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Mahrez to Man City shock

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Just now, FoxinNotts said:

Sorry, I was being abit harsh and probably  not reading things thoroughly enough. 

The point I guess I was making is that the word “worth” is subjective in the case of a footballer, as guidance on the price is not given by a third party, as it is on a house.

No worries, but i was originally replying to the statement about a house's value being only worth what someone is willing to pay for it, but quite clearly it's not, it's worth whatever it's valued at. It's not your problem if someone who wants to buy it doesn't think its worth it's value, much like Mahrez and Man City. If we sell him for £10 million less than our evaluation, that's devaluing our club, so in theory, he's worth more to us sitting on the bench in the reserves than actually selling him.

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16 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

No worries, but i was originally replying to the statement about a house's value being only worth what someone is willing to pay for it, but quite clearly it's not, it's worth whatever it's valued at. It's not your problem if someone who wants to buy it doesn't think its worth it's value, much like Mahrez and Man City. If we sell him for £10 million less than our evaluation, that's devaluing our club, so in theory, he's worth more to us sitting on the bench in the reserves than actually selling him.

But surely a player’s value depreciates whilst sitting on the bench ?

Edited by FoxinNotts
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On 20/06/2018 at 07:11, st albans fox said:

Btw, outside of Leicester and Algeria, nearly everyone thinks we’re taking the p1ss re his valuation. Sixty mill is the absolute ceiling. 

 

 why don’t they include goals/assists etc as part of a large ‘add ons’ section. (Taking the price higher than we have asked for). If he is as good as we think then we collect. They ultimately are happy to pay.   Say 57m + 30m add ons by the end of season two. 

 

Liverpool put an unrealistic price on coutinho and Neymar release was crazy - but both players moved. If no one is willing to pay our valuation on RM then there is a message in that.

Because the price depends on who the selling club is, which I think is stupid.

 

So if e.g. if man city were buying mahrez from liverpool, no way would he be valued anywhere near 60 million, his stats are superior to coutinho who went for more than 100 million.

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Just now, FoxinNotts said:

But surely a player’s value depreciates whilst sitting on the bench ?

Well yes, but not immediately, i was only using that as a tongue in cheek example of right now, right now being his value to the club at this present time.  

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19 hours ago, Bob Weasel Fox said:

An unhappy player with a shit attitude? Really? 

Yes, in higher leagues talent is important, work rate alone without talent tends to mean relegation.

 

I am not saying we dont have any other talent, but mahrez's stats speak for themselves, consider e.g. last season he was sulking for the second half, he still came out second only to sterling for goals+assists, his 2017 season was supposedly bad yet for the past 3 seasons his combined total is still the best in the league, he is utterly world class.

 

Our title win showed only 2 or 3 world class players can carry you to a title, kante+vardy+mahrez, and our propulsion last season from 17th to 7th coincided with a good run of games from mahrez, even just one world class player in a team can make a ton of difference.

 

"lets just sell him he doesnt want to be here" only makes sense if you are a poor club who cannot afford to pay highly paid players sitting on sidelines, who cannot afford to not sell valuable players etc.  LCFC is not in that position.  

The 2 logical paths are.

 

1 - Business path, we sell him, but only when valuation is met, if its not met this summer there is still many other transfer windows whilst he is under contract.  His value if he stays at the club is enormous as he is fairly likely the difference to staying as an EPL club or relegation.

2 - Football mad path, we force him to honour contract even if he is leaves as free agent in few years time, this would be simply maximising the time we keep mahrez as a player without regard to the most sane financial decision.

 

I think when people make claims that we can sell the best player we have had in a century and not feel the impact are in lala land.

 

If I was making the decision my preferred outcome would be to keep mahrez until there is 12-18 months on contract and then sell for maximum value. I would consider a sale this summer but only at a good price for the club as the club doesnt need to sell.

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12 hours ago, foxpleasure said:

How about if you knew you had to give me the house for nothing in two years time?

and the house made you 80k a year as long as you owned it?

 

So 160k revenue for a house valued at 100k to give away for free.

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3 hours ago, Gerard said:

 

£65m is probably what we can spend net over the next three years to break even, it's huge money that we can't afford to throw away.

You looking at it the wrong way, I have explained this on this forum probably at least 10 times, but people dont understand.

 

You looking at it in a manner if we sell mahrez that it has no impact on the following.

 

Sponsor deals

TV air time (TV appearance fees)

League position (league placement winnings worth nearly 2 mill per position per season)

League status (relegation?) - even one season of relegation and coming straight back up makes that 65m worth it, never mind additional seasons.

Willingness of new players to join us

Commercial sales, shirts etc.

 

Football isnt as simple as you think it is.

 

As an example if mahrez gave us 10 league positions (not unrealistic expectation given his stats), 2 extra game's on uk TV, that alone would be worth £23,000,000 for a single season, thats assuming no positive affect on sponsors shirts sold etc. and that the 10 positions didnt pull us out of relegation so say 17th to 7th, So if we sold for say £50 million next season instead of £65 million this season, it would be profitable, but I bet most on here would see it as a 15mill+wages loss.

