A Letter To The Terrorists, From London

[lush]

I'm just taking the word from a reliable source like your taking someone's word that Al-Qaeda are behind the attacks. However, any individual who can think for themselves knows that anyone in the world could have put that site together.

134845[/snapback]

What your saying is, that the msnbc tv translator is more believerble, thats fair enough, but he doesnt point out ANY error

How believerble is he to you now?

[Fox Shagger]

If a website that could have even been created by my little brother is what you believe in that is fine by me, but I believe in other things. Everyone has different opinions. I don't wish to debate any longer cos i come to this website to view LCFC news rather than to debate. Peace.

[lush]

Do you think the families of those who have been killed feel a loss right now?

134813[/snapback]

Don't be so bloody stupid!

Of course there are families who are grieving, and rightly so. There are families who will be wondering how they can support relatives who will be permanently disabled, or shocked by the events which took place yesterday.

But if the rest of us are going to get hysterical, then the insurgents have won. If we don't stiffen our upper lips, gird our loins, and get back to normality, then again they've won.

Don't get me wrong, I was in tears yesterday, but today we draw strength from our resolve, and from those victims who in the coming months will overcome their injuries, whether physical or mental, and vow not to give in to the actions of those who, in all intents and purposes, are bullies of the worst kind.

I'm lucky not to know anyone involved yesterday to any degree. I will not be looking over my shoulder and giving those responsible the satisfaction of my fear.

Does the username Dunabuggy mean anything to you?

134846[/snapback]

If the families have lost, the Islamic insurgents have won, something.

A football team doesnt win the league by winning one game. This was one game, and they beat us, but they havnt and they wont win the league.

Whos onabout hysterical? Not me, im talking about winning, and the first road to victory, is putting blair in jail.

To your next point, and continuing my last, blair is NO different lisa, hes a very evil b@rstard, trust me. When he says `we` on tv over the last 30 hours, he doesnt speak for all of us who are against his war, but he and HIS media inflict that impression upon the guallable who listen.

No we should not show fear, but i wouldnt be quick to enter London either, particuly now that we have the olympics there.

No, what is it?

[lush]

If a website that could have even been created by my little brother is what you believe in that is fine by me, but I believe in other things. Everyone has different opinions. I don't wish to debate any longer cos i come to this website to view LCFC news rather than to debate. Peace.

134854[/snapback]

what you mean is, youve lost the argument, and your quietly slipping away.

I take it that tv guy is much less believerble B)

[Guest]

Do you think the families of those who have been killed feel a loss right now?

134813[/snapback]

Don't be so bloody stupid!

Of course there are families who are grieving, and rightly so. There are families who will be wondering how they can support relatives who will be permanently disabled, or shocked by the events which took place yesterday.

But if the rest of us are going to get hysterical, then the insurgents have won. If we don't stiffen our upper lips, gird our loins, and get back to normality, then again they've won.

Don't get me wrong, I was in tears yesterday, but today we draw strength from our resolve, and from those victims who in the coming months will overcome their injuries, whether physical or mental, and vow not to give in to the actions of those who, in all intents and purposes, are bullies of the worst kind.

I'm lucky not to know anyone involved yesterday to any degree. I will not be looking over my shoulder and giving those responsible the satisfaction of my fear.

Does the username Dunabuggy mean anything to you?

134846[/snapback]

If the families have lost, the Islamic insurgents have won, something.

A football team doesnt win the league by winning one game. This was one game, and they beat us, but they havnt and they wont win the league.

Whos onabout hysterical? Not me, im talking about winning, and the first road to victory, is putting blair in jail.

To your next point, and continuing my last, blair is NO different lisa, hes a very evil b@rstard, trust me. When he says `we` on tv over the last 30 hours, he doesnt speak for all of us who are against his war, but he and HIS media inflict that impression upon the guallable who listen.

No we should not show fear, but i wouldnt be quick to enter London either, particuly now that we have the olympics there.

No, what is it?

134861[/snapback]

If the loss of 50 lives is that much of a 'victory', then it makes the whole thing even more pathetic. All it is, is the icing on the cake if they get their way, which is the people of this country panicked and in fear, and our troops out of Iraq, and possibly the persecution of Muslims who would then be turned to see their sick agenda as being the way forwards.

