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Pinkman

Depression

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I say something like I'm fine then get the response don't overdo it. I wonder if the expect me to go waltzing in whisling a happy tune. If I said I was feeling shit they may say 'feck off then you miserable sod.

But I must emphasise  these are people that I know and who know me and would offer support if I was really down.

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That's the thing; you can be all openly positive and happy (something I'm very good at incidentally) but eventually it gets to the point where you realise that nobody really knows you because they only ever see this false persona you put on to paper over the cracks.  In my experience it just leads to a feeling of isolation even amongst company because you're trying to participate in this happy universe which doesn't exist while all the negative thoughts swirl around loudly in the background and nobody seems to care about it despite them being so blatantly obvious to you.  But of course they can't notice it when you're constantly elaborating on how great everything is and smiling.

 

That's another reason I've been reticent to enter this thread; I'd be mortified if I caused anyone to relapse with my inclination to point out how pointless it all is at each and every juncture in discussions like this. Don't get me wrong this is cathartic; at times I feel a lot like a real-life Marvin the Paranoid Android where I simply exist to notice how depressing and futile everything is (minus the massive brainpower) only I very rarely express it because nobody wants to hear that shit. But I've become quite adept at living with the daily realisation that I serve no purpose at all, not even to the current generations of humans on this planet, and I don't like the idea of somebody who still has a sense of self-worth reading my words and thinking "oh god he's right"!  Hopefully I just sound a bit crazy and far less logical than I think once I get going - indeed one final reason (for this comment anyway) I avoid this place is because I have so many neuroses to draw on that it soon becomes like the Joker back stories where one contradicts another and since I'm not actively seeking help, just struggling on with the daily grind and keeping it pushed down hoping for some kind of miracle to seize, there's little need to clutter these pages with my confusing, depressing drivel while other people are genuinely trying to get help improving their lives.

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As other have mentioned, if you are a weed smoker, one thing is for sure, that is doing absolutely no favours to your mental health. You telling yourself it's helping you cope is what is part of the problem.

 

From personal experience I know how difficult it is to stop, but once you've flushed it all out of your system, which can take months depending on how much you were smoking and for how long, you actually start to feel normal again, and find it much more easy to cope with everything. Get yourself down the gym as well, give yourself something to do other than sitting around on your own all day and night. Also RING PEOPLE, pretty much anybody you can think of that will give you the time of day, get out there and do stuff, anything to just get you out of your house.

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As other have mentioned, if you are a weed smoker, one thing is for sure, that is doing absolutely no favours to your mental health. You telling yourself it's helping you cope is what is part of the problem.

 

From personal experience I know how difficult it is to stop, but once you've flushed it all out of your system, which can take months depending on how much you were smoking and for how long, you actually start to feel normal again, and find it much more easy to cope with everything. Get yourself down the gym as well, give yourself something to do other than sitting around on your own all day and night. Also RING PEOPLE, pretty much anybody you can think of that will give you the time of day, get out there and do stuff, anything to just get you out of your house.

Believe me I get the whole stop smoking argument, problem is when I'm sober I only fixate more on all my insufficiencies and still make no further progress towards solving them - back at uni one time I made a big deal of quitting and got rid of all my supplies and equipment to make sure I wouldn't relapse and managed over a full month dry but after the initial surge in initiative (brought on more by what led to the decision to stop in the first place rather than a lack of THC imo - in this case I wanted to try and be less closed off and more open with the people I considered friends and thought that if I wasn't numbing my brain so much I might improve in that regard) the same sense of isolation quickly returned because my social deficiencies still existed and the people around me all still demonstrated the same levels of ambivalence towards me, so one night I went back to my dealer who was obviously more than pleased to oblige and went back to the flat to get stoned.  Not a single of my so called friends queried it.  When nobody seems to care how your life plays out either way and nobody seems pleased with the effort you're making, shows support for your decision, or expresses any concern when you fall down again making it devastatingly clear you're fated to eternally existing on the periphery of every society you encounter then it makes more sense, to me to at least, to do so without the unwelcome sober thoughts screaming away in your mind making you constantly fixate on problems you can't solve and so I choose to numb the thought processes until something gives, if it ever does.

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As others have said, go to your GP, get referred to a specialist - as you've mentioned suicidal thoughts, they'll be straight onto getting you some specialist help.

Speaking from experience, often the best option is to stick on the course - but then, not always. The problem is that when you're in the middle of it, it's difficult to see whether the problems you're having with the course are because of the course itself, or are just another symptom of the depression. I think getting some counselling and discussing it with them would be a good idea before making any final decision on that.

