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1 hour ago, MC Prussian said:

Some valid points here - starts at 05:07:

 

I really hate these right wing echo chambers, but to be fair they’re not as bad as the Aussie ones.

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14 minutes ago, Benji said:

Time to just vote the bloody thing through now.  In my perfect world Brexit would never happen but no deal is just a shit show waiting to happen. 

I voted remain. I would've preferred a remain win.

But we lost. So let's vote this through and crack on with other important issues.

 

Who knows... maybe Brexit might be the best thing for the country after all. (Not holding my breath but no-one knows)

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12 minutes ago, Strokes said:

So remainers ask for compromise, diplomacy and respect and then try to mock the situation when they get it.

If this doesn’t pass, then it’s no deal or remain left to fight for, I strongly suggest people get behind this.

 

I'm not criticising the deal, I'm criticising a man rehashing a deal he shot down time and time again and added a solution to Northern Ireland which he himself said a Conservative government should never even consider.

 

That's hypocrisy.

 

In fact, it reminds me a lot of the U-turns that @MattP was condemning Philip Lee for, so I suspect he has some strong words for this as well...

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Just now, Finnaldo said:

 

I'm not criticising the deal, I'm criticising a man rehashing a deal he shot down time and time again and added a solution to Northern Ireland which he himself said a Conservative government should never even consider.

 

That's hypocrisy.

 

In fact, it reminds me a lot of the U-turns that @MattP was condemning Philip Lee for, so I suspect he has some strong words for this as well...

Boris did vote for TM deal though....

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12 minutes ago, Legend_in_blue said:

The sensible choice would be to extend and give time to see this through properly.  If I were part of this decision I would want to scrutinise every word in every sentence of this deal.  Giving until Saturday is not long enough to do this properly.

 

Lay the facts out to the people, make it as clear as day and ask the people if they're happy with it.  A take it or leave it scenario.

 

I do wonder how many of the 17.4 actually voted to be worse off.  All indicators show we will be worse off. 

 

Just tell us how it is, no more BS and red buses.

 

Who is We?  I’m not fussed if we have a slightly smaller economy in a few years time if we can improve productivity.  I’m also not fussed if we have fewer unskilled immigrants and pay creeps upwards for the lowest paid.

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10 minutes ago, WigstonWanderer said:

I really hate these right wing echo chambers, but to be fair they’re not as bad as the Aussie ones.

Brendan O'Neill - self-proclaimed Marxist libertarian

Andre Walker - BBC contributor

Mark Dolan - Comedian, formerly in the Remain camp

 

Pretty diverse, as far as I can tell. Can't say much about James Whale's political views, other than he originally was for Remain, as well.

 

In essence, I don't know where you get this "right-wing echo chamber" thing from.

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6 minutes ago, Finnaldo said:

I'm not criticising the deal, I'm criticising a man rehashing a deal he shot down time and time again and added a solution to Northern Ireland which he himself said a Conservative government should never even consider.

 

That's hypocrisy.

 

In fact, it reminds me a lot of the U-turns that @MattP was condemning Philip Lee for, so I suspect he has some strong words for this as well...

Boris voted for the May deal the third time so it's nothing like Philip Lee.

I have no idea how I feel about this yet as I haven't read it and I don't know the details, it's amazing how many people already seem to know so much about it - they must be quicker readers than most lol

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5 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Boris did vote for TM deal though....

 

I'll concede that, I got ahead of myself, but it doesn't excuse the total U-turn and the fact this Great New Deal isn't a much of a New Deal at alll.

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1 minute ago, Finnaldo said:

 

I'll concede that, I got ahead of myself, but it doesn't excuse the total U-turn and the fact this Great New Deal isn't a much of a New Deal at alll.

What is the total U turn, he has compromised but the backstop has to go. As it held the UK in the customs union. It’s gone as far as I’m reading. 
I support the deal, would I have supported if TM had bought it back. Yes, I think so. I want this to succeed.

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3 minutes ago, Strokes said:

What is the total U turn

 

Implementing something he said would leave NI an 'EU semi-colony'  and should never even be considered by a Conservative government? 

 

It's a mighty large U-turn to then present it as the top booking of a 'Great New Deal'.

 

I concur though, just get it through.

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1 minute ago, Finnaldo said:

 

Implementing something he said would leave NI an 'EU semi-colony'  and should never even be considered by a Conservative government? 

 

It's a mighty large U-turn to then present it as the top booking of a 'Great New Deal'.

 

I concur though, just get it through.

The Conservative and Fvck U Nionist party ? 

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1 minute ago, Finnaldo said:

 

Implementing something he said would leave NI an 'EU semi-colony'  and should never even be considered by a Conservative government? 

 

It's a mighty large U-turn to then present it as the top booking of a 'Great New Deal'.

 

I concur though, just get it through.

Fair enough we will leave it there, let’s just hope we can all move on and focus on the right things in politics from now onwards.

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As a remainer, this deal is still way to hard for me to get behind. As much as I'd like Brexit done, from what I've read so far, this deal is worse than TMs IMO. 

 

No protection of workers rights etc to try and get labour MPs on board either. 