It's not going to happen ergo they have won nothing, and they have won nothing with a tragic cost to us.

As for Blair, if the people of this country felt so strongly, they would have got up of their arses and voted him out. The fact is they didn't, and that's down to either apathy, a lack of any viable alternative or both.

Plus Blair will not be going to jail. The Attorney General has said going to war was legal, and no war crimes committed by him, so unless he's done some other criminal act then you're making no sense.

Dunabuggy has the same style of argument, and you know it.

[Thracian]

All you've done is end some of our lives, and ruin some more. How is that going to help you? You don't get rewarded for this kind of crap.

source

134623[/snapback]

Victory to the islamic insurgents then

134717[/snapback]

I don't think so.

134745[/snapback]

MORE than FIFTY people have died, its likely that even more have and will die, hundreds have been injured, thousands have had their lives disturbed and millions are feeling bitterly disapionted, YES, it was a victory for the Islamic insurgents.

If you dont believe me, ask the loved ones of those who died if they won?

No?

Thought not.

134773[/snapback]

There were no winners or losers. Wars don't really determine winners and losers.

Only conquerors/ occupiers and oppressed. With time the balance changes but always, sometimes for centuries, the hatreds remain often never to be fully healed.

Those who died will have families some who will preach forgiveness, some who will harbour hatred others who will feel numb, retailiate or wish and try to reap revenge. It will not purge their despair and it will not bring them happiness.

Only faith just might bring them some comfort.

Somewhere, and almost certainly somewhere in this tolerant country of ours, people will be celebrating the "success" of their operation, wallowing in the publicity, bathing in their achievement (presumably on behalf of Islam).

They are different to me. My beliefs would not allow me to take life at random. My belief would not allow me to kill people who could not defend themselves, who had no reason to be killed, who were women, who were fathers trying to earn the next meals for their children, who were shortsighted, who were disabled, who were trying to be of service to others.

Nor could I kill or risk killing children.

They are different to me these people.

And one day, perhaps years ahead, perhaps when they are about to meet the maker they so shamefully (and supposedly fearfully claim to represent), will they perhaps reflect on their work this day.

And will they eventually be ashamed, perhaps as the result of a western surgeon saving their life or a Christian nurse giving comfort in their last hours. Who knows.

And will their children be ashamed or will they be brainwashed first, denied the right to feel empathy, sympathy and love for their fellow man?.

Will those responsible go to their God and face Him not just with admission that they destroyed the lives of helpless, truly defenceless souls but with the acknowledgement they have also corrupted the minds of their own sons or daughters?.

No. They have not won. The victims families will have their dignity in the end.

The perpetrators will have to live with what serves for their consciences. And, no we should not retaliate.

For once in our history we should tell the world of our disgust.

We should, with permission, show the pictures of our dead and tell the world who they were and what they were. We should celebrate their lives and the lives of those they cared for.

We should announced that their deaths will not be in vain.

We should announce that we will no longer go to War except in defence of our own land or that of the Union of Europe if we continue to belong.

We should leave Iraq not because of anything to do with these killings but because we have no right to be there. It is not our country. They are not our people and we have no mandate to police the world or dictate its way of life. It has already cost numerous lives and for what?

Those are battles for its own people to live and die for.

We can and should set an example to other nations. We can and should offer advice to the world when asked. We can and should help peoples of the world in times of crisis. We can and should advocate fair systems of Government where none exist.

But we should get our message across with persuasion instead of fighting wars that are not on our own territory.

We should at long last start setting a real example. We should start making the Christian way of life something to be truly proud of again. That would be a legacy for our dead that would be truly worthy of them and would represent a true victory. One that served the greater good.

[lush]

134861[/snapback]

If the loss of 50 lives is that much of a 'victory', then it makes the whole thing even more pathetic.

It's not going to happen ergo they have won nothing, and they have won nothing with a tragic cost to us.

As for Blair, if the people of this country felt so strongly, they would have got up of their arses and voted him out. The fact is they didn't, and that's down to either apathy, a lack of any viable alternative or both.

Plus Blair will not be going to jail. The Attorney General has said going to war was legal, and no war crimes committed by him, so unless he's done some other criminal act then you're making no sense.

