Nick Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 So without wishing to get all dramatic, there does seem to be a bit of a movement happening - a sort of uprising. Corbyn and his manifesto seems to have mobilised large numbers of young people but I kinda think its spreading in a way which I can't quite put my finger on yet...n I've been in London this week and left two venues at around midnight hearing chants of "OOOhhh Jeremy Corrrrrrbyn, OOOOh Jeremy Corrrrbyn" which surprised me as here in Britain we don't really sing about politics a whole lot after a few beers... That evening the fire broke out which I sat and watched live from 1.30am on the news - still a little wired after the gig and since then, the petitions for an inquest rather than a public inquiry, the accusations toward May of her lack of humanity and the media pushing hard on public sector privatisation, austerity, poverty and cuts to services are really being hammered out. I was out in Leicester last night and was hearing lots of talk about social care being squeezed to breaking point and probation, police and youth offending unable to cope after 5 years of constant cuts - the theme being, that the lowest paid, unqualified staff now employed by private and public sector agencies were managing the the highest risk cases and individuals with limited experience and expertise to do so safely and defensibly... And this on the back of a Brexit fuelled youth who feel polarised and angry at the way the world (Trump, Putin, ISIS et al) and the country is shaping up - a few commentators say that this last election has changed politics forever due to the youth vote being mobilised... I've just seen Lilly Allen, (Yep, I know) talking about being disgusted at the reporting on the fire as (we all know it'll be well over 100 dead and it'll be likely down to something akin to private housing associations cutting costs for profit or somebody doing something on the cheap...) they (News Broadcasts) are drip feeding the death toll to play it down... 12 then 17 then 30 dead.... Now I hear JC's appearing at Glastonbury for the love of... Hopefully May will headline the main stage at Reading in retort. And whilst these events all seem a bit weakly linked and a bit sketchy - I remember the build and the air in 2011 in London and it feels quite similar at the moment in some ways... I think there's going to be some real ridiculousness coming this year I hope its not violent and I hope its dealt with sensibly but I feel more than the youth are fed up and prepared to stand up for themselves, or it least demonstrate their distain for the current climate - I think there's a lot of people from all backgrounds and classes that are simmering with frustration right now. I just thought I'd chuck this out there and readily expect it to get ridiculed but the landscape is shifting in my opinion and the air feels, well.... different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Barry Hammond Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 This is over dramatic... but there's been a bubbling of a revolution for a while and the French Revolution really kicked off following a 'class incident'. Not for one moment suggesting a commoner army is suddenly going to go round expelling the Queen and other wealthy land owners and reclaim them for people, but there is clearly the need for some kind of political upheaval. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 It's possible, but as I'm somewhat cynical on the matter I'm bound to say that there have been several such false dawns before. Only time will tell, but as I tend to bang the drum about most folks are focused on the wrong issues long term anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Oxlong Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 I've thought this before. But then the young became taxpayers ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzy Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 16 June 2017 Author Share Posted 16 June 2017 7 minutes ago, DJ Barry Hammond said: This is over dramatic... but there's been a bubbling of a revolution for a while and the French Revolution really kicked off following a 'class incident'. Not for one moment suggesting a commoner army is suddenly going to go round expelling the Queen and other wealthy land owners and reclaim them for people, but there is clearly the need for some kind of political upheaval. Apologies - it's not meant to be, you see it's not just about the young and the tower block fire has kinda indirect 9-11 connotations.... which is a bit wild I know but all I'm saying is that it all tastes a bit different at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie1999 Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 14 minutes ago, Mike Oxlong said: I've thought this before. But then the young became taxpayers ...... And that's where your life ends and you become part of the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiberalFox Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 It's Corbyn's stated strategy coming to fruition. It's surprising perhaps how successful he's been, but he's doing exactly what he said he wanted to do. Engaging younger voters and building up a large grassroots activist base. It remains to be seen whether it will actually deliver him to power and whether it will be a success, I suspect there will be a backlash when he inevitably doesn't make the world perfect, a bit like in the USA where people thought Obama would be able to cure racism and entrenched poverty almost overnight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Oxlong Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 1 minute ago, yorkie1999 said: And that's where your life ends and you become part of the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James. Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 I think you're spot on. I think it's quite distinct from 2011 in that the people who are frustrated are a much wider population and of much more varying class, age, etc. Social media is playing a huge part in stoking it as well. Despite my comment in the other thread about social media being our downfall, in the short term I think it's playing a great role in getting a very different side of the story out there compared to the usual right wing press dominance. We certainly saw that in the election. Jeremy Corbyn is sitting pretty in my view. Tories will likely get savaged either before or during Brexit negotiations. Support for Corbyn from this newly engaged youth will continue to grow and we'll have a socialist government in power within a couple of years. Maybe. The real problems might come after that though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 Fake outrage. People who don't know what they are on about but feel they need to have view, I'm all for it if they research, but generally it really is simply people arguing to feel important or valued, social media has gave them a voice and they need to use it, whether they're a sheep or not. It's boring to be quite honest because nothing will change, they will just be outraged for the sake of being outraged. I'm all for change but nothing will change. Actions speak louder than words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramboacdc Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 corbyn spoke at last years glasto. proof: I watched him counter proof: I was twatted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie1999 Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 5 minutes ago, James. said: I think you're spot on. I think it's quite distinct from 2011 in that the people who are frustrated are a much wider population and of much more varying class, age, etc. Social media is playing a huge part in stoking it as well. Despite my comment in the other thread about social media being our downfall, in the short term I think it's playing a great role in getting a very different side of the story out there compared to the usual right wing press dominance. We certainly saw that in the election. Jeremy Corbyn is sitting pretty in my view. Tories will likely get savaged either before or during Brexit negotiations. Support for Corbyn from this newly engaged youth will continue to grow and we'll have a socialist government in power within a couple of years. Maybe. The real problems might come after that though... Yes, when they tax the haves in order to pay for the have nots, because that's what it's all about at the end of the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James. Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 Just now, Matt said: Fake outrage. People who don't know what they are on about but feel they need to have view, I'm all for it if they research, but generally it really is simply people arguing to feel important or valued, social media has gave them a voice and they need to use it, whether they're a sheep or not. It's boring to be quite honest because nothing will change, they will just be outraged for the sake of being outraged. I'm all for change but nothing will change. Actions speak louder than words. Quite clearly in the election actions followed through from words and social media had a big part to play. I think you're naïve if you think this is just a bunch of people who don't know what they're talking about. "I'm all for change but nothing will change" are not the words of someone who is really all for change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voll Blau Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 Well, the left seem to have all the best chants right now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScouseFox Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 corbyn's done an insane job of stoking up passion and making young, poor, undervalued people feel like they have a voice. social media is a big part as stated. a massive amount of 16-25 year olds get their news off twitter etc, it's given them a platform to shout and feel recognised even if their knowledge is limited or their points are wrong. brexit mattered, too. nobody who's got a future wanted brexit and there's a lot of people who realise they didn't do enough to stop it and now want to do all they can to make waves "next time". about time for it all, too. viva la revolucion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScouseFox Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 3 minutes ago, Voll Blau said: Well, the left seem to have all the best chants right now... recognise a few chaps in that. up the labour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirkster the Fox Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 Yes things have shifted and JC / IM et all, have caught a flame, capture a feeling with the younger voters and with the help of the media have certainly milked their message. Perhaps the game has changed and the politics of old is changing and that is fair game, as long as its democratically done. Its a fine line though, between a New Movement and an anarchic agenda? McDonald's appeal for a Million to march on Parliament to "Remove May from Government" on the 1st July is promoting potential anarchy on our streets. Protest for sure, dissatisfaction must have a forum, but doing it to overrule a democratically voted outcome is not just a New Movement, its very dangerous for the UK. Labour came second, they lost with 800,000 less votes than the largest party. Democracy is the linchpin off our country/society and what we see unfolding at the moment has worrying undertones. If those feeling anger towards the status quo think its really that bad, they should look at the plight of the many millions living in dictatorships across the world who are literally dying to live in our world. I think a sense of perspective is needed by some. Issues with our society yes, can be debated yes, change can be argued certainly, but our country is nowhere near a state of destitution/lawlessness warranting an anarchic approach. If you think marching to overthrow a government that by Saturday 1st July should have passed a Queens Speech is good and correct, then you must fear for the future. Your country would be in a bad place. JC / IM et al, know this is feeling is at its highest, fever pitch and are desperate to grab the power now. 38 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said: The media pushing hard on public sector privatisation, austerity, poverty and cuts to services are really being hammered out. Yep the BBC are really going for it, gloves off. The BBC are making the news, not reporting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 14 minutes ago, James. said: Quite clearly in the election actions followed through from words and social media had a big part to play. I think you're naïve if you think this is just a bunch of people who don't know what they're talking about. "I'm all for change but nothing will change" are not the words of someone who is really all for change. I think you've misunderstood me. The words and social media have had a big part to play in who the public's good cop and whos the bad cop. People have demanding change and a supporting change, what I mean is even if things do change in terms or parties/leadership, they will get nothing done, nothing will change, their hands are tied, they may promise you things, they'll promise the world to get you to support them, vote for them but I doubt they will actually do it, even if they do bring the promises to power the are 'borrowing' money to bring these 'promises' they'll be left short elsewhere and it'll create a problem there, people will moan, people will (fake) outrage. In brief back in 2009 - 10ish I did get quite involved, took interest because I was being ****ed over, everyone was, things 'changed', parties 'changed', but what actually changed? Nothing. Disillusioned is the word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl the Llama Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 3 minutes ago, Dirkster the Fox said: Yep the BBC are really going for it, gloves off. The BBC are making the news, not reporting it. What are you on about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surrifox Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 This is England - we don't do this shit . Plus the young ( I know because I used to be one) have a notoriously short attention span and will move on to the next big thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Foxin_mad Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 Anyone who drinks Starbucks, uses Facebook and has a iPhone is nothing more than a phoney socialist at best. If you really want action stop using that shit and funding the big corporations who pay no tax in this country. Actions....... Seeing Lilly Allen in her hideous designer clothes, spewing shit, clutching a Starbucks and taking a selfie is everything wrong with the modern world. How much has she contributed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 30 minutes ago, ScouseFox said: corbyn's done an insane job of stoking up passion and making young, poor, undervalued people feel like they have a voice. social media is a big part as stated. a massive amount of 16-25 year olds get their news off twitter etc, it's given them a platform to shout and feel recognised even if their knowledge is limited or their points are wrong. brexit mattered, too. nobody who's got a future wanted brexit and there's a lot of people who realise they didn't do enough to stop it and now want to do all they can to make waves "next time". about time for it all, too. viva la revolucion. Who will they turn on when they realise he can't do 10% of what he says and as always, runs out of other people's money? Revolutions never work out well for anyone except the leaders. I have a feeling he'll get to be PM one day but it will collapse within months - every generation has to make and then learn from their mistakes when they go for idealism rather than realism, the youth now are no different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Foxin_mad Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 10 minutes ago, MattP said: Who will they turn on when they realise he can't do 10% of what he says and as always, runs out of other people's money? Only 10%!! that's in the world of unicorns and magic money trees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webbo Posted 16 June 2017 Share Posted 16 June 2017 2 Months ago everyone thought Corbyn was a joke and the tories were going to win a landslide. He promises middle class kids free tuition and all of a sudden he's the new messiah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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