Fox In The Box 90

No hard border with the technology or checks no one can ever describe.

Its only ever been about party politics and the furthering of careers, right from david cameron calling a referendum. He didnt want to lose a few seats to UKIP and wanted to silence the eurosceptics in his party. It was never about actually leaving. Look at Boris' face the day after the referendum when the reality sunk in that he had won. He spent the campaign pandering to a certain "audience" all the time assuming he would lose and hoping to lose as narrowly as possible to have cameron at his weakest. Instead, his audience fell for his, and others twaddle. Now he has to now pretend forever brexit is a good idea.

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In your little brexit echo chamber yes.

Why is anyone listening to you? They arent.

You are in the same pigeon hole though arent you. None of you are going to get what you want, and especially not your idea. Yet you all make up the barely over half of the UK that voted leave.

If you assume that manufacturers wont need materials or components for their products that need to cross borders, that manufacturers will happily want to shrink their own markets, that consumers will like having less choice, and will like to pay more for that priveledge, maybe. But weve already seen that isnt the case. This also directly contradicts the people youve voted to agree with like Rees Mogg and the ERG no dealers who take their economic advice from Patrick Minford. Their whole argument was prices would come down when we dropped tariffs as we would be open to the whole world, and that the price to pay for this was our own farming and manufacturing industries would be destroyed. But theres a perfect illustration.youre all brexiteers yet your viewpoints are a confused muddle of contradictions and youve all ended up on the same side of the argument not getting what you want.

So youre one of these we dont need trade deals lets go wto people then. Either you think we will build, grow and provide every possible service here or you think trading on wto terms whilst our closest trading partners have preferential deals with each other and 70+ countries and markets will be better. So explain now why you believe trading on wto terms whilst our closest trading partners have preferential deals with each other and 70+ countries and markets is better. Or explain your "nationalised" industry plan. What will make that better?

You dont have an argument. Youve got immigration and not liking globalisation. Its hardly an outward looking viewpoint and hardly fits with our necessity to find new trade deals either

Yes youre right brexit has deranged the country. Because no one can ever advance the conversation beyond "we voted to leave". You talk about creating a better society but you, or any other leave voter cant explain what will be better, except to: a) talk about immigration numbers as if its some "positive" when many people have absolutely no problem with immigration numbers, are aware of powers the UK has but chooses not to use, and are aware of government figures that back up the idea wage compression is either not happening in the vast majority of industries due to immigration or wage compression is its due to other factors. b) you resort to talking about "control" and "sovereignty" and all of this. Not withstanding the fact we have many ELECTED representatives that are complete arseholes, people on your side genuinely seem to think there will be no involvement with supernational courts anymore and you didnt elect the WTO, the people who will approve our trade schedules, the civil service, the attorney general, the queen.....the list goes on. It just makes your sovereignty argument look silly. c) you talk about ****ing FISH when we have enormous employers like JLR, Nissan, Honda, Airbus and many many more explicitly telling us exactly why brexit will be so bad, some of who are already making redundancies, whilst we grow an industry thats worth about 0.5% of GDP assuming either we totally change our diets and eat more fish or the tariffs are low enough we can still sell into europe. D) the point ive made many times still remains. YOUR side invented project fear. Project fear was invented to shut up people who predicted down sides to brexit, it was to make sure they were ignored. You cannot in any way reconcile the creation of project fear, with saying you dont mind being hit in the pocket. Youve absolutely tied yourself in knots by saying i think the predictions of the remain side are correct, and the leave side are false. However i will also deride the remain side and vote for leave whilst ignoring my own sides campaign and believing remain Why cant you, or anyone else just explain what you think will be better after brexit for everyone. Everyone who isnt you. Without resorting to all the tired soundbites anyone can instantly destroy

1) no i dont feel sorry for him in any way i think he is a hate preaching goon 2) it doesnt say more about me than them, as i am not a hate preaching goon and people who follow him largely are. Tommy robinson yaxley lennon twatsford is soft spoken and level headed? Go and have a lie down and stop looking from the outside in.

Tommy Robinson Yaxley Lennon is an absolute shittard and so are his braindead hate filled followers.

No bad consequences of brexit. Only considerable upsides.

Kids dont tend to be really old, really racist or in the ERG though so theyd probably not go on a protest for hard brexit.

With regards to project fear youre simply talking guff. 61% of people would accept significant damage to the econony and 40% of people (4 in 10 leavers) would happily lose their job, or see their wife or kids lose theirs? Pull the other one its got bells on. And if those absolutely ridiculous numbers were true, why is project fear even a thing? If 61% of people accept significant economic damage, then why do people on the leave side do everything to make people ignore experts telling them there will be significant economic damage? Your first paragraph...people voted to take back sovereignty so they could sign it back away. Alright lol. Softening attitudes towards immigration.... the UK could have enacted a stricter immigration policy anyway. Belgium and Germany do. We could have deported people if we wanted. WE chose not to. We were not forced into anything. Your interviews arent going to collect very good data. People are going to lie to you, come on be honest with yourself. No one is going to say the perceived "wrong things" to you. They just arent. And if UKIP had any purpose, theyd have all the answers on brexit. A party whos sole existence was to remove us from the EU. Having achieved their goal, they should have all the answers on how to be a great independent nation. But now theyre totally insignificant. You dont even understand the concept of cognitive dissonance. So wed better leave it there.

