The Trial Of Geert Wilders

[Zingari]

fookin ell , i think people are waking up

[Trav Le Bleu]

fookin ell , i think people are waking up

On a Sunday morning?

[Guest Bilo]

But some of the issues aren't.

The constant kowtowing to religious groups of all hues, especially the way in which we pander to Muslims, needs to be addressed. They all expect to have a direct line to law makers as they believe they have to God.

My wife has to meet Muslim 'Community Leaders' as part of her job - and some of them will refuse to shake her hand. Will anyone say anything to them? Oh no, that would be far too 'culturally insensitive'.

