Is Shakespeare the right man for the job?

[Ric Flair]

42 minutes ago, SecretPro said:

I'll give Shaky until the end of October to show his current worth. If by that point he isn't utilising our best players, isn't making the right substitutions and isn't adapting our game tactically then I think we will have to look at the situation very closely. Until then, let's just crack on. 

That's where I'm at. I'm disturbed by his tactics and substitutions seemingly getting worse rather than better the longer he's a manager but we could easily pick up some form in the next 4-5 games. We have that ability in the squad but he's got to shake things up, excuse the pun.

 

4-4-2 with what we've currently got available is poor management from him. We've not played well yet this season in the league bar 2/3rds of a game vs Arsenal. We were distinctly mediocre vs Brighton when we won but they were one of the worst teams I've ever seen grace the PL. the lack of change just smacks of being clueless as to what to do. We've other ways of playing surely? With the abundance of attackers and defenders a 3-4-3 or 3-4-1-2 is surely worth a try.

 

I personally think he'll be gone within 2 months, I think the owners will be far less patient than even our fans. Turn it around Craig!!!

[manders86]

I have a horrible feeling that shakey will be gone by Xmas. I think all things considered we were played off the park today.. all be it we were a misskick away from a fortunate 3 points instead of a fortunate 1.

    The midfield situation aside we look short of ideas game after game.. I include the Brighton game in that which I also found lacklustre despite the win. This is a impatient business we are in and games like today had to be 3 points for us. We all seem to accept that mid table should be our expectation. I think many mid table sides will go to Huddersfield and win.

  I hope I'm wrong and i hope shakey does succeed. I suspect he is feeling the pressure already though. We really could do with getting something against Liverpool in the league. 

[DJ Barry Hammond]

 

Here's the problem... our glories of the recent past have gone and so will the players who achieved them in the not to distant future.

 

We therefore need some at the top who starts building anew, much like Claudio did when he took over from Pearson when he moved us to a 442 and evolved our way of playing within that across the season.

 

And this, is perhaps why Shakey is finding things difficult now - he's been too involved in successes of the past that its difficult for him to implement something completely fresh and new.

[chicagofox]

8 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

It's not 5 games though, is it? We were playing the same dross at the end of last season. 

 

Take away the 'new manager bounce' and what you have is relegation form. 

3 wins in 13 in the league.  And no, those 11 games that we didn't win were not all against top teams that we (for some unknown reason) expected to lose to/not to beat.

[car1os]

We didn't look like scoring from open play today. Have to say I was impressed with Huddersfield today, especially their pressing game, but we just couldn't keep it on the floor enough.

 

When Vardy was on, we hit high crosses. When Slimani came on, we played it on the floor! We need to be smarter, build up our passing game, and link midfield and attack better. Hopefully we will settle as a team within a few games, if not Shakey will be gone as we have the players to do it (if the Silva appeal is successful)

[wardyfox86]

I, like most, don't really have an answer on who we can replace him with. All I feel at the moment is we seem a little exclusive. Since Pearson has been here, we've had largely the same influence in the dressing room. It's believed that even CR stuck to the old ways and I went to pot when he tried to change things. Continuity is great if it's a positive influence, but everything around the club seems stale and I feel we need somebody to come in who has different ideas, we're stagnating. 

[Ric Flair]

Our squad is vastly unbalanced. Too many strikers and average defensive midfielders and not enough creative and dynamic players either centrally or at full back. We're too loyal to some of this squad. We need a whole new regime within the next 12-18 months, I'm convinced of it.

[Bryn]

Could have had Silva in the summer.

[Suzie the Fox]

Id be interested to know what would change the mind of you guys calling for Craigs head.. 

 

Being in a top 10 or above position ?

A change in formation, closer to how you would do it? And if so IF he did that and we were still losing games, would that still be ok? 

 

Not trying to stir, just curious to what you think. x 

 

[manders86]

2 minutes ago, Bryn said:

Could have had Silva in the summer.