Dunabuggy has the same style of argument, and you know it.

134874[/snapback]

Pathetic is WHAT they are.

The next point is a complete contradiction.

Apathy, and partly due to various things from the fact that most of us have one or many of the following, job, car, home/mortgage, 1 or more holidays Pa, sky tv, internet etc etc etc, basicly we have a decent life in terms of comfort, and we human LOVE that.

The deal is, will those comforts last?

PLUS, blairs mob and the media dont like change, it disrupts business. So they work together AT US to make the gualable think everythings ok and theres no need to worry, then vote against.

I know he wont go to jail, i never said he will, i said he should for the crimes against humanity in Iraq, but more importantly, England.

Good on that dunabugy character.

[Guest]

If the loss of 50 lives is that much of a 'victory', then it makes the whole thing even more pathetic.

It's not going to happen ergo they have won nothing, and they have won nothing with a tragic cost to us.

As for Blair, if the people of this country felt so strongly, they would have got up of their arses and voted him out.  The fact is they didn't, and that's down to either apathy, a lack of any viable alternative or both.

Plus Blair will not be going to jail.  The Attorney General has said going to war was legal, and no war crimes committed by him, so unless he's done some other criminal act then you're making no sense.

Dunabuggy has the same style of argument, and you know it.

134874[/snapback]

Pathetic is WHAT they are.

The next point is a complete contradiction.

I'm sorry, but there's no contradiction in my argument, and clouding the issue with diatribe that's barely intelligible will not help you.

Apathy, and partly due to various things from the fact that most of us have one or many of the following, job, car, home/mortgage, 1 or more holidays Pa, sky tv, internet etc etc etc, basicly we have a decent life in terms of comfort, and we human LOVE that.

The deal is, will those comforts last?

Well all that means is that people value their own existence over the war in Iraq. The majority of the British public were and still are against it, but not enough to make their feelings known by voting against the Government that took us there.

PLUS, blairs mob and the media dont like change, it disrupts business. So they work together AT US to make the gualable think everythings ok and theres no need to worry, then vote against.

I don't see the majority of the British public being 'gualable' whatever that is. I aasume you mean 'gullible'? Paranoid claptrap. I've got a mind of my own, it refuses to be brainwashed by anyone.

What proof do you have that this Government refuses to accept change? Where's the evidence that business will be affected?

Since coming into power, Sterling has strengthened, interest rates have fallen from the levels 'enjoyed' under the Tories, and some areas of manufacturing have even managed recovery. The CIPS Managers survey has been showing increasing levels of confidence amongst British companies, with most seeing increasing turnover.

Please do not cite MG Rover, as there are other issues surrounding that collapse, and one shower does not mean it's monsoon season.

I know he wont go to jail, i never said he will, i said he should for the crimes against humanity in Iraq, but more importantly, England.

You have expresed a desire that Blair is imprisoned for whatever crimes you perceive to have been committed. I was merely giving you my opinion that he won't be.

[Thracian]

If the loss of 50 lives is that much of a 'victory', then it makes the whole thing even more pathetic.

It's not going to happen ergo they have won nothing, and they have won nothing with a tragic cost to us.

As for Blair, if the people of this country felt so strongly, they would have got up of their arses and voted him out.  The fact is they didn't, and that's down to either apathy, a lack of any viable alternative or both.

Plus Blair will not be going to jail.  The Attorney General has said going to war was legal, and no war crimes committed by him, so unless he's done some other criminal act then you're making no sense.

Dunabuggy has the same style of argument, and you know it.

134874[/snapback]

Pathetic is WHAT they are.

The next point is a complete contradiction.

I'm sorry, but there's no contradiction in my argument, and clouding the issue with diatribe that's barely intelligible will not help you.

Apathy, and partly due to various things from the fact that most of us have one or many of the following, job, car, home/mortgage, 1 or more holidays Pa, sky tv, internet etc etc etc, basicly we have a decent life in terms of comfort, and we human LOVE that.

The deal is, will those comforts last?

Well all that means is that people value their own existence over the war in Iraq. The majority of the British public were and still are against it, but not enough to make their feelings known by voting against the Government that took us there.

PLUS, blairs mob and the media dont like change, it disrupts business. So they work together AT US to make the gualable think everythings ok and theres no need to worry, then vote against.

