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Starmer Next Labour Leader

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On 18/01/2020 at 17:18, Alf Bentley said:

Phillips 5 - Has some decent ideas but doesn't come across as leader material; too self-focused & chatty/informal; started to grate on me, probably more on others

And that was her trying to be "prime ministerial" lol

 

What's the odds by the end of March she's burping into the microphone, eating on stage and openly using profanity under the assumption that's what the working class want?

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Jess Phillips is so irritating, even if she had a good policy platform (she doesn't) she'd turn voters off. Nandy and Starmer are huge improvements on the incumbent so either of those would be a decent choice. Starmer until 2025 (?) and then Nandy might just work for Labour 

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2 hours ago, MattP said:

And that was her trying to be "prime ministerial" lol

 

What's the odds by the end of March she's burping into the microphone, eating on stage and openly using profanity under the assumption that's what the working class want?

I'm not a fan of hers at all, but you keep talking about her in this way. I'm sorry I must have missed all the times shes burped, farted and swore during tv debates, Question Time appearances, HOP debates, tv news interviews etc.

 

Shes certainly different from the rest, and imo she'll gain as many voters from thinking shes a refreshing change from the norm as she'll push away thinking shes a bit to ranty and over emotional. But where this idea comes from that shes some uncouth slob, or is going to play the part of one, I don't know.

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9 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

I'm not a fan of hers at all, but you keep talking about her in this way. I'm sorry I must have missed all the times shes burped, farted and swore during tv debates, Question Time appearances, HOP debates, tv news interviews etc.

 

Shes certainly different from the rest, and imo she'll gain as many voters from thinking shes a refreshing change from the norm as she'll push away thinking shes a bit to ranty and over emotional. But where this idea comes from that shes some uncouth slob, or is going to play the part of one, I don't know.

Tough crowd.

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20 hours ago, Facecloth said:

I'm not a fan of hers at all, but you keep talking about her in this way. I'm sorry I must have missed all the times shes burped, farted and swore during tv debates, Question Time appearances, HOP debates, tv news interviews etc.

 

Shes certainly different from the rest, and imo she'll gain as many voters from thinking shes a refreshing change from the norm as she'll push away thinking shes a bit to ranty and over emotional. But where this idea comes from that shes some uncouth slob, or is going to play the part of one, I don't know.

Just to be clear. I don't actually think she's going to start burping into microphones. She does come across as a bit of a pig though when I watch her.

 

Anyway, more YouGov - what's important to Labour members. Some pretty weird stuff in here to be honest.

 

 

FB_IMG_1579546766026.jpg

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2 hours ago, Desabafar said:

Looks like it will be three through to ballot with front two likely to be a long way ahead of nandy. 

 

Can't warm to that Keir Starmer bloke at all, he's very lawyery

We just had the least qualified Labour leader of all time so I feel that having a leader who's got the top of his field and has 100% integrity cannot be a bad thing. 

 

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53 minutes ago, Lionator said:

We just had the least qualified Labour leader of all time so I feel that having a leader who's got the top of his field and has 100% integrity cannot be a bad thing. 

Not sure the innocent people hounded under Operation Yewtree would say Starmer has 100% integrity. He's certainly the most qualified for the job though.

 

Not surprised Phillips has gone, was never really a serious bid and as usual was all about a bit of press for her, must have another book coming out.

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Some interesting stuff.

 

Despite the membership still being crackers in rating Corbyn as the best Labour leader and Blair as the worst - most do appear to be willing to compromise to achieve power.

IMG_20200121_150449.jpg

Edited by MattP
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1 hour ago, MattP said:

Some interesting stuff.

 

Despite the membership still being crackers in rating Corbyn as the best Labour leader and Blair as the worst - most do appear to be willing to compromise to achieve power.

IMG_20200121_150449.jpg

Electable and popular are quite, quite different. 

 

I can't say I much like Blair but he was certainly a leader that I could get behind at the point of election. 

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GMB Union goes for Nandy - big scalp for her that.

 

Sadly, Richard Burgon is struggling to get on the deputy list as he needs 30 CLP and he's only got Kensington so far.

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Interesting C4 News video. Mainly shows a focus group of Birmingham Northfield voters who switched from Labour to Tory, asking their opinions of the different leadership candidates.

 

Focus group starts at about 02:20.

 

Nandy, Thornberry & (to a lesser extent) Phillips go down well, Starmer not so well, Long Bailey poorly.