Youre giving leave voters way, way too much credit. Maybe SOME genuinely want to be poorer for the sake of "sovereignty" but this "sovereignty" is something we will be giving away any time we make a relationship of any kind with another country or trading bloc and it wont allow them to do anything they couldnt already do. I can boot out my MP they say. Well you already could so youve gained nothing. And just because the UK has "control" its not going to make laws that suit everyone every time. Everyone but the tiniest minority wanted to be BETTER off and thought leaving the EU would achieve that. Its because its obvious that it wont, at least for a long, long time, that voters have to pretend that "control" and "sovereignty"...things that cant be quantified or measured, are most important to them. They never were. Brexit is everything to everyone. THATS why it commanded a 52% vote. If your EEA/EFTA idea was put to the people v remain, it wouldnt win. If no deal was put to the people v remain, it wouldnt win either. The referendum was remain v norway +/canada +/ some sort of bespoke deal/ leave it to may to sort a deal/ no deal all in one. THATS why it won. Its anything to anyone, making it nothing. When you say people shouldnt be disqualified from using "project fear" its very simple. Experts from many fields have been HEAVILY derided for predictions of economic harm, job losses, loss of personal wealth. They have been branded as spreading fear and scaremongering. You cannot criticise someone under "project fear" if you think everything they are predicting is the collateral damage of getting what you want, because you agree with them. And are you so gullible to think when you do your research people are telling you the truth ALL the time? How many people have you researched that have said "i hate foreigners"?? Compare that to how many people out there GENUINELY hate foreigners. There are millions. Dont try and twist what i said into "every leave voter is racist" i did not say that. I am saying a proportion of voters enough to be a psychgraphic within leave would hold that opinion. But they arent going to tell you that, theyll cover it up with control, sovereignty etc. Ill absolutely sum up the whole debate for you. NO ONE wanted to leave the EU. There was a growing UKIP resurgence going on and pressure within the conservatives, so cameron called a referendum. Everyone believed remain would win. But people like Boris wanted to lose as narrowly as possible to weaken cameron to further their own career. Other politicians just wanted to turn the UK into a complete deregulated capitalist nation for their own gains like Rees Mogg. They started campaigning and knew EXACTLY what buttons to press with the public. Breaking point posters, dont listen to experts, more money for this that and the other. The public walked into it like a mouse into a mousetrap and delivered a leave vote. NONE OF THEM had planned for it or had a clue what theyd do next. NONE OF THEM want responsibility either. They want to hide behind may and throw tomatoes and bleat afterwards if ONLY WED DONE IT MY WAY we would be better off.

And hes right too.

So you think that when we sign our own trade arrangements supernational courts sitting in arbitration of BOTH sides wont exist? And if the monetary loss isnt a concern why has so much effort from your side been put in to deride people with exactly that view. People have told you youd be worse off and they were castigated for it for creating project fear. Youre agreeing with them that youll be worse off despite your side criticising them. Its a point of view making no sense. Cognitive dissonance

Well brexit will have to be delayed then. Because each possibility is being voted down. If you oppose mays deal And oppose no deal And oppose remaining And oppose a second referendum What are you supposed to support? The unicorn + deal that doesnt exist and wont ever exist

Its not that they havent tried to understand leave voters, its that theyve tried to understand them from every angle and cant, led to their decision by charlatans who are obviously lying THEIR euroscepticism stands to make them richer. The typical leave voter's euroscepticism only serves to make themselves worse off and strip themselves of their own rights and priveleges. There is obviously reform needed within the EU. It is not a perfect institution. The answer to reform was not to burn down your house and live in a tent instead though.

Requiring the "spirit of the blitz" to get through our own decision to break a mutually beneficial relationship. People actually say this. Go stick "vote brexit - we survived a war" on the side of a bus. So appealing.

Fish Blue passport Different looking 50p Being able to go "haha i won" at people who voted remain despite now being poorer and living with cognitive dissonance forever.

It would be interesting if there was a second referendum what the leave side would campaign on, given everything they said has proven to be rubbish. I suppose it would be all the evidence brexit is a disaster, tariffs, job losses we have already witnessed, cancelled ferry contracts, no 350 million per week, irish border problems, losing out on the japan trade deal, the german car industry not rescuing us, them seemingly not desperately needing us, hormone injected food, our proposed wto trading schedule already being rejected, vote leave being breaking electoral law, prominent campaigners moving their HQs and applying for EU citizenships, prominent campaigners moving hedge funds to Dublin, medicine shortages, a worthless investment into Gallileo, the voting demographics and polling showing remain would now be the majority, reduced shared security, the falling value of the pound, losing our own freedom of movement, 3 different brexit secretaries all doing nothing and not realising dover was important Vs Fish Blue passports Endless comparisons to war We wuz betrayed And we wuz betrayed would probably still win.

Extend article 50 for as long as it takes to achieve an acceptable deal that means: We wont get poorer Jobs are safeguarded GFA is upheld We have the infastructure to cope with additional customs checks and the impact of tariffs And if that deal is never found, we never leave. Thats it.

Id assume you voted leave which is your decision, but how do you think brexit will make YOUR life better than it is now? Only ways i can really see are those invested in growing markets, those still going down the "sovereignty" route which remains mostly undefined, or genuine racists which i assume you definitely are not one.