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Corona Virus

Mark

No political discussion in this topic. That is complaining about a country, a politician, a party and/or its voters, etc

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20 minutes ago, Crinklyfox said:

Some disappointing results reported from the Oxford group vaccine trials.  It seems that monkeys infected with the vaccine developed Covid-19 infections after exposure to the virus.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/doubts-oxford-vaccine-fails-stop-coronavirus-animal-trials/

Not sure this is really news. The early reports around 3 weeks ago showed that the vaccine did not prevent infection, I'm not sure if that was indeed ever intended with this vaccine. However, to quote from the article

"It is helpful to see that monkeys vaccinated with this Sars-CoV-2 vaccine did not have any evidence of enhanced lung pathology and that, despite some evidence of upper respiratory tract infection by Sars-Cov-2 after high viral load virus challenge, monkeys given the vaccine did not have any evidence of pneumonia."

 

It would at least provide partial protection, in theory, from some of the most harmful aspects of the virus if I understand correctly.

The same would be true for any anit viral treatment drug/therapy. It would be unlikely that a cure for the virus could be found but successful drug treatment coule make the disease far less dangerous. However, this might take many years, the AIDS/HIV drug cocktail took 20+ years to develop.

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6 minutes ago, reynard said:

That's how I read it. Vaccinated people need exposure to possible infection to see if the vaccine works. They are now talking about deliberately infecting young 20-25 year olds to see if that works. The WHO have I think approved this approach though the ethics behind the argument are interesting to say the least.

However, to do this you would probably need effective drug treatments to offset the few people who might become very ill indeed.

 

How many 20-25 year olds on here would willingly be infected to see if a virus works?

Hopefully none of them ...... anyone could have an underlying health issue they weren’t actually aware of and no one should be playing ‘Russian roulette’ with their life .....

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1 minute ago, st albans fox said:

Hopefully none of them ...... anyone could have an underlying health issue they weren’t actually aware of and no one should be playing ‘Russian roulette’ with their life .....

As I understand it full medicals would be done before any infecting. In the end it comes down to ethics and practicalities. Do we risk a few lives to perhaps save a very great many more.

It is a tricky question but whilst the focus of the world is on Covid there are many millions of children around the world missing out on very necessary vaccines which could quite easily result in a great many more deaths than caused by Covid. That's before we even get onto the unknown deaths that will occur from the collapse of various economies.

I'm not disagreeing with you by the way but the ethical arguments around this are both complex and interesting (at least to me).

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I don't understand why the thread cannot be moderated and all the political shiit removed.

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In order to keep the covid thread for covid,  maybe we can remove cummings to here ?.
 

it doesn’t have to be overtly political unless posters decide they can’t have a grown up debate .........if we try to stick to information rather than too much opinion we could manage ??

 

it could be quite a short thread but then again, a sacking/resignation seems to be dragging on a bit. Leaving it to fester through to 4pm is a hospital pass for the govt sacrificial lamb taking today’s presser.  If he really is going then they should announce it just before the press conference to take the wind out of the journos questions ......

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yes, quite comfortably 

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4 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

If some of the lunatics get hold of him he might do doc ........

There's loads of lunatics these days.  I hope he doesn't venture too from a police station or hospital.

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9 minutes ago, Dr The Singh said:

Is he going to die?

Yes eventually he will, unless of course he really is the Antichrist.

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Instead of calling for Cummings's head, what about that of the government's Chief Medical Adviser Sir Patrick Vallance?

9th March: 'Crowds don't make much difference' (to the spread of CV-19), according to Sir Patrick.

10th March: Cheltenham Festival begins, 37 died as a result, according to a recent report.

11th March: Liverpool v. Athletico Madrid, 41 died as a result, according to the same report.

Maybe that quote will come back to haunt him, just like Alan Hansen's 'You can't win anything with kids' quote about Manchester United in 1995.

I know that wisdom in hindsight is a wonderful thing, but these guys are experts, and are paid good money to be wise before the event.  

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6 minutes ago, Spiritwalker said:

Yes eventually he will, unless of course he really is the Aunti christ.

I often on weekends and dress as a women and call myself Aunti Christ, let's hope I live for ever. :ph34r:

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He comes across as an arrogant pr%-k who doesn’t give a toss about other people’s opinions or what people think of him. With Brexit getting done is there really any need for Boris to still have him around.

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boris has finally decided to turn up to work today, buzzing 

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For the non Cummings related stuff, this is a good watch. Gupta was the modeller who suggested that 50% of the population had been exposed to covid in April. 

 

It gets you thinking and while no second wave seems to be building anywhere then it could certainly be partly true.

 

One thing I have noticed is that these modellers are fiercely loyal to their models.

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If he were to be sacked today, would anyone give a shit tomorrow? I think that apart from his waxing lyrical wife, nah

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1 minute ago, yorkie1999 said:

If he were to be sacked today, would anyone give a shit tomorrow? I think that apart from his waxing lyrical wife, nah

Is his wife fit?

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24 minutes ago, String fellow said:

Instead of calling for Cummings's head, what about that of the government's Chief Medical Adviser Sir Patrick Vallance?

9th March: 'Crowds don't make much difference' (to the spread of CV-19), according to Sir Patrick.

10th March: Cheltenham Festival begins, 37 died as a result, according to a recent report.

11th March: Liverpool v. Athletico Madrid, 41 died as a result, according to the same report.

Maybe that quote will come back to haunt him, just like Alan Hansen's 'You can't win anything with kids' quote about Manchester United in 1995.

I know that wisdom in hindsight is a wonderful thing, but these guys are experts, and are paid good money to be wise before the event.  

This is what a scientist on Marr referred to this morning. 

 

Basically, hindsight is indeed a wonderful thing. The only evidence of 'super spreading event's appeared to be the South Korean church. Now we know a lot more.

 

A lack of evidence in the early days does not equate to wrong decisions. However, I'm certain that many Western countries made a number of terrible decisions in the early days.

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Just now, Dr The Singh said:

Is his wife fit?

Dunno, but she makes lord of the rings look like a short story

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5 minutes ago, Lionator said:

 

For the non Cummings related stuff, this is a good watch. Gupta was the modeller who suggested that 50% of the population had been exposed to covid in April. 

 

It gets you thinking and while no second wave seems to be building anywhere then it could certainly be partly true.

 

One thing I have noticed is that these modellers are fiercely loyal to their models.

What it does certainly show is there is vastly different views in the scientific community. It will be many months before the results show which way was/would have been best.

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Just now, Markyblue said:

What it does certainly show is there is vastly different views in the scientific community. It will be many months before the results show which way was/would have been best.

True, my prediction would be that people say that lockdown was unnecessary. However if they say that then in my book that will mean that lockdown was successful, if that makes sense?

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Quite often outrage dies down and people just move on. With something like this and the fact so many people have been impacted I'm not so sure he will. The PM will probably come out for the press conference at 5pm and agree to an inquiry. Say the government can't comment whilst an inquiry is ongoing; hope the outrage dies down and see what happens.

 

But he's so devisive and has so many enemies I'm not sure the media or people in his own party will allow it. Sturgeon won't leave this after getting rid of her CMO. 

 

Whilst some people are partisan in their politics a large number aren't. That's why so many swung from Labour to the Tories. Something like this could swing a lot back; it's very early in their term and they might hope people will forget about it by the time of the next election. It's probably 50/50 on how the public react in the next week or so. 

Edited by Guesty

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