There's definitely value in trying to get your mind onto external things, but there's a big difference between that and just suppressing it - getting out and exercising is a good thing. It's usually recommended as a thing for mild cases, as getting outside is easier then, but I don't see how it could hurt.

You don't even need to go to a GP nowadays. You can self refer. I did a few weeks ago and I've got my first appointment on Friday albeit by telephone.

I'll look for the number- they're based in Leicestershire

01158760157

Edited by The Year Of The Fox
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Believe me I get the whole stop smoking argument, problem is when I'm sober I only fixate more on all my insufficiencies and still make no further progress towards solving them - back at uni one time I made a big deal of quitting and got rid of all my supplies and equipment to make sure I wouldn't relapse and managed over a full month dry but after the initial surge in initiative (brought on more by what led to the decision to stop in the first place rather than a lack of THC imo - in this case I wanted to try and be less closed off and more open with the people I considered friends and thought that if I wasn't numbing my brain so much I might improve in that regard) the same sense of isolation quickly returned because my social deficiencies still existed and the people around me all still demonstrated the same levels of ambivalence towards me, so one night I went back to my dealer who was obviously more than pleased to oblige and went back to the flat to get stoned.  Not a single of my so called friends queried it.  When nobody seems to care how your life plays out either way and nobody seems pleased with the effort you're making, shows support for your decision, or expresses any concern when you fall down again making it devastatingly clear you're fated to eternally existing on the periphery of every society you encounter then it makes more sense, to me to at least, to do so without the unwelcome sober thoughts screaming away in your mind making you constantly fixate on problems you can't solve and so I choose to numb the thought processes until something gives, if it ever does.

 

How long have you been smoking for just out of interest?

 

For me it was probably about 8 years, and it took a good 3 months before I felt like it was actually out of my system, those three months were ridiculously difficult and I almost gave up multiple times, I also stopped smoking cigarettes at the same time which probably made the whole process harder.

 

It looks like you stopped for the right reason, but as you didn't see any support from the people around you it caused you to relapse. The one thing I'll say about that is I generally didn't see any support from people either, it wasn't until those three months had passed and people who weren't in my weed smoking group of friends started commenting on how more social I seemed that it started to actually sink in that I'd done the right thing, not one of my old circle of friends I smoked with gave me a pat on the back and well done though, I think most of them were just disappointed they couldn't use my house as a ganja smoking club any more, and the dealers, who were actually good friends of mine, didn't even bother speaking to me any more.

 

Another thing you will most likely see if you do manage to stop is that the people that you are looking at and thinking 'man I wish my life was that cool' are more than likely in a worse situation than you are, they just have a better way of hiding it. At some point they are going to be in the same boat as you, and will more than likely come to you for support as they finally realise they need to drag themselves out of this hole if they want to make something of themselves too. There was nothing more satisfying for me than one of the people I thought had it all coming up to me and saying 'I wish I could do what you did, can you offer me some advice?'.

Edited by MrSpaM
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About 8 years now Spam.  And Daggers that was fuching beautiful, like really I'm tearing up here. In fact both you guys have bowled me over with those posts; I never expected such understanding, I'm deeply awed and humbled.  For many reasons I simply can't see myself quitting in the near future but I feel pretty clear right now that my end goal definitely is to one day no longer feel that need to fall back on it and reading what you guys wrote makes me that bit more hopeful that it's not an entirely unreasonable thought to have. Thanks both of you, I don't really know what else to say, wow.

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Depression is a shit, but there is a way out. It's not easy, but it gets better.

I've mentioned before on a similar thread, I was falsely accused of rape, had a great wife and 2 kids, tore us apart.

I contemplated suicide quite a lot, thankfully the police saw sense and I was exonerated. But my life was still in tatters.

My mates stood by me and were very worried about me, I moved in with them as I had nowhere else to go.

Found something I wanted to do and work towards, I've moved away and I'm trying to make something of myself.

Got a brilliant new girlfriend and things are good.

Still have shit days and get low, but the highs are more than the lows.

I know it's not easy and I'm not gloating that things are good now, just telling you about a positive experience to show it can, and will, get better.

Tell people, not just the doctor (which is important), but friends too. You'll be pleasantly surprised by their response.

I wouldn't be here without my really good mates.

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I think it is much easier to explain if your depression is a reaction to a life event, that you can point to and people can empathise with. Not belittling your experiences at all, but one of the things I find hard to explain, even to closest family, is why when on the face of it I have a successful life in terms of family, career and home, I feel so low at times.