I thought this the other day.. would have been a great time to remodel the way we play..  today aside he's doing a good job at Watford.

[Sir Shep]

12 minutes ago, DJ Barry Hammond said:

 

Here's the problem... our glories of the recent past have gone and so will the players who achieved them in the not to distant future.

 

We therefore need some at the top who starts building anew, much like Claudio did when he took over from Pearson when he moved us to a 442 and evolved our way of playing within that across the season.

 

And this, is perhaps why Shakey is finding things difficult now - he's been too involved in successes of the past that its difficult for him to implement something completely fresh and new.

That makes sense and sums it up perfectly for me. 

[jayfox26]

After the 2 games against liverpool we have Bournemouth away, wba at home and swansea away. 3 games we should be winning if we want to be finishing mid table. If we fail to get any wins from these games i think he'll be gone. The owners waited a while to sack claudio because we had won the league and were doing well in the champs league but i doubt they will give shakey the same time if things dont pick up. The worry for me is not the results but the performances. If wed have drawn 1-1 today and played them off the park and created lots of chances and been unlucky then fine. But to be outplayed and lucky to get a draw against a newly promoted team, who yes have a lot of team spirit and endeavour, but ultimately are a pretty poor premier league team, is just not good enough. I like Shakespeare and hes been great for the club in the many years hes been here, but i am starting to doubt hes the right man for the job. Regardless of our lack of options in midfield due to silva being out, there are teams like Burnley and Newcastle picking up results with players who are no better than what we have to use. 

[Jimmy]

2 minutes ago, Suzie the Fox said:

Id be interested to know what would change the mind of you guys calling for Craigs head.. 

 

Being in a top 10 or above position ?

A change in formation, closer to how you would do it? And if so IF he did that and we were still losing games, would that still be ok? 

 

Not trying to stir, just curious to what you think. x 

 

something that showed me he is learning, isn't too close to certain players, has the balls to put more than 1 creative winger on the pitch would be a good start

[DJ Barry Hammond]

 

My other feeling on this - to me, Shakey lacks that instant visable stature to be a long term premiership manager.

 

The role of assistant is very different to that of a manager and some are better suited to the former - and for me Shakey comes in this catagory. 

 

Think of past great managers at ours or any club and a common theme is that they've all had a strong presence - which makes sense, a manager has to have a strong mind and act with conviction.

 

In my opinion, Shakey lacks this is abundance - it feels like he's playing at being Manager, trying to do all the things he's seen done before him... but not quite having the same effect. I'm just not convinced by him - and I wonder if the players are starting to feel this too.

 

I'd also question the Appleton pick as assistant as well, given he has been a manager longer than Shakey and so could  be inadvertently undermining him in a way (not intentionally). 

 

The counter argument many will mention is of course the 'time' factor - give him time - yet, try as I might, I can't see Shakey being in the dugout 2/3 years from now, let alone celebrating with a beaming smile as he walks up the Wembley steps - I'd love to proven wrong, but for me, he's not our destined to be great leader.

 

(side point - do it now, while now Roy is out of the equation!)

 

 

Edited 16 September 2017 by DJ Barry Hammond

[jayfox26]

3 minutes ago, Suzie the Fox said:

Id be interested to know what would change the mind of you guys calling for Craigs head.. 

 

Being in a top 10 or above position ?

A change in formation, closer to how you would do it? And if so IF he did that and we were still losing games, would that still be ok? 

 

Not trying to stir, just curious to what you think. x 

 

Just better perfomances where we actually look like we have a plan. If we drew 1-1 today and played really well then fine. Its not the results that are worrying, its the performances 

[chicagofox]

People are allowed to think that Shakespeare should be replaced without knowing who he should be replaced with.  

 

Steve Parish has gotten a lot of heat over the De Boer hiring/sacking.  Yes he made the wrong initial appointment, clearly.  But he saw it wasn't working and having prosumably conducted a thorough recruitment policy he had a replacement already lined up.  (And no I'm not necessarily saying that I wanted Hodgson in charge).

