - Labour has chosen a good candidate for Copeland, a Christian, St John's volunteer, although she did vote remain and for Owen Smith. 

 

Watching This Week last night was painful, Jess Phillips was on and was so far out of her depth it was a bit embarrassing, Neil asked her about a potential trade war and she looked at him like he had asked her to shut down a nuclear reactor, then started waffling on that car companies would move to Poland.

[Guest MattP]

Jewish Chronicle now calling Labour "institutionally anti-semetic".

[Rincewind]

I don't post much now but will give rep the occasional post.

[Guest MattP]

14 minutes ago, Rincewind said:

I don't post much now but will give rep the occasional post.

That's a shame I used to enjoy your input. 

 

How do you think the Corbyn reign is going? 

[Rincewind]

2 minutes ago, MattP said:

That's a shame I used to enjoy your input. 

 

How do you think the Corbyn reign is going? 

Depends on which media outlet you take notice of.

[Facecloth]

9 minutes ago, Rincewind said:

Depends on which media outlet you take notice of.

I think every media outlet can agree he's a shite leader tbh.

[Guest MattP]

33 minutes ago, Rincewind said:

Depends on which media outlet you take notice of.

I'm asking for your personal opinion, not interested in the media.

 

23 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

I think every media outlet can agree he's a shite leader tbh.

He's still got The Canary.

[Alf Bentley]

 

Wasn't sure where to post this article by John Harris about the increased use of technology to monitor employees' every move and word at work, and even outside work.

Not "politics" as such, more "society", but it has political implications: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/20/digital-giants-workers-robots-film-employee-monitoring-the-circle

 

Excerpts:

" I spoke this week to a trade union organiser who works in two key fields: the huge warehouses run by online retail giants, and driver deliveries. In the former, she told me, employees are often tracked so closely that their managers can see if they pause between tasks or, even more unthinkably, stop for a chat with their fellow workers – something betrayed when dots on a GPS machine cluster together. Socialising becomes all but impossible; the idea of meeting a partner at work looks like a laughable relic. Meanwhile, when it comes to anything that involves a human being and a car, van or lorry, the same tracking means productivity must be squeezed out of every second: even stopping at Tesco for a sandwich can be an unwise decision. Fighting all this, I was told, is usually viable only in workplaces with a strong union – and besides, people used to their work being constantly monitored tend to now expect it: as my contact put it, “They don’t think it’s that bad. It seems normal.”

 

" If you doubt the sinister elements of what’s going on, consider the case of Myrna Arias, who worked for a Miami-based money exchange company that insisted she download a tracking app on to her phone that logged her whereabouts 24 hours a day. She deleted the app and was fired, leading to legal action that was settled out of court. Or maybe have a look at the story of two parking inspectors in Sydney recently sacked for the content of conversations picked up on their body cameras."

[The Doctor]

8 hours ago, Rincewind said:

Depends on which media outlet you take notice of.

More about what you think an opposition leader should be doing. I'd be a bit of a traditionalist and suggest he should be leading the opposition and provide a credible alternative - which he isn't getting close to doing.

[Strokes]

3 hours ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

Wasn't sure where to post this article by John Harris about the increased use of technology to monitor employees' every move and word at work, and even outside work.

Not "politics" as such, more "society", but it has political implications: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/20/digital-giants-workers-robots-film-employee-monitoring-the-circle

 

Excerpts:

" I spoke this week to a trade union organiser who works in two key fields: the huge warehouses run by online retail giants, and driver deliveries. In the former, she told me, employees are often tracked so closely that their managers can see if they pause between tasks or, even more unthinkably, stop for a chat with their fellow workers – something betrayed when dots on a GPS machine cluster together. Socialising becomes all but impossible; the idea of meeting a partner at work looks like a laughable relic. Meanwhile, when it comes to anything that involves a human being and a car, van or lorry, the same tracking means productivity must be squeezed out of every second: even stopping at Tesco for a sandwich can be an unwise decision. Fighting all this, I was told, is usually viable only in workplaces with a strong union – and besides, people used to their work being constantly monitored tend to now expect it: as my contact put it, “They don’t think it’s that bad. It seems normal.”

 

" If you doubt the sinister elements of what’s going on, consider the case of Myrna Arias, who worked for a Miami-based money exchange company that insisted she download a tracking app on to her phone that logged her whereabouts 24 hours a day. She deleted the app and was fired, leading to legal action that was settled out of court. Or maybe have a look at the story of two parking inspectors in Sydney recently sacked for the content of conversations picked up on their body cameras."

Yeah, it's an increasing concern how monitored we are at work. I work for a company which sells security equipment and you would be surprised how many concealed cameras get installed in workplaces. I've fitted hidden microphones in managers offices, it's frightening stuff really. Vans tracked is the norm in our trade, 'to help run a more efficient business'. I'm not convinced it works. If they don't trust employees, it's not surprising when shifts or callouts need covering, nobody helps.

[Kopfkino]

On 20/01/2017 at 07:33, Alf Bentley said:

 

It probably says something positive about your life that you're in here less - and something negative about the lives of "the usual suspects" (like me) that we're still here gassing on. Best idea is probably to pop in occasionally but not as often as rut-dwellers like me. Good to hear from you anyway. Did you end up studying history or politics at the LSE or somewhere in London or is my aging brain misremembering?