I don't see the majority of the British public being 'gualable' whatever that is. I aasume you mean 'gullible'? Paranoid claptrap. I've got a mind of my own, it refuses to be brainwashed by anyone.

What proof do you have that this Government refuses to accept change? Where's the evidence that business will be affected?

Since coming into power, Sterling has strengthened, interest rates have fallen from the levels 'enjoyed' under the Tories, and some areas of manufacturing have even managed recovery. The CIPS Managers survey has been showing increasing levels of confidence amongst British companies, with most seeing increasing turnover.

Please do not cite MG Rover, as there are other issues surrounding that collapse, and one shower does not mean it's monsoon season.

I know he wont go to jail, i never said he will, i said he should for the crimes against humanity in Iraq, but more importantly, England.

You have expresed a desire that Blair is imprisoned for whatever crimes you perceive to have been committed. I was merely giving you my opinion that he won't be.

134896[/snapback]

It's a bit of an aside now but I would love a second independent opinion as to whether Tony Blair really has a mandate to be in Iraq. Very iffy in my view.

[lush]

Well all that means is that people value their own existence over the war in Iraq.  The majority of the British public were and still are against it, but not enough to make their feelings known by voting against the Government that took us there.

I don't see the majority of the British public being 'gualable' whatever that is.  I aasume you mean 'gullible'?  Paranoid claptrap.   I've got a mind of my own, it refuses to be brainwashed by anyone.

What proof do you have that this Government refuses to accept change?  Where's the evidence that business will be affected?

Since coming into power, Sterling has strengthened, interest rates have fallen from the levels 'enjoyed' under the Tories, and some areas of manufacturing have even managed recovery.  The CIPS Managers survey has been showing increasing levels of confidence amongst British companies, with most seeing increasing turnover.

Please do not cite MG Rover, as there are other issues surrounding that collapse, and one shower does not mean it's monsoon season.

You have expresed a desire that Blair is imprisoned for whatever crimes you perceive to have been committed.  I was merely giving you my opinion that he won't be.

134896[/snapback]

I couldnt be bothered to educate you more with the contradiction thing, read again perhaps.

I agree with the first point here tho about people and iraq, altho many did vote away from blair for it, just not enough.

Im glad you didnt vote for the old gang, and that you wasnt guallable.

You missed my point about business and change. THEY, the politicians and in particular new labour dont want change, they have thousands of pounds worth of taxes flowing into their bank accounts every week.

The media need to sell advertising, if they know what political staus is in power, they know how to work out what we want.

A different government or unrest in society is a diesease to their wallets.

I suggest you contact an economic expert about the near to late future of our economic growth. The manufacturing industry is a shambles. jobs are lost to other parts of the world, weekly.

Plus, ever wondered how many jobs the mobile phone networks have generated? Not just in network staff, but the need of a phone to access work, it breeds phonomally. NONE of them have been to the credit of new labour. Ever wondered what the unemployment rate is, its not 1 million, theres 2 million been moved over to sick benefit who never get a mention, because its not good for political business.

It was said only a week ago, that new labour tried keeping the collapse of mg rover quiet in the run up to the election, hmm a party that cares

`Plus Blair will not be going to jail. The Attorney General has said going to war was legal, and no war crimes committed by him, so unless he's done some other criminal act then you're making no sense`

That statement suggests to me you thought i said he would?

[TrickyTrev]

You missed my point about business and change. THEY, the politicians and in particular new labour dont want change, they have thousands of pounds worth of taxes flowing into their bank accounts every week.

The media need to sell advertising, if they know what political staus is in power, they know how to work out what we want.

A different government or unrest in society is a diesease to their wallets.

What are you talking about? Politicians are salaried, that is all members of parliament if they are part of the government or not. They have to claim expenses for any costs they may have i.e travel arrangements and what not. This is checked by an idependent panel and released as public information, something brought in for the first time by THIS government.

I'm not gong to bother with your arguemnts about 'the media' as if they have one voice. Anyoen with any intelligence realises that The Daily Mail clearly have a different political agenda from The Guardian so to say they all act as a homogeneous group lookign to maxamising advertisinhg revenue is absurd.

