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Championship - 2020/2021

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6 minutes ago, Mickyblueeyes said:

I don’t care where it started. I’m asking you and anyone else that if there is a group in society who repeatedly feel injustice, which is the case here and despite repeated campaigns to reduce or even better eradicate such injustice, what do you suggest they do? Do they just accept it ? 
 

the knee is a way of saying enough - sort this. Don’t stick on a t-shirt pre-warm up and feel warm inside. There is a group of society that feels discriminated against. So, until there is a genuine attempt to understand and and fix that, you can’t then criticise the stand. This was a global campaign that had the attention to make it appealing to fight such campaign. 
 

and finally, of course “all lives matter”. The point is that all lives should matter and the discrimination doesn’t allow that to happen at this moment for whatever reason.

I'm glad we agree that ALL lives matter, end of.

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3 minutes ago, Mickyblueeyes said:

Yep. All lives matter as long as those who feel injustice don’t express it. :)

no answer as to what else can be done. Just criticise it.

I think David doesn't "get it" or is a troll or maybe something else.

Might be another one for ignore button.

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6 minutes ago, Mickyblueeyes said:

Yep. All lives matter as long as those who feel injustice don’t express it. :)

 

no answer as to what else can be done. Just criticise it.

I'm not criticising just saying that injustice around the world is not the preserve of black people.

 

Bending the knee is not the answer nor is mass demonstrations and mayhem as we have seen across America. There is s more civilised way to protest.

Edited by David Hankey
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1 hour ago, David Hankey said:

I'm not criticising just saying that injustice around the world is not the preserve of black people.

 

Bending the knee is not the answer nor is mass demonstrations and mayhem as we have seen across America. There is s more civilised way to protest.

Ok and I’m asking what is the alternative then following a global symbol for injustice. There are people in the football profession (as well as other professions) who feel they’re discriminated against. Whether you agree with that or not, we should respect that feeling as unacceptable. Taking a knee before the game for elite sports stars is there way of protesting. What can they that is more civilised then going down on 1 knew for a 30 seconds. 

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Rowett hasn't covered himself in glory or the club for that matter.  Countless times their fans have been caught out with racist chanting yet the club doesn't condemn then even when there's video evidence.  Yet they continue with their line of 'working with the community'.

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6 hours ago, BlueSi13 said:

You simply cannot separate taking the knee with Black Lives Matter.  Though a few on here are trying their best, it simply can't be done when their banners are all over the stadiums, logo's popping up on screens during play, presenters/pundits wearing badges, adverts during add breaks etc etc etc etc etc.  In the minds of most football fans, taking the knee begins and ends with BLM, not anti-racism.

 

People have long memories, we all remember the violence, the attacks on police, desecrating the cenotaph, vandalising Churchill's statue, the openly marxist call, to destroy capitalism, to abolish the police, destroy the nuclear family, open borders, for all white people to apologise for their "white-privilige", all while chanting "TAKE THE KNEE".  

 

As I posted earlier in this thread, if this was really all about fighting discrimination against of all forms, why does over half the country feel like it's significantly damaged race relations?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/27/black-lives-matter-has-increased-racial-tension-55-say-in-uk-poll

 

To break that poll down further, 44% of BAME respondents also think that it's made things worse.  Only 17% of respondents think it's actually done some good.

 

I personally wouldn't boo, but booing BLM does not mean you are booing black people.

 

Racism should be tackled in all forms.  But not expecting a backlash following the scenes we saw over the summer was naive at best.  

image.thumb.png.070b3d2d5e4d526fb605fa076d501d42.png

 

 

That is one of the best post i have ever seen. Concise and balanced. Brilliant mate.

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That is one of the best post i have ever seen. Concise and balanced. Brilliant mate.

 
I agree, taking the knee has now lost all meaning but has become a ritual before a game can start. BLM is a political movement with a wider agenda than equal treatment for black /individuals/players; itself  an aim I fully agree with. 

 

In registering with the Financial Conduct Authority,BLM stated "The society’s purpose is listed as a “national campaigning organisation which supports black African and black Caribbean communities in the UK”. 
There should be equal treatment for all, not just these communities. Coming back to this definition that BLM uses, would  - for example- Jude Bellingham (white English dad, black African mum) fall within the definition? The original post says 44% of BAME communities think the movement has worsened the situation, but I have not seen anything from BLM saying all ethnic communities are included within their agenda. Can anyone enlighten me please?
 
 
 
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https://www.espn.co.uk/football/millwall/story/4255961/pfa-defend-players-taking-knee-after-millwall-fans-boo

 

"The perpetrators at Millwall should be easily traced given stadium restrictions and we call on the club to act swiftly to identify the section of the crowd who booed the players," the PFA said.

"Whilst booing is not a crime, it is a sad indictment of the lack of understanding and empathy for the players' fight against racism and discrimination."