 

I have to wonder what our recruitment policy was over the summer.  That's if there even was one.  Did we consider other candidates?  Did we interview other candidates?  Maybe we did.  Maybe we didn't.  But it seemed all along as though it was a fait accompli that the job was Shakespeare's.

 

My only reservation with relieving him of his duties now is that we would drift for 5/6 weeks with Appleton in charge and were he to win a game or too he would be offered the job.

 

 

[Heymister2015]

5 games gone and Shakespeare out and we have no identity. All of his new signings like to play of the deck. Maguire, Iborra, Silva! ATM we're left with Maguire passing to inept footballers from the previous regime due to Iborra just coming back from Injury and silva being in no man's land. Start judging the manager when he's able to integrate his new style of players into the squad 

[fox_favourite]

34 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

We need to pounce for Harry Redknapp.

The whole of Foxestalk would pounce on you if this happened!! Haha

Edited 16 September 2017 by fox_favourite

[manders86]

6 minutes ago, Suzie the Fox said:

Id be interested to know what would change the mind of you guys calling for Craigs head.. 

 

Being in a top 10 or above position ?

A change in formation, closer to how you would do it? And if so IF he did that and we were still losing games, would that still be ok? 

 

Not trying to stir, just curious to what you think. x 

 

I'm not in the shakey out corner as such I can see it happening. Just out of curiosity what would it take for you to think he's not the right man? At the risk of playing devils advocate.

[DJ Barry Hammond]

1 minute ago, Heymister2015 said:

5 games gone and Shakespeare out and we have no identity. All of his new signings like to play of the deck. Maguire, Iborra, Silva! ATM we're left with Maguire passing to inept footballers from the previous regime due to Iborra just coming back from Injury and silva being in no man's land. Start judging the manager when he's able to integrate his new style of players into the squad 

 

Yes... but for me the Silva issue could well be a signal of the ineptness of leadership within the club.

 

Ok, that might not have been Craig's role directly - but if I was manager, I'd want to have been on top of that transfer and ensure it had gone through.

[Costock_Fox]

5 minutes ago, fox_favourite said:

The whole of Foxestalk would pounce on you if this happened!! Haha

The dream.

[DJ Barry Hammond]

13 minutes ago, Bryn said:

Could have had Silva in the summer.

 

This comment would have looked better at 2:59 today! ?

[DJ Barry Hammond]

41 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

We need to pounce for Harry Redknapp.

 

I've heard we're wheeling out Kevin Keegan from retirement... it's either that or John Gregory

[murphy]

A lot of criticism here and that's OK but also a huge lack of respect from some.

 

He was given the job because he earned it last year.  You have to remember the dire straits we were in when he took over last year.  Relegation was nailed on with CR.  How soon we forget.

 

Shakespeare is someone who has been with us through the whole of what is still the greatest era we have had.  Someone who was thought highly enough of to be brought into the England fold not long ago.  

 

I know we were shit today but we are about where we expected to be given the fixtures.  A home win and away draw against teams that are not title contenders.  

 

Personally I think that the fixtures falling as they have has created pressure for us.  Today we needed something and pressure creates tension.  It makes players cautious trying not to make a mistake rather than trying to express themselves.  We would probably have seen a different game had we 7 or 8 points on the board.

Edited 16 September 2017 by murphy

[Suzie the Fox]

2 minutes ago, manders86 said:

I'm not in the shakey out corner as such I can see it happening. Just out of curiosity what would it take for you to think he's not the right man? At the risk of playing devils advocate.

I am on the same side as you, i think its way to early to judge him. If things dont change by lets say Christmas i may feel differently. 

 

Dont get me wrong i havent initially agreed with the subs he has made in earlier games, but i have been able to see why he made them (well for the majority of them anyway.)  Even though its been against the flow of what others think.

 

Not that this is in anyway an excuse but i really do believe he has been hampered with the amount of injuries we started the season with, and just maybe he has had to do things different to how his initial plans were.