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Safe Standing Roadshow

Safe standing - time to act

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49 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

I warm to Simon Jordan with nearly everything he says these days. Never used to like him but he speaks a lot of sense about a lot of issues.

I'm with you there, though I suspect he'd be infuriating to know.

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"The Government believes that all-seater stadia are currently the best means to ensure the safety and security of fans at designated football matches in England and Wales, while continuing to work closely with the Sports Grounds Safety Authority and football authorities to consider advances in technology and data that may enhance the existing policy."

 

So they may consider advances in technology that will enhance the existing policy of all seater stadia, so in other words, padded seats, because you can't get any better technology for a seat. The only way to get this going is to have a tragic accident at an all seater ground or sack off the current government.

Edited by yorkie1999
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10 hours ago, yorkie1999 said:

"The Government believes that all-seater stadia are currently the best means to ensure the safety and security of fans at designated football matches in England and Wales, while continuing to work closely with the Sports Grounds Safety Authority and football authorities to consider advances in technology and data that may enhance the existing policy."

 

So they may consider advances in technology that will enhance the existing policy of all seater stadia, so in other words, padded seats, because you can't get any better technology for a seat. The only way to get this going is to have a tragic accident at an all seater ground or sack off the current government.

 

Bloody disgrace. 

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Watching Orlando in MLS.  at moment...Not big fan of mls but did go to a few Orlando City games when there on holidays few years ago...Anyway their new stadium has one end of safe standing which they call The Wall...the noise and atmosphere being generated is great even though I would guess 75% of those populating it would be on Mr  Trumps deportation list. ? There’s no doubt it would enhance the atmosphere at matches in Premier League 

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Posted by The FSF 11th May 2018

Government will continue to look at standing issue

This week in Parliament the Government was questioned about standing at football but reiterated that it does “not have any plans at this moment to change” all-seater legislation.

Thursday’s discussion in the House of Commons followed a question submitted by Stockton MP Dr Paul Williams, asking the Department of Culture, Media and Sport for its assessment of dual-purpose seating & standing technologies.

Sports Minister Tracey Crouch said: “The Government believe that all-seater stadiums are currently the best means of ensuring the safety and security of fans at designated football matches in England and Wales.

“But we continue to work with the Sports Grounds Safety Authority to consider advances in technology and data that may enhance the existing policy.”

Crouch added that the Government had been considering advances in technology that “did not require legislative change” to allow their introduction.

Chair of the DCMS Select Committee Damian Collins also asked the minister if she believed a blanket ban on standing areas in the top two flights was appropriate or whether it was better for safety authorities and local authorities to judge on “case by case basis”.

The minister said: “There has been a significant change since the all-seater stadium policy came in and that spectators have evolved, and we now have a much more family-friendly place for people to go to watch football.

“That is not to say that we are not looking at ways in which we can accommodate those who do wish to stand, but we do not have any plans at this moment to change the legislation.”

A full Parliamentary debate on the issue is due to take place in the Commons on Monday 25th after a petition to Government passed 110,000 signatures.

Thanks to UK Parliament for the image used in this article. Reproduced here under Creative Commons license.

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https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/safe-standing-football-will-increase-racial-abuse-claims-labour-mp-120714740.html?guccounter=1

 

Quite remarkable how the most coherent and logical arguments are put forward by fans who want to do terrible things such as stand in a football stadium yet these enlightened people desperately trying fearing anarchy if it allowed arrive at these obvious conclusions such as "people standing up= racist abuse on the rise".

 

Of course, sitting down means you aren't able to do that. Fvcking hell, why are these people given a platform?

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1 hour ago, Corky said:

https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/safe-standing-football-will-increase-racial-abuse-claims-labour-mp-120714740.html?guccounter=1

 

Quite remarkable how the most coherent and logical arguments are put forward by fans who want to do terrible things such as stand in a football stadium yet these enlightened people desperately trying fearing anarchy if it allowed arrive at these obvious conclusions such as "people standing up= racist abuse on the rise".

 

Of course, sitting down means you aren't able to do that. Fvcking hell, why are these people given a platform?

MPs aren't voted in on their knowledge, logical thinking and unbiased thoughts there's no job description, no minimal qualifications of any sort except having dogmatic political view but will say anything to ensure they get voted back into parliament. Unfortunately they're the one's that decide on an ever increasing level our fate.