The only concession I will make is that New Labour command undue support from Murdoch, Due to their stance on Iraq. However, Murdoch's political influence is usually to the right of the labour party and he causes them more problems than he solves.

I suggest you contact an economic expert about the near to late future of our economic growth

We are as vulnerable to a downturn in the business cycle as anyone but your sttement is highly debatable. We have avoided recession at a time where the rest of the world has struggled. This can be attributed to sound and flexible monetry policy form the Bank Of England that THIS govenremnt made independent.

Yes our manufacturing industy is in irretrievable decline, the wrot was set with Thatcher there, but we are now succesfully converting to a service economy. So much so that we are seen as world leaders in high risk Insurance.

This government is far form perfect, but this country could be ina far worse state and I am sure it would be if either of the other two got in power. Thre lesser of three evils.

[lush]

Anyoen with any intelligence realises that The Daily Mail clearly have a different political agenda from The Guardian so to say they all act as a homogeneous group lookign to maxamising advertisinhg revenue is absurd.

The only concession I will make is that New Labour command undue support from Murdoch, Due to their stance on Iraq. However, Murdoch's political influence is usually to the right of the labour party and he causes them more problems than he solves.

We have avoided recession at a time where the rest of the world has struggled. This can be attributed to sound and flexible monetry policy form the Bank Of England that THIS govenremnt made independent.

Yes our manufacturing industy is in irretrievable decline, the wrot was set with Thatcher there

This government is far form perfect, but this country could be ina far worse state and I am sure it would be if either of the other two got in power. Thre lesser of three evils.

134932[/snapback]

They all need to earn a living.

Well murdoch is a big fan of new labour now, and NL have marxist style people working at the top of their table. Thats not right wing, thats left wing madness.

Recessions work in cycles, and the next is on the way.

maybe with thatcher, but highly encouraged under new labour, then destroying the working class jobs, in favour of sending work abroad. NL are suppossed to care about the working classes their new colours are globalisation.

Theres no difference between the main 3 in terms of economic interests.

i`d much rather the lib dems, than the other 2.

[TrickyTrev]

Well murdoch is a big fan of new labour now, and NL have marxist style people working at the top of their table. Thats not right wing, thats left wing madness.

What are you talking about? There is nothign remotely marxist or socialist about this present Labour party. Who are these Marxists you talk about? Figment of your imagination I feel.

Recessions work in cycles, and the next is on the way.

and that is the governments fault? They have already managed to take our economy through sustained eocnomic growth where as the rest of the world was experiencing a global recession.

NL are suppossed to care about the working classes rolleyes.gif their new colours are globalisation

Old school class based politics are dissapearing because there is no large workign class majority working in the manufacturing industry. I agree the governemnt should do more in temrs of wealth distribution but you were accusing them of being Marxists earlier. Which are they, champagne socialists or commies? The truth is obviously somewhere in between.

As for Globilisation, it exists. What is your point? Do you just think it is another bad word you can associate the governemnt with? Do you actually know what you mean? by the term globilisation? It seems to me a lot of people talk about it with no real knowledge of the subject matter.

[Guest]

Lush, you know bugger all, to be fair. I quoted the CIPS Managers survey, which has been showing an upturn in confidence. You are obviously unaware of this data, which the RBS is happy to quote and use in their daily updates.

I work for a manufacturing based company; our profit level is higher than budget for the year to date, and is higher than last year's figure. Our customers are showing confidence, hence the increase in orders, and our suppliers are also reporting an upturn in fortune.

I distinctly told you not to use MG Rover as an example; Phoenix have been asset-stripping, the Government's hands have been tied by EU legislation, which is why they have done nothing.

Tricky Trev has made some valid points. I suggest you re-read these. Then I would recommend you put your points to an economic expert, who will laugh you out of his or her office.

As for my vote

[Fox Shagger]

Phony 'Al-Qaeda' Responsibility Claim a Proven Hoax

Don't wanna debate just wanna let you guys know Al-Qaeda haven't been proven to be behind the attacks.

[Guest]

It's a bit of an aside now but I would love a second independent opinion as to whether Tony Blair really has a mandate to be in Iraq. Very iffy in my view.