 

Are they wanting banning orders for anyone who booed? Why do they need to be identified?

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41 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

https://www.espn.co.uk/football/millwall/story/4255961/pfa-defend-players-taking-knee-after-millwall-fans-boo

 

"The perpetrators at Millwall should be easily traced given stadium restrictions and we call on the club to act swiftly to identify the section of the crowd who booed the players," the PFA said.

"Whilst booing is not a crime, it is a sad indictment of the lack of understanding and empathy for the players' fight against racism and discrimination."

 

Are they wanting banning orders for anyone who booed? Why do they need to be identified?

They don't ban fans for racist chanting so I'm sure they'll be fine.

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Very interested to hear how/what media you guys are getting on this.

 

Being US based I was appalled at what I’d seen this year and so have donated to legal funds and joined peaceful protests in my local city here. People peacefully waving BLM cards at gatherings and marching with police in some cases too. I’m aware that it hasn’t been all rosy in other cities, far from it, but in fairness this has happened far too much to the community for people to be silent anymore.
 

I then tell some friends back home (U.K.) about the movement here and what I’ve done to support and get called a Marxist/ Anarchist/ Communist and accused of being ‘an apologist’? So I am genuinely curious about why it feels very different across the two countries?

 

The only time I can trace back accusations of ‘Marxism’ is where the founder of BLM had said she wanted the group to be a wave like movement in the same way that was. The rest I’ve found is far right media making quotes up. Certainly nothing trustworthy. Also the concept of defunding the police is a US construct because funding is pointed toward things like upkeep of actual tanks and high powered weapons rather than protecting civilians in some states. It doesn’t mean they want to remove the police from streets; rather repurpose and redeploy using different methods. By all accounts where they’ve done that already in states it’s worked well. 

 

Please someone enlighten me how we’ve got one country where there are bouts of injustice almost weekly on this topic, and another where the mindset seems to be to boo an anti-racist movement because it’s supposedly ‘Marxist’ and wants to take ‘police off the streets’? Do we really have priorities right in Britain? When the first thought is these two arguments, and claiming the dreaded ‘All Lives Matter’? Should there be a BLM U.K. set of objectives rather than using the US version? 
 

Tell me what’s going on please!

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Millwall fans seem very pleased with the outcome and happy to support the initiatives the club will be doing tonight ie joining together and standing behind the anti racism banner.

That are even more pleased they were the club who stood up to the main stream media and the lefty woke liberals.

Stated they are pleased with the support from fans around the country and looking forward to tonight’s game. 
So perhaps after all this they are not just racist Neanderthals and were truly against the BLM political ideology.

Doubt there will be as much press reporting of the recent updates.

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If we have Millwall in the cup anytime soon with fans, I know what I’m doing to get their supporters riled up. 
 

My last word on that matter is that we’ve got an awful lot of people here who don’t face the same discrimination as black or non white people (and same with the vast majority of Millwall fans) who have an opinion on stopping racism. Ultimately in that sense, we are here to support what decisions of those who do face that discrimination. I’d be really interested to know how Romeo at Millwall seems about the situation - if he’s happy with what Millwall intend that’s good enough for me. In the same way I totally respect Les Ferdinand’s opinion.
 

What I don’t respect is the 56 year old Millwall supporting Dave from Beckingham, Kent whose never had been stop searched or discriminated in a job dictating the argument against racism. 

Edited by Cardiff_Fox
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49 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

What I don’t respect is the 56 year old Millwall supporting Dave from Beckingham, Kent whose never had been stop searched or discriminated in a job dictating the argument against racism. 

With the greatest of respect, that's irrelevant.

 

You're perfectly entitled to have an opinion on something, so long as you've given it some calm and reasoned thought.

 

To say otherwise is like saying, a person who hasn't been the victim of a paramilitary group, has no right to have an opinion on the troubles in Northern Ireland.   Or a man has no right to an opinion on abortion.

 

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30 minutes ago, worth_the_wait said:

With the greatest of respect, that's irrelevant.

 

You're perfectly entitled to have an opinion on something, so long as you've given it some calm and reasoned thought.

 

To say otherwise is like saying, a person who hasn't been the victim of a paramilitary group, has no right to have an opinion on the troubles in Northern Ireland.   Or a man has no right to an opinion on abortion.

 


Your comparison of N.Ireland is completely irrelevant in my view, as there’s a link. The people behind the determination of N.Ireland should be Northern Irish - not English - you’ve then used the extreme example of a terrorist attack.
 

And yes a man has no right to an opinion on abortion, unless it’s a child of his own. 
 

Just to say I’m wording my English wrong to say no right to opinion, yes have an opinion but don’t dictate the topic of which you have no direct sufferer or decision maker of. As per what Millwall fans have done 

Edited by Cardiff_Fox
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