 

Might change, but think I'm: 1. Nandy, 2. Thornberry, 3. Starmer

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

Interesting C4 News video. Mainly shows a focus group of Birmingham Northfield voters who switched from Labour to Tory, asking their opinions of the different leadership candidates.

 

Focus group starts at about 02:20.

 

Nandy, Thornberry & (to a lesser extent) Phillips go down well, Starmer not so well, Long Bailey poorly.

 

Might change, but think I'm: 1. Nandy, 2. Thornberry, 3. Starmer

 

 

 

Cheers for that, interesting. As expected Nandy is the one people like and she's the one ever Tory knows will give them the biggest fight if elected.

 

The more I look at Starmer the more I want him, as they say, corporate, boring and reminds them of Cameron - he's a decade too late for politics, it's moved on a generation in the space of five years from the DC, EM, NC era.

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9 minutes ago, MattP said:

 

The more I look at Starmer the more I want him, as they say, corporate, boring and reminds them of Cameron - he's a decade too late for politics, it's moved on a generation in the space of five years from the DC, EM, NC era.

 

I tend to agree. Though, I suppose times might have moved on again by 2024. If five years of a more "passionate", extravagant, characterful PM in Boris ends badly, maybe a competent but dull "corporate" type might appeal by then?

 

That would be a gamble now, though. Starmer would be an upgrade on Corbyn, but I could imagine him doing enough to hold Labour together but not to win in 2024.....potentially leading to a backlash & back to square one.

Maybe he'd be a good option as (Shadow) Chancellor, where dull, corporate intelligence & attention to detail could be seen as an asset.

 

It's a shame Starmer & Long Bailey seem so far ahead. There's a long way to go in the contest, but Nandy & Thornberry have a lot of ground to make up, judging by polls. 

 

Phillips' departure might help Thornberry get on the ballot paper via the constituency route. I hope so, as I thought she was impressive in the first hustings. She has  more passion and character & seems more personable than Starmer, but doesn't have the foot-in-mouth qualities of Phillips. She's often performed well in TV interviews and in parliament - forceful, articulate, attention to detail & not many slip-ups. She can alienate by being a loud middle-class schoolmarm, but could overcome that, possibly.

 

Unfair the severe hit her reputation took from that Tweeted photo of the house with white van and England flags. It was just a photo with no comment attached, so the assumption that she was sneering was unjustified. I've wandered about taking photos in the past, including photos of houses with England flags, mosques, plush houses, decrepit houses, expensive restaurants, shabby kebab shops......didn't mean I was sneering at patriots, Muslims, the rich, the poor or anyone else. It was more interest in life and wry amusement, not sneering hostility. Some folk on the Left rightly get slated for snowflakery, but it exists on the Right, too...

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50 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

I tend to agree. Though, I suppose times might have moved on again by 2024. If five years of a more "passionate", extravagant, characterful PM in Boris ends badly, maybe a competent but dull "corporate" type might appeal by then?

 

That would be a gamble now, though. Starmer would be an upgrade on Corbyn, but I could imagine him doing enough to hold Labour together but not to win in 2024.....potentially leading to a backlash & back to square one.

Maybe he'd be a good option as (Shadow) Chancellor, where dull, corporate intelligence & attention to detail could be seen as an asset.

 

It's a shame Starmer & Long Bailey seem so far ahead. There's a long way to go in the contest, but Nandy & Thornberry have a lot of ground to make up, judging by polls. 

 

Phillips' departure might help Thornberry get on the ballot paper via the constituency route. I hope so, as I thought she was impressive in the first hustings. She has  more passion and character & seems more personable than Starmer, but doesn't have the foot-in-mouth qualities of Phillips. She's often performed well in TV interviews and in parliament - forceful, articulate, attention to detail & not many slip-ups. She can alienate by being a loud middle-class schoolmarm, but could overcome that, possibly.

 

Unfair the severe hit her reputation took from that Tweeted photo of the house with white van and England flags. It was just a photo with no comment attached, so the assumption that she was sneering was unjustified. I've wandered about taking photos in the past, including photos of houses with England flags, mosques, plush houses, decrepit houses, expensive restaurants, shabby kebab shops......didn't mean I was sneering at patriots, Muslims, the rich, the poor or anyone else. It was more interest in life and wry amusement, not sneering hostility. Some folk on the Left rightly get slated for snowflakery, but it exists on the Right, too...

You can never prove it, but I can't imagine for one minute she was tweeting that picture in a positive light - all irrelevant though as Thornberry has absolutely no chance of winning this. 