134910[/snapback]

I think the US certainly have, and I get the feeling that Honest Tone is more interested in developing his, sorry, our nation's relationship with him, sorry, them.

[lush]

What are you talking about? There is nothign remotely marxist or socialist about this present Labour party. Who are these Marxists you talk about? Figment of your imagination I feel.

and that is the governments fault? They have already managed to take our economy through sustained eocnomic growth where as the rest of the world was experiencing a global recession.

Old school class based politics are dissapearing because there is no large workign class majority working in the manufacturing industry. I agree the governemnt should do more in temrs of wealth distribution but you were accusing them of being Marxists earlier. Which are they, champagne socialists or commies? The truth is obviously somewhere in between.

As for Globilisation, it exists. What is your point? Do you just think it is another bad word you can associate the governemnt with? Do you actually know what you mean? by the term globilisation? It seems to me a lot of people talk about it with no real knowledge of the subject matter.

134955[/snapback]

Chris heath, `mandy`i could tell you more, but i would have to research it and thats takes time.

I never said it was the governments fault.

Explain HOW theyve taken us to economic growth?

There are marxists, but not for the indigenous working class. The indigenous working class our their enemy, thats why they destroy their job opportunities.

Amazingly, alot of the NL members are just them very same people. the problem those people have, is they dont realise whats going on, only few have done so.

The way in which NL cons libs ukip use globalisation, is not for the benefit and morality of the people. The anti globalist movement, is a prime example of that.

[lush]

Phony 'Al-Qaeda' Responsibility Claim a Proven Hoax

Don't wanna debate just wanna let you guys know Al-Qaeda haven't been proven to be behind the attacks.

134959[/snapback]

Again Fox, where/what is the error?

[Guest]

There are marxists, but not for the indigenous working class. The indigenous working class our their enemy, thats why they destroy their job opportunities.

134969[/snapback]

I can hear Karl Marx turning in his grave. He's tearing up Das Kapital as I type.

I believe your English teacher is about to join him.

[lush]

Then your dont get involved much.

My English teacher was a true gentleman, i would find it a very hard pill to swallow had he been slaved into the darkened world you protect.

[Guest]

Then your dont get involved much.

My English teacher was a true gentleman, i would find it a very hard pill to swallow had he been slaved into the darkened world you protect.

134986[/snapback]

He might have been a gent, but he wasn't very good at his job!

[lush]

Then your dont get involved much.

My English teacher was a true gentleman, i would find it a very hard pill to swallow had he been slaved into the darkened world you protect.

134986[/snapback]

He might have been a gent, but he wasn't very good at his job!

134989[/snapback]

You are a bitter woman/man whatever you are

I suggest a darkened room.

[Guest]

Then your dont get involved much.

My English teacher was a true gentleman, i would find it a very hard pill to swallow had he been slaved into the darkened world you protect.

134986[/snapback]

He might have been a gent, but he wasn't very good at his job!

134989[/snapback]

You are a bitter woman/man whatever you are

I suggest a darkened room.

135000[/snapback]

Now I know you're an idiot!!

[lush]

Then your dont get involved much.

My English teacher was a true gentleman, i would find it a very hard pill to swallow had he been slaved into the darkened world you protect.

134986[/snapback]

He might have been a gent, but he wasn't very good at his job!

134989[/snapback]

You are a bitter woman/man whatever you are

I suggest a darkened room.

135000[/snapback]

Now I know you're an idiot!!

135004[/snapback]

Are you familiar with the phrase `it takes one to know one`?

[TrickyTrev]

Explain HOW theyve taken us to economic growth?

The single most important decision was to slash interest rates during 2001. Whilst many commentators were worrying about the housing market getting out of control the MPC predicted a global slowdown and saw the need for a stimulus in AD.

This decision would never have been made by a government controlled Bank Of England who forever put Inflation ahead of employment and growth to the detriment of the people.

It is also fairly obvious to me that new deal programmes have helped slash unemployment which utilises our workforce and allows us to work closer to full capacity.

Cutting unemployment whilst not suffering from serious inflation problems is a rarity in economics. It goes ot show that our supply side has been expanded at the same rate as aggrgate demand. I can specualte this is down to greater flexibility in working hours, de-regulation of buisiness, better transport and encouragemnt of entrepenuerialship through subsidies.