 

The back stop solution isn't really much better especially when you consider Stormonts not even able to sit at present. As others have said, Boris himself slated it not long ago and now it's his magical solution. 

 

Don't think it will get through parliament myself and don't think Boris really wants it too. This is all clever positioning ready for a GE.

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2 minutes ago, RobHawk said:

As a remainer, this deal is still way to hard for me to get behind. As much as I'd like Brexit done, from what I've read so far, this deal is worse than TMs IMO. 

 

No protection of workers rights etc to try and get labour MPs on board either. 

 

The back stop solution isn't really much better especially when you consider Stormonts not even able to sit at present. As others have said, Boris himself slated it not long ago and now it's his magical solution. 

 

Don't think it will get through parliament myself and don't think Boris really wants it too. This is all clever positioning ready for a GE.

Quite clever really - get's it through he's a hero, doesn't get through and he can blame the EU for not giving him enough. He can also now work with the line of "You all said I wasn't interested in a deal, well I got one and you STILL voted it down"

 

I am surprised at how much leeway he's getting, looking through at the Tory forums now and the same people who were crucifying May are absolutely loving the Boris deal.

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29 minutes ago, MC Prussian said:

Brendan O'Neill - self-proclaimed Marxist libertarian

Andre Walker - BBC contributor

Mark Dolan - Comedian, formerly in the Remain camp

 

Pretty diverse, as far as I can tell. Can't say much about James Whale's political views, other than he originally was for Remain, as well.

 

In essence, I don't know where you get this "right-wing echo chamber" thing from.

Walks like duck, quacks like a duck, probably a duck.

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4 minutes ago, MattP said:

Quite clever really - get's it through he's a hero, doesn't get through and he can blame the EU for not giving him enough. He can also now work with the line of "You all said I wasn't interested in a deal, well I got one and you STILL voted it down"

 

I am surprised at how much leeway he's getting, looking through at the Tory forums now and the same people who were crucifying May are absolutely loving the Boris deal.

Personality politics - majority of people are idiots and dont consider the important aspects of any deal, policy etc.

 

Before anyone has a go, this is a generic statement about the state of UK politics across all parties. It's not a specific attack on leaver torys, it's just another good example of the 'brainless majority' as Ive just decided to label them

Edited by RobHawk

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11 minutes ago, RobHawk said:

As a remainer, this deal is still way to hard for me to get behind. As much as I'd like Brexit done, from what I've read so far, this deal is worse than TMs IMO. 

 

No protection of workers rights etc to try and get labour MPs on board either. 

 

The back stop solution isn't really much better especially when you consider Stormonts not even able to sit at present. As others have said, Boris himself slated it not long ago and now it's his magical solution. 

 

Don't think it will get through parliament myself and don't think Boris really wants it too. This is all clever positioning ready for a GE.

It’s fair enough but Parliament had 3 chances at a softer deal and they didn’t take it. If they take this, then that’s representative democracy in action. 
Boris is clever at putting himself in a no lose situation, when you look at May she always seemed in a no win situation. 
His opponents have played into his hands so many times.

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11 minutes ago, WigstonWanderer said:

Walks like duck, quacks like a duck, probably a duck.

I thought those on the left were pro the right to self identify?

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2 minutes ago, Strokes said:

It’s fair enough but Parliament had 3 chances at a softer deal and they didn’t take it. If they take this, then that’s representative democracy in action. 
Boris is clever at putting himself in a no lose situation, when you look at May she always seemed in a no win situation. 
His opponents have played into his hands so many times.

TMs deal may have been slightly softer but it was still a pile of shit from the point of view I'm looking at. 

 

This is just the same Turd with a bit more Hard Brexit glitter rolled into it and a picture of Boris' face stuck on the end. 

 

You may like the glitter and boris' face but in my and many others opinions, it's still just a turd at the end of the day.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, RobHawk said:

TMs deal may have been slightly softer but it was still a pile of shit from the point of view I'm looking at. 

 

This is just the same Turd with a bit more Hard Brexit glitter rolled into it and a picture of Boris' face stuck on the end. 

 

You may like the glitter and boris' face but in my and many others opinions, it's still just a turd at the end of the day.

What makes it a harder Brexit? 

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4 minutes ago, RobHawk said:

TMs deal may have been slightly softer but it was still a pile of shit from the point of view I'm looking at. 

 

This is just the same Turd with a bit more Hard Brexit glitter rolled into it and a picture of Boris' face stuck on the end. 

 

You may like the glitter and boris' face but in my and many others opinions, it's still just a turd at the end of the day.

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, MattP said:

What makes it a harder Brexit? 

Constipation?

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So the caveat from the EU regarding any future extension (may well be ) it's this deal or no future extensions, so no deal.

Will certainly be interesting if that does happen how Parliament will vote.

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1 minute ago, The Guvnor said:

So the caveat from the EU regarding any future extension (may well be ) it's this deal or no future extensions, so no deal.

Will certainly be interesting if that does happen how Parliament will vote.

If that were to happen it's certain parliament votes for it.

 

I'd be amazed if they agreed to that though.

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