 

This is why when we see players like ronaldo join real madrid for what seems sick fees the fees are good for those clubs as it gives them so much exposure, for a smaller club like ourselves, players like riyad are even more valuable because we dont have the prestige to attract a player with his standing.  It would be buying another player in development and hoping it works out and also he doesnt want out the moment he gets good.

Edited by Chrysalis
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Examples aside, he’s worth what top says he’s worth. He isn’t a house or anything else comparative, if top considers him to be worth more than £60m then he is and Man City will have to go elsewhere and see what £60m gets them.

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1 hour ago, turtmcfly said:

Mate, your house is currently skulking around St. Margaret's Bus Station with its patio doors wide open and a sign saying 'bum the dog for free' on the front door.

Ah, resorting to speculative insults as a replacement for civilised debate. Classic behaviour of people who cannot comprehend the reality that people disagree with them and have different opinions. I'm sure there is a word for people like you, though I am yet to think of it.

 

Pathetic response by the way, I'd never let anyone bum my dog for free. 

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6 minutes ago, 4everfox said:

Ah, resorting to speculative insults as a replacement for civilised debate. Classic behaviour of people who cannot comprehend the reality that people disagree with them and have different opinions. I'm sure there is a word for people like you, though I am yet to think of it.

 

Pathetic response by the way, I'd never let anyone bum my dog for free. 

Love a sense of humour ?? great stuff! ?

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Just now, Realist Guy In The Room said:

This.

 

 

Please be honest, did you skip over my last post or just disagree with it?  

 

As I explained why you cannot look at it like selling just an asset with a fixed value, this asset generates 10s of millions for the club every season.

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Just now, Chrysalis said:

Please be honest, did you skip over my last post or just disagree with it?  

 

As I explained why you cannot look at it like selling just an asset with a fixed value, this asset generates 10s of millions for the club every season.

He’s a person 

 

if he doesn’t get his move then you think he will perform to a level where he is an asset next season and helping us to reach our best possible finish ? 

 

And all the while his value will be depreciating......

 

its time to sell ... for the most we can get ....  and that will be Man City.  If we p1ss them off to the point that they take their 60m elsewhere then we will be forced to sell him for max 50m to another top six side or half that next January or perhaps less next summer. 

 

Coutinho wasn’t worth 143 m but Liverpool were able to play hardball as he had the best part of five years left on his contract and was earning 180k/week. 

 

VVD had signed a six year deal at Soton last year.

 

riyad has two years left. He needs to negotiate his way out of the club because his career needs this move to Man City. He has to give something to make it all work - I expect he will. (Maybe he already has - we will never find out). If the fee is published at £63m then there would be plenty of moans in here but if he has waived a loyalty bonus of 7m then we have in effect got 70m. More acceptable for some of you. Not information we will see though. 

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46 minutes ago, Chrysalis said:

Yes, in higher leagues talent is important, work rate alone without talent tends to mean relegation.

 

I am not saying we dont have any other talent, but mahrez's stats speak for themselves, consider e.g. last season he was sulking for the second half, he still came out second only to sterling for goals+assists, his 2017 season was supposedly bad yet for the past 3 seasons his combined total is still the best in the league, he is utterly world class.

 

Our title win showed only 2 or 3 world class players can carry you to a title, kante+vardy+mahrez, and our propulsion last season from 17th to 7th coincided with a good run of games from mahrez, even just one world class player in a team can make a ton of difference.

 

"lets just sell him he doesnt want to be here" only makes sense if you are a poor club who cannot afford to pay highly paid players sitting on sidelines, who cannot afford to not sell valuable players etc.  LCFC is not in that position.  

The 2 logical paths are.

 

1 - Business path, we sell him, but only when valuation is met, if its not met this summer there is still many other transfer windows whilst he is under contract.  His value if he stays at the club is enormous as he is fairly likely the difference to staying as an EPL club or relegation.

2 - Football mad path, we force him to honour contract even if he is leaves as free agent in few years time, this would be simply maximising the time we keep mahrez as a player without regard to the most sane financial decision.

 

I think when people make claims that we can sell the best player we have had in a century and not feel the impact are in lala land.

 

If I was making the decision my preferred outcome would be to keep mahrez until there is 12-18 months on contract and then sell for maximum value. I would consider a sale this summer but only at a good price for the club as the club doesnt need to sell.

That's not the mad football path, that's the mad path.

 

He won't perform at his usual level, I dare say he will down the tools. Why wouldn't he? In his mind, if he performs well, we'll put an even higher price on his head. So what next? Put him in the reserves? Good luck with that.

 

It will turn into a war with disastrous PR consequences for us, never mind the toxic atmosphere in the dressing room. At the end of the day we'll have refused 65M for our star player, he's rotting in the reserves, we'll still pay his wages and we'll end up selling him for much, much less than what MCFC are offering.