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About 8 years now Spam.  And Daggers that was fuching beautiful, like really I'm tearing up here. In fact both you guys have bowled me over with those posts; I never expected such understanding, I'm deeply awed and humbled.  For many reasons I simply can't see myself quitting in the near future but I feel pretty clear right now that my end goal definitely is to one day no longer feel that need to fall back on it and reading what you guys wrote makes me that bit more hopeful that it's not an entirely unreasonable thought to have. Thanks both of you, I don't really know what else to say, wow.

 

Numbing is what we do, self-medication becomes a way of life.

 

Name the drug and I can tell you tales of doing it to excess in order to promote the feeling of the manic periods, but resulting in prolonging the depressive episodes. To dull the sense of an all-consuming emptiness. Or obliterating it with ridiculous levels of self-destructive behaviour.

 

You can't quit until you're ready or want to, but that involves being honest with yourself. The only person who knows what's best for you...is you.

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Would many employers help those who are suffering from anxiety and/or depression?

 

I don't believe that there's much support available for staff in many companies currently if they need advice/help on this, with apparently staff absenteeism being on the rise.

Edited by Wymeswold fox
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Only just seen this. So many things on here ring true I could probably quote every comment and relate to it. 

 

I can relate to Pinkman, I've been to University twice and the first time I left because I just couldn't cope. I'd been feeling down, the work had got too much I'd had a few bad results and felt backed into a corner for fighting so hard to just get a respectable grade or just leave. In the end I decided to leave. I'd say it was a very difficult few years that followed but on reflection the bad decisions were made before I went. Thankfully I went back a second time and completed my degree last summer although it wasn't without issue. 

 

There are also comments about not being able to explain it to anyone and silence seeming a better option. People, parents and so on just not understanding. The amount of times I have tried and we both just end up getting frustrated so I don't try anymore. 

 

There is a cruel catch-22 with depression which I believe has also been mentioned at least what I have found in regard to getting help. One of the symptoms is a deep lack of motivation, in order to get help you need to feel motivated to get up and go to the doctors however you don't because you feel demotivated. The times you are feeling motivated you feel no reason to visit the doctor because you feel fine. 

 

I still find my mood can change at the drop of a hat. I haven't really spoken to friends about it but often I'll be laughing and joking and decide enough is enough and I'm starting to feel a little anxious and abruptly tell everyone I'm going to go home.  

 

I only realized about 6 months ago for the last 10 years I haven't been sleeping right. I've been going to bed at normal times but quality of sleep has been so poor. Lately I've been working on improving this. 

 

Everyday things that have HELPED! 

  • Exercising regularly
  • Meditating - helps you to see things clearly when your mind is all cloudy 
  • Cutting out alcohol - barely drink now just makes me feel dreadful. 
  • Eating well, eating a great diet lots of healthy vegetables. Eating junk makes you feel like junk!
  • Reading - helped be discover topics i'd barely even heard of and now have developed an interest in these areas 

 

 

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Everyday things that have HELPED! 

  • Exercising regularly
  • Meditating - helps you to see things clearly when your mind is all cloudy 
  • Cutting out alcohol - barely drink now just makes me feel dreadful. 
  • Eating well, eating a great diet lots of healthy vegetables. Eating junk makes you feel like junk!
  • Reading - helped be discover topics i'd barely even heard of and now have developed an interest in these areas 

 

 

I hated meditation. I decided I'd try anything and everything to find a way but sitting still simply allowed me to dwell on introspective nonsense. Riding a motorbike and karate is how I found a way to discover my state of Zen. But the food and alcohol things are a given...but then treats are valid too. I like a drink and adore chips now and then so there was no way I was cutting them from my life.

 

As I said above, there's no clear cut way to coping. It all comes down to making baby steps to recovery based on an awareness of self and what works for the individual. So much of the advice I've been given I junked but I was always willing to try it out first.

 

The mania is the only tricky bit as I feel so damn awesome during those periods. The wife has a safe word she'll drop into conversation now just to let me know I'm going off on one; and I breath. Breathing and switching to a calming activity in place of drugs has allowed me to regain control of my mind.

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Would many employers help those who are suffering from anxiety and/or depression?

 

I don't believe that there's much support available for staff in many companies currently if they need advice/help on this, with apparently staff absenteeism being on the rise.

The government seems to think that getting a job will help those on long term sickness with depression/mental issues.  But saying it and achieving it are two different things. The employer has to have an understanding of what support is needed as do work colleagues. Withholding or reducing benefits will only make a person more anxious or depressed if there is no counter support outside or inside a workplace.