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2 hours ago, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

You have a very misleading name for that kind of attitude Mr

Perhaps it's his thoughts that are dangerous.

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On 11/05/2018 at 17:15, Corky said:

https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/safe-standing-football-will-increase-racial-abuse-claims-labour-mp-120714740.html?guccounter=1

 

Quite remarkable how the most coherent and logical arguments are put forward by fans who want to do terrible things such as stand in a football stadium yet these enlightened people desperately trying fearing anarchy if it allowed arrive at these obvious conclusions such as "people standing up= racist abuse on the rise".

 

Of course, sitting down means you aren't able to do that. Fvcking hell, why are these people given a platform?

Yes because when I'm sat down my racial views are ignored by how comfy I am sitting down. Minute I stand up, they are just let loose

 

Why are these people given power?

Edited by UniFox21
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EkQY3Sh.jpg

 

Quote

Work has begun on making Shrewsbury Town Football Club the first club in England and Wales to install Safe Standing. 

In 2017, £65,000 was raised for the Supporters’ Parliament-led initiative which will see 555 rail seats placed into the Salop Leisure South Stand. 

The rail seats have been made by local company Ferco Seating and the fitters were at the stadium this morning to start the work, which is scheduled to take two weeks.

https://www.shrewsburytown.com/news/2018/may/safe-standing-installation-begins/

 

Anyone know the legality of having safe standing in the championship?  Will they have to remove them if they get promoted (3 year rule).

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The Taylor report which was used as the basis of the legislation is available for anyone to read at:

http://www.epcollege.com/EPC/media/MediaLibrary/Knowledge Hub Documents/F Inquiry Reports/Hillsborough-Taylor-Report.pdf?ext=http://www.epcollege.com/EPC/media/MediaLibrary/Knowledge Hub Documents/F Inquiry Reports/Hillsborough-Taylor-Report.pdf?

 

Having read through as to why the recommendation was for all-seater stadiums, the reasons for this were:

1)  Supporters will not be in close physical contact with those around them and will not be jostled or moved about by swaying or surging. The seated spectator is not subject to pressure of numbers behind or around him during the match.

2) Seating has distinct advantages in achieving crowd control. With the assistance of CCTV the police can immediately zoom in with a camera and pinpoint the seats occupied by the trouble-makers. Numbered tickets matching numbered seats mean those monitoring numbers will know exactly how many are there without having to count them in or assess the density by visual impression.

3) Sitting for the duration of the match is more comfortable than standing.

 

Comfort is a personal choice, so this aside, I'd fully agree with the report that the main 2 reasons as to why terraces were dangerous in the 80s were that there could be big movements back and forward crushing people, and that more people could enter the stand (or a section of the stand) than were ticketed to and this would not be identified as people didn't have an allocated space.

 

Both of these factors are demonstrably answered by the rail seats: they provide barriers in front and behind to give personal space and avoid surges. They give people an individual space & will show if someone is in the wrong place. (Plus, the technology involved in ticketing is a world away from when the report was written).

 

Unfortunately, our politicians fear being on the end of a backlash if they stick their necks out to support standing, and their reputations are more important to than facts, so it is not a risk I can see any of them taking. :(

 

(Although I did sign the petition, so at least it helps the possibility of it getting traction).

 

 

2 hours ago, purpleronnie said:

Anyone know the legality of having safe standing in the championship?  Will they have to remove them if they get promoted (3 year rule).

Yes - I believe the 3 year rule still applies to them. However, I understand that rail seats can be locked into the seat position to satisfy the requirement of all-seater stadia: which I believe is what is done for rail seats in the Champions League.

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2 hours ago, Golden Fox said:

The Taylor report which was used as the basis of the legislation is available for anyone to read at:

http://www.epcollege.com/EPC/media/MediaLibrary/Knowledge Hub Documents/F Inquiry Reports/Hillsborough-Taylor-Report.pdf?ext=http://www.epcollege.com/EPC/media/MediaLibrary/Knowledge Hub Documents/F Inquiry Reports/Hillsborough-Taylor-Report.pdf?