 

Why dont the candidates do PMQ's a couple of times a week each during the time until April? That would get them recognition across the country and you wouldn't be voting in the dark about how they would perform if they get the gig.

 

Watching Corbyn do it is painful and pathetic, there has to be a better alternative than him still fighting an election he's already lost.

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1 hour ago, MattP said:

 

Why dont the candidates do PMQ's a couple of times a week each during the time until April? That would get them recognition across the country and you wouldn't be voting in the dark about how they would perform if they get the gig.

 

Watching Corbyn do it is painful and pathetic, there has to be a better alternative than him still fighting an election he's already lost.

 

Decent idea re. PMQs. I can imagine Johnson & Tory MPs taking the piss, but that itself would be useful - to see how well different candidates responded to that. Corbyn should vacate the stage, anyway.

 

I think some of the later hustings will be televised. Not many people will watch them, but not many watch PMQs except a few snippets on the News.

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1 minute ago, MattP said:

Nothing is going to change it appears - the "period of reflection" is an illusion.

 

 

Jockeying for votes. A lot of Labour members have a positive view of Corbyn, even some who would criticise him.

It wouldn't help Nandy's campaign to alienate them all - or to needlessly alienate pro-Corbyn Labour MPs/shadow ministers she'd need to work with if elected leader & seeking to unify the party.

 

She's already been critical of aspects of the party under Corbyn's leadership, as Johnson has about May's leadership.....without any need for anyone to trash the previous/outgoing leader.

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3 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

Jockeying for votes. A lot of Labour members have a positive view of Corbyn, even some who would criticise him.

It wouldn't help Nandy's campaign to alienate them all - or to needlessly alienate pro-Corbyn Labour MPs/shadow ministers she'd need to work with if elected leader & seeking to unify the party.

 

She's already been critical of aspects of the party under Corbyn's leadership, as Johnson has about May's leadership.....without any need for anyone to trash the previous/outgoing leader.

I'm not sure I get the tactical position, polling suggests it's a two horse race at the minute with the pro-Corbyn block behind RLB and the opposition behind Starmer.

 

Surely shes better off throwing some criticism in? I suppose she could be looking for second preference votes.

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4 minutes ago, MattP said:

I'm not sure I get the tactical position, polling suggests it's a two horse race at the minute with the pro-Corbyn block behind RLB and the opposition behind Starmer.

 

Surely shes better off throwing some criticism in? I suppose she could be looking for second preference votes.

 

She's already been quite critical. If she overdoes it, she'll be fishing for votes only in the anti-Corbyn pool.

 

The blocks are clearly not monolithic, anyway. Corbyn won last time, yet polls suggest RLB is behind, so some previous Corbyn voters are not supporting her currently.

Plus, there are members who would be critical of some of Jezza's policies and might like Nandy's ideas, but think Corbyn is a nice man (wrongly, in my view) and wouldn't approve of her slagging him off.

 

Yes, second preference votes might come into it, too. If she made strong progress during the campaign and finished ahead of RLB, she might need the second votes of her lot to beat Starmer. 

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Lisa Nandy is the second Labour leadership hopeful to get on to the final ballot, after Chinese for Labour announced it was supporting her.

The Wigan MP joins shadow Brexit secretary Sir Keir Starmer, having already got backing from the GMB union and the National Union of Mineworkers.

To progress, hopefuls need the support of three unions and affiliate groups representing 5% of the membership.

Emily Thornberry and Rebecca Long-Bailey are yet to reach the threshold.

Jess Phillips quit the race to replace Jeremy Corbyn on Tuesday.

Ms Phillips told reporters she would be giving her first preference vote to Ms Nandy, with Sir Keir her second choice.

She said shadow business secretary Mrs Long-Bailey was not the right leader for Labour at the moment, but "there's no reason to say she can't change."

Chairwoman of Chinese for Labour - a group affiliated to the Labour Party - and Luton North MP Sarah Owen said: "Only in power can Labour make the radical changes that are so desperately needed for our towns and communities.

"We believe that Lisa is the right candidate to take us there."

Chinese for Labour aims to promote the interests of British Chinese and East Asian people in the Labour Party.

Reacting to the endorsement, Ms Nandy said: "As someone of mixed heritage, I'm incredibly proud that it is Chinese for Labour who have secured my place on the ballot paper.

"They do incredibly important work to ensure we are a representative and inclusive party that can truly speak for modern Britain."

She said she was now "looking forward to getting out into the country and laying out my vision for reuniting the party".

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