 

Close enough - Government and Econ at LSE. I mean its debatable whether I'm studying anything tbh

[Jon the Hat]

What the hell is all this grief Theresa is getting about this Trident test?  On what planet should the Government reveal a glitch in their nuclear deterrent for ****s sake.  Ridiculous story.

[Barky]

4 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

What the hell is all this grief Theresa is getting about this Trident test?  On what planet should the Government reveal a glitch in their nuclear deterrent for ****s sake.  Ridiculous story.

On a planet where a faulty nuclear deterrent could kill a lot of people, I expect.

[Webbo]

3 minutes ago, Barky said:

On a planet where a faulty nuclear deterrent could kill a lot of people, I expect.

I'm guessing it wasn't armed. Doesn't this prove we need an upgrade on Trident? A newer, more reliable alternative.

[Sharpe's Fox]

23 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

What the hell is all this grief Theresa is getting about this Trident test?  On what planet should the Government reveal a glitch in their nuclear deterrent for ****s sake.  Ridiculous story.

The government usually put out a press release announcing a successful test. Makes you wonder why they didn't put one out in this case, maybe something to do with the impending vote on the matter in which Mrs May made an impassioned speech of how wonderful the system was.

 

Also Theresa May was asked four times by Andrew Marr if she knew about it this morning and didn't answer the question. She even went to the length of blaming Jeremy Corbyn for it, which I'm sure suprised him when he got home after tending to his pumpkin patch.

[adam]

42 minutes ago, Webbo said:

I'm guessing it wasn't armed. Doesn't this prove we need an upgrade on Trident? A newer, more reliable alternative.

It definitely wasn't armed and it definitely never veered towards the US either  

[leicsmac]

40 minutes ago, Webbo said:

I'm guessing it wasn't armed. Doesn't this prove we need an upgrade on Trident? A newer, more reliable alternative.

Holy shit, I agree with Webbo. Well, the first sentence anyway. Modern nuclear weapons are one-point safe, there's no way to cause a nuclear detonation without the proper trigger so this incident wouldn't have resulted in large-scale trouble.

 

That being said, actually coming clean about it might have been a better idea from the start.

[Webbo]

4 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Holy shit, I agree with Webbo. Well, the first sentence anyway. Modern nuclear weapons are one-point safe, there's no way to cause a nuclear detonation without the proper trigger so this incident wouldn't have resulted in large-scale trouble.

 

That being said, actually coming clean about it might have been a better idea from the start.

My relentless logic is wearing you down. You'll thank me in years to come.

[leicsmac]

4 minutes ago, Webbo said:

My relentless logic is wearing you down. You'll thank me in years to come.

Nah, on account of humans being humans by the time that happens the only thing left on Earth will be the cockroaches.

[Jon the Hat]

13 hours ago, Sharpe's Fox said:

The government usually put out a press release announcing a successful test. Makes you wonder why they didn't put one out in this case, maybe something to do with the impending vote on the matter in which Mrs May made an impassioned speech of how wonderful the system was.

 

Also Theresa May was asked four times by Andrew Marr if she knew about it this morning and didn't answer the question. She even went to the length of blaming Jeremy Corbyn for it, which I'm sure suprised him when he got home after tending to his pumpkin patch.

Again, clearly not in the national interest to declare out nuclear deterrent has any flaws whatsoever.  The Sunday Times should be ashamed of themselves.

 

May didnt blame Corbyn, she merely pointed out in her deflection of the question that Trident is essential and Corbyn doesn't think we need it.

[Guest MattP]

https://order-order.com/2017/01/23/another-awkward-corbyn-train-journey/

 

[Alf Bentley]

58 minutes ago, MattP said:

https://order-order.com/2017/01/23/another-awkward-corbyn-train-journey/

 

 

Is he in shot there anywhere? At first, I thought it was him on the right, joining in the singing. 

 

If he's not there, how do we know that they've not taken against Jeremy Irons or Jeremy Clarkson?

Or one of their mates might be named Jeremy....possible as they do sound a bit southern in their accents, but maybe they're Liverpool fans from Surrey - or Leicester?

[Guest MattP]

17 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

Is he in shot there anywhere? At first, I thought it was him on the right, joining in the singing. 

 

If he's not there, how do we know that they've not taken against Jeremy Irons or Jeremy Clarkson?

Or one of their mates might be named Jeremy....possible as they do sound a bit southern in their accents, but maybe they're Liverpool fans from Surrey - or Leicester?

I went to Liverpool on boxing day last year, I met more Norwegians than scousers.

 

I can't see him on the video, I'm sure he was chuckling anyway, only a bit of fun.

[Guest MattP]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/20/exclusive-labour-set-lose-copeland-by-election-partys-canvass/

 

If true it's surely the beginning of the end for Corbyn, you can't lose seats like this and then carry on as if nothing is wrong.

 

 

Quote

 

Jeremy Corbyn is set to become the first official opposition leader to lose a by-election to the Government in 35 years, according to the Labour Party’s own canvass returns. 

The Telegraph understands internal analysis of more than 10,000 conversations with voters in Copeland, the Cumbrian constituency, shows Labour’s support down by a third since 2015. 

A senior Labour source said Mr Corbyn’s “incompetence” as a political leader is coming up repeatedly on the doorstep when discussing voting intention. 

The returns suggest that the Tories will take Copeland – a seat held by Labour for 80 years – when voters pick their new MP next month. 

It would be the first time the Government has won a seat off the official opposition since the Tories took Mitcham and Morden, London, in 1982.