 

Other than a misplaced sense of pride, I fail to see on which basis some fans are hell bent on not selling for 65M. I'd be amazed if we get 70M for him.

Edited by That_Dude
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25 minutes ago, 4everfox said:

Ah, resorting to speculative insults as a replacement for civilised debate. Classic behaviour of people who cannot comprehend the reality that people disagree with them and have different opinions. I'm sure there is a word for people like you, though I am yet to think of it.

 

Pathetic response by the way, I'd never let anyone bum my dog for free. 

'Speculative insult' - I like it. Great way of describing a joke, you big soft jessie!

 

Of course I can comprehend you have a different opinion. I'm struggling to comprehend someone with an opinion so different, someone who is seriously saying he'd be happy if we lost out to the tune of 70 million quid, and who thinks that in doing so we wouldn't look like an absolute laughing stock.

 

 

Thanks for the clarification re. the dog. I'm skint at the minute.

 

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15 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

He’s a person 

 

if he doesn’t get his move then you think he will perform to a level where he is an asset next season and helping us to reach our best possible finish ? 

 

And all the while his value will be depreciating......

 

its time to sell ... for the most we can get ....  and that will be Man City.  If we p1ss them off to the point that they take their 60m elsewhere then we will be forced to sell him for max 50m to another top six side or half that next January or perhaps less next summer. 

 

Coutinho wasn’t worth 143 m but Liverpool were able to play hardball as he had the best part of five years left on his contract and was earning 180k/week. 

 

VVD had signed a six year deal at Soton last year.

 

riyad has two years left. He needs to negotiate his way out of the club because his career needs this move to Man City. He has to give something to make it all work - I expect he will. (Maybe he already has - we will never find out). If the fee is published at £63m then there would be plenty of moans in here but if he has waived a loyalty bonus of 7m then we have in effect got 70m. More acceptable for some of you. Not information we will see though. 

 

He is so good I think he would perform good enough to still drag us up the table and boost our tv appearances yes even if he isnt giving 100%.

 

He can have a poor 85mins, but 5 mins of magic would still get us a goal or 2 in a game, mahrez is mahrez.

 

Our form without him in the team is relegation form, all the numbers point to him been worth a lot of money to us.

 

I Could post a much worser picture than the £23million pound a season picture.

 

What if he is the difference between us finishing 15th and 19th? how good value does £60,000,000 seem then?

 

Think about this before you answer, we made £90,000,000 profit in last financial year 90 MILLION, the owners LOST £100 million whilst in the championship.

 

Any team thats not everton, man city, man utd, liverpool, arsenal, spurs is one bad decision from relegation, and also only a few clubs in this league can replace players of his calibre, I am not saying dont sell, I am saying the attitude of "get rid at under his value just to speed it up" is wrong.  I am glad our owners are seeing proper business sense here and not letting emotions rule them.

 

No way his value would be halved next summer either, and even if it was if he gave us 10 league places, 2 extra appearances on tv, that would be a circa 7 million loss for an extra season out of him, hardly the end of the world.  More likely we would agree to sell for maybe around £50 million next summer, and it would be a profitable decision.

 

Also as much as I love mahrez, I dont really care about his career post LCFC, LCFC comes first, so yes I dont care whats good for his career.  Is kinda annoying when a LCFC fan wants a good player to leave us because its good for that players career.  I mean what the.,,,

Edited by Chrysalis
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4 minutes ago, Chrysalis said:

 

He is so good I think he would perform good enough to still drag us up the table and boost our tv appearances yes even if he isnt giving 100%.

 

He can have a poor 85mins, but 5 mins of magic would still get us a goal or 2 in a game, mahrez is mahrez.

 

Our form without him in the team is relegation form, all the numbers point to him been worth a lot of money to us.

 

I Could post a much worser picture than the £23million pound a season picture.

 

What if he is the difference between us finishing 15th and 19th? how good value does £60,000,000 seem then?

 

Think about this before you answer, we made £90,000,000 profit in last financial year 90 MILLION, the owners LOST £100 million whilst in the championship.

 

Any team thats not everton, man city, man utd, liverpool, arsenal, spurs is one bad decision from relegation, and also only a few clubs in this league can replace players of his calibre, I am not saying dont sell, I am saying the attitude of "get rid at under his value just to speed it up" is wrong.  I am glad our owners are seeing proper business sense here and not letting emotions rule them.

 

He is leaving 

 

we need to have a plan for after he is gone 

 

what happens in two years when he leaves on a free ?  He is a depreciating asset. Selling him for 65/70m is not under selling him given his age and contract value/time to run 

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46 minutes ago, 4everfox said:

Ah, resorting to speculative insults as a replacement for civilised debate. Classic behaviour of people who cannot comprehend the reality that people disagree with them and have different opinions. I'm sure there is a word for people like you, though I am yet to think of it.

 

Pathetic response by the way, I'd never let anyone bum my dog for free. 

Before we discuss a price could you let me know the breed please ? Many thanks

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