 

Having read through as to why the recommendation was for all-seater stadiums, the reasons for this were:

1)  Supporters will not be in close physical contact with those around them and will not be jostled or moved about by swaying or surging. The seated spectator is not subject to pressure of numbers behind or around him during the match.

2) Seating has distinct advantages in achieving crowd control. With the assistance of CCTV the police can immediately zoom in with a camera and pinpoint the seats occupied by the trouble-makers. Numbered tickets matching numbered seats mean those monitoring numbers will know exactly how many are there without having to count them in or assess the density by visual impression.

3) Sitting for the duration of the match is more comfortable than standing.

 

Comfort is a personal choice, so this aside, I'd fully agree with the report that the main 2 reasons as to why terraces were dangerous in the 80s were that there could be big movements back and forward crushing people, and that more people could enter the stand (or a section of the stand) than were ticketed to and this would not be identified as people didn't have an allocated space.

 

Both of these factors are demonstrably answered by the rail seats: they provide barriers in front and behind to give personal space and avoid surges. They give people an individual space & will show if someone is in the wrong place. (Plus, the technology involved in ticketing is a world away from when the report was written).

 

Unfortunately, our politicians fear being on the end of a backlash if they stick their necks out to support standing, and their reputations are more important to than facts, so it is not a risk I can see any of them taking. :(

 

(Although I did sign the petition, so at least it helps the possibility of it getting traction).

 

 

Yes - I believe the 3 year rule still applies to them. However, I understand that rail seats can be locked into the seat position to satisfy the requirement of all-seater stadia: which I believe is what is done for rail seats in the Champions League.

A post showing depth and clarity which detractors of safe standing haven’t. It might appear churlish to say that those against are simply uninformed but I’ve not once seen a compelling argument against it.

Edited by Wookie
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6 hours ago, Wookie said:

A post showing depth and clarity which detractors of safe standing haven’t. It might appear churlish to say that those against are simply uninformed but I’ve not once seen a compelling argument against it.

 

Unfortunately, as with most things in this world, the uninformed are generally those who make the decisions. 

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One thing I meant to highlight in my post, was that on reading through the causes of the Hillsborough disaster, standing was not listed anywhere as a cause. The main causes were ticketing issues, high spiked fences and poor policing, but standing was not among these. This is why I was interested as to why all-seater stadia was a recommendation of the scheme. I think the ticketing issue was by far and away the main driver behind this recommendation, was to do with numbers entering the ground, reducing hooliganism also an alternative measure to reduce pitch invasions which would enable the high spiked fences to be removed. It always frustrates me that in any conversation on standing, the media always needs to reference Hillsborough whereas it was not a cause, and I think busting this myth with the politicians is the key to this whole debate.

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8 minutes ago, Golden Fox said:

One thing I meant to highlight in my post, was that on reading through the causes of the Hillsborough disaster, standing was not listed anywhere as a cause. The main causes were ticketing issues, high spiked fences and poor policing, but standing was not among these. This is why I was interested as to why all-seater stadia was a recommendation of the scheme. I think the ticketing issue was by far and away the main driver behind this recommendation, was to do with numbers entering the ground, reducing hooliganism also an alternative measure to reduce pitch invasions which would enable the high spiked fences to be removed. It always frustrates me that in any conversation on standing, the media always needs to reference Hillsborough whereas it was not a cause, and I think busting this myth with the politicians is the key to this whole debate.

The 2 main causes were allowing fans without the appropriate tickets into a confined space, even this wouldn't have caused the deaths if the front of the stand hadn't been fenced in. Ironic that the fences were put in at the request of authorities who thought they knew best.

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14 hours ago, purpleronnie said:

 

EkQY3Sh.jpg

 

https://www.shrewsburytown.com/news/2018/may/safe-standing-installation-begins/

 

Anyone know the legality of having safe standing in the championship?  Will they have to remove them if they get promoted (3 year rule).

Don'r t look very safe to me, looks like they've missed half the bolts out.

Edited by yorkie1999
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13 minutes ago, davieG said:

The 2 main causes were allowing fans without the appropriate tickets into a confined space, even this wouldn't have caused the deaths if the front of the stand hadn't been fenced in. Ironic that the fences were put in at the request of authorities who thought they knew best.

Fences aren't dangerous, poor management of people behind them is. 

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