catfordfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 I think the role of Shakespeare in all this is crucial, and possibly more important than the whole 'player rebellion' narrative. Fine, we can all agree that the players, especially the 'stars' have been atrocious this season, both in performance and general attitude. But Shakespeare is widely admired within the game, and has been with us throughout all our achievements from League 1 to winning the title. If he's fallen out with Ranieri to the extent that is being suggested, there was clearly something seriously wrong - are we saying that he's got an attitude problem, become too big for his boots too? The thing is that the Ranieri we see via the media - genial, funny, nice old grandpa etc - was always a media construct, which ranieri himself has created in order to fend off 'the sharks'. In many ways its a work of creative genius. There is no way he is like that within the club, neither last season nor this. You think you can manage 30 20-30 year old working class men by being Mr Cuddly the whole time? No chance. Some of the articles giving the backgroudn to all this have mentioned the players getting fed up with Ranieri's temper, as well as the last minute tactical changes etc. If he has alienated Shakespeare as well, the problem is clearly deeper than just arrogant players. None of this takes anything away from Ranieri's achievements, nor am i suggesting that he's two faced - he clearly is a very nice man most of the time, and i would support any campaign to get the guy a statue. Nor is this all his fault - what's sad about the situtation is not so much the sacking as the fact its got to this point. Recruitment last summer was the real killer - if we had more strnegth in depth, then it wouldnt matter if he fell out with some players, because we'd have others of equal ability to bring in. We clearly don't, and Rudkin (and indeed Steve Walsh, given most of the players we signed were scouted under his watch) must take as much, if not most, of the blame. But to cast Ranieri as some kind of 'Bambi' figure here and the players as evil mercenaries doesn't make any sense to me, unless you're willing to put Shakespeare in the latter category as well, which I'm not willing to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpendenfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Good and thoughtful post that Catford. Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozartfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 The Team and Formation he selects on Monday will speak volumes. If the usual back 4 are retained, then we need someone new like on Tuesday of next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaewbudda Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Something has clearly gone wrong behind the scenes. So many rumours flying around, it's difficult to pinpoint what the main issues are. Tactics? Player resentment over team selection? Man-management? Regarding Ranieri's personality and temperament... He has managed teams for nearly thirty years and many players from the past have spoken warmly about the time that they worked with him. So I don't think he has a Jekyll and Hyde type personality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Costock_Fox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 He's a massive 16/1 to be in charge for 10 matches which is incredible considering he is a genuine option and Rudkin will probably take till May to appoint someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyFromLE Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Bang on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wdywd Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 1 minute ago, Kaewbudda said: Regarding Ranieri's personality and temperament... He has managed teams for nearly thirty years and many players from the past have spoken warmly about the time that they worked with him. So I don't think he has a Jekyll and Hyde type personality. This basically. The absolute incredible gall of any of that back 4 to have complained about the manager who's been loyal to them to a fault Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smr Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 SSN ticker saying Ranieris relationship with Shakespeare had "completely broken down" Explains why Claudio was stood on his own last few games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 7 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said: He's a massive 16/1 to be in charge for 10 matches which is incredible considering he is a genuine option and Rudkin will probably take till May to appoint someone else. Surely the owners are wise and will have someone in place already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowlattsFox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 I'm not expecting much different team selection wise on Monday. I think it will be Gray in for Musa and then the same team as Seville. It could just take Shakespeare bringing the squad back together to keep us up and there's a good chance he will get the job. It'd be a gamble but I'd prefer that than some of the names mentioned, in the short term at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sol thewall Bamba Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 He's a capable man, at the very least he'll pick players on merit and get them going until we can get a full timer in, hopefully he sticks around whoever comes in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Costock_Fox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 3 minutes ago, Shaneb said: Surely the owners are wise and will have someone in place already. You would think so but it's worth the gamble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sol thewall Bamba Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 9 minutes ago, Shaneb said: Surely the owners are wise and will have someone in place already. The Merc have said we don't have anyone lined up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaewbudda Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 9 minutes ago, Wdywd said: This basically. The absolute incredible gall of any of that back 4 to have complained about the manager who's been loyal to them to a fault Spot on. He's been too loyal to some of his players and ultimately, that has probably cost him his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaewbudda Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 8 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said: He's a capable man, at the very least he'll pick players on merit and get them going until we can get a full timer in, hopefully he sticks around whoever comes in. I hope you're right and he does pick players on merit. It will also be interesting to see how he sets the team up tactically. Will the full backs be allowed to step over the half way line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norwichfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 5 minutes ago, Kaewbudda said: Spot on. He's been too loyal to some of his players and ultimately, that has probably cost him his job. And the loyalty got him the equivalent of a lottery win on Thursday.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayday Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 5 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said: The Merc have said we don't have anyone lined up. The merc will be the last to know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayday Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 1 minute ago, Kaewbudda said: I hope you're right and he does pick players on merit. It will also be interesting to see how he sets the team up tactically. Will the full backs be allowed to step over the half way line? This will be crucial, if we bring a manager in who likes tippy tappy football, we will be relegated, we just don't have that type of players here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HankMarvin Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Now they will have to do it for Craig Shakespeare, the highly-regarded coach sidelined by Ranieri in recent months. That was one of the Italian’s biggest errors. When Ranieri started to take an increasing role on the training pitches, Shakespeare become marginalised. He has been on the fringes, a diminishing dressing-room influence as Ranieri tried everything to motivate the players. Nothing worked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fox Covert Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Good post. I hope Shakespeare is part of the new set up whatever it is. However many of the players who have massively let the club down are reported as being loyal to him and they are also part of the problem. Shakespeare has to assert his authority immediately and make clear to the players that even if they think he is their friend he will do what is best for the club. One thing he could do rightaway is change the captain. The only realistic candidate is Kasper. It's sad for Morgan however his leadership on the pitch has always been down to example and he has never looked vocal enough for me. Also I would think that this is likely to be his last season as an automatic choice at the top level, he is not one for the future. The other thing he should do is clamp down on media statements and twitter etc. Not sure it should be banned completely but make it clear to the players that they are all being watched and anything less than total commitment to the cause - getting the club out of the relegation mess they are in - and they are out. Not sure that Shakespeare is the right No. 1 long term however I do think that the commitment and amazing teamwork and discipline last season is largely due to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raw Dykes Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 51 minutes ago, mozartfox said: The Team and Formation he selects on Monday will speak volumes. If the usual back 4 are retained, then we need someone new like on Tuesday of next week. I get it, and I agree that they need breaking up, but I think Shakey might give them one last chance to prove their worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzell Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 I'd rather let Shakey take control until the end of the season tbh. With the names being spouted out as potential replacements of Ranieri not one really sticks out imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozartfox Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 15 minutes ago, Raw Dykes said: I get it, and I agree that they need breaking up, but I think Shakey might give them one last chance to prove their worth. Not sure we have the luxury of further attempts at fielding a failed experiment. A point and a goal is the minimum return from this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bennytwohats Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 Maybe we should have sacked Shakespeare then? also at the fact all our players are 'working class' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hazels shorts Posted 24 February 2017 Share Posted 24 February 2017 56 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said: The Merc have said we don't have anyone lined up. The Mercury are totally clueless and no longer have journalists. Bunch of half wits that read through twitter, message boards and on-line papers and report the stories as their own later. Gutter press Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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