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I hated meditation. I decided I'd try anything and everything to find a way but sitting still simply allowed me to dwell on introspective nonsense. Riding a motorbike and karate is how I found a way to discover my state of Zen. But the food and alcohol things are a given...but then treats are valid too. I like a drink and adore chips now and then so there was no way I was cutting them from my life.

 

As I said above, there's no clear cut way to coping. It all comes down to making baby steps to recovery based on an awareness of self and what works for the individual. So much of the advice I've been given I junked but I was always willing to try it out first.

 

The mania is the only tricky bit as I feel so damn awesome during those periods. The wife has a safe word she'll drop into conversation now just to let me know I'm going off on one; and I breath. Breathing and switching to a calming activity in place of drugs has allowed me to regain control of my mind.

Yeah I guess not for everyone, it's good to get other peoples perspective. Some home truths hit me like a freight train during meditation. They were things I knew but probably wouldn't have allowed my conscious mind to tell me. 

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  • 1 month later...

Hi all.

 

Do you have to be a parent to call a school's SENCO and request help? My brother has in the past year or so gone through several periods of what appear like more than just 'down days.' He'll stay in bed for days, won't talk to anyone, won't reach out and it's killing me because I can't do anything. Recently found he'd be cutting himself, albeit they weren't too serious but the fact he did it is serious enough. He could snap out of it tomorrow, or it could be a week long thing, who knows but I don't know what to do. My mum is busy, she works a lot and doesn't seem to recognise the full extent of it but I'm at home a lot more and do. His Dad isn't around so I feel a sense of importance here being his older brother. He needs an operation on his back soon, which is long overdue after about a year or so of terrible back pain when he walks, which is obviously a big thing and may be causing some of this depression but I think my mum believes this feeling he has will vanish once he's had the op. I don't. He's got a whole lot on the go.

 

So I want to contact his school's SENCO for him but he's not going to have that discussion with me or my mum, he won't talk to us about how he feels or anything. Do I do it anyway? He went to a GP but they did nothing to help, absolutely nothing. He missed an appointment because he stayed in bed during his last bout and we didn't get so much as a response, great help they were.

 

So yeah, I don't really know what I'm asking. What would you do I guess? It's really difficult because I don't want to go against his back and break trust but I don't want to do nothing either because I feel like something needs to be done. This isn't just typical teenage behaviour.

Edited by Ozwin
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.

 

As I said above, there's no clear cut way to coping. It all comes down to making baby steps to recovery based on an awareness of self and what works for the individual.

This is spectacularly accurate. Speaking both as a doctor and as someone who has experienced persistent depressed mood I think this is wonderful and will perhaps start to say exactly this to my patient.

I believe depression is actually a term applied to a wide range of disorders. You've got the psychiatric at one end; the sort of catastrophic chemical low mood that comes with a psychiatric disorder such as bipolar or schizoaffective disorder. At the other end and far more common is a very behavioural thing, in my opinion. For a wide variety of reasons people get into spirals of reacting negatively to an experience (sometimes hugely justifiably) and develop poor coping strategies, which lead them to miss opportunities for positivity in their life which lowers their self esteem, leading to further avoidance tactics and a continual decline.

I see a lot of depression in ED and it can be terribly sad at either end of that scale. There are a huge number of people who simply no longer have the capability to positively react to life and have developed this role of a "depressed person" and have serious problems with chronic pain, fatigue and illness. I don't mean that disparagingly, the circumstances of that decline are extremely varied. I do believe our quick fix, instant gratification society does lend itself to this form of poor coping with the harshness in life in a lot of cases but that's a very simplistic view. Recurrent deliberate self harm is often attributed to a need for control and I think that's often true but sadly I think there are a lot of people who are stuck in a cycle of fear, poor decisions and regret and desperately want to be "fixed". Fundamentally, this form of depression is extremely hard to treat.

@@Ozwin, the most important thing you can do for your brother is try to support him to understand what it is he's reacting like this to. I agree that doctors can be really terrible at treating this; partly because I don't think it's an illness as such, more a pattern of behaviour. That's why it responds so much better to interpersonal therapy. What's your relationship with him like? Is it possible for him to open up to you?

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His friends from college and on Xbox Live are usually a source of comfort. When he's having a good day the difference is incredible, laughing, joking and having a blast but then there's like this weekend where he's barely got out of bed or even eaten. Obviously none of my family are counselors or know what to say or do, so we tend to check in now and again but there's not much we can do when there's no responses to anything. I think support is needed. It's been going on for a year at least now and it's not getting any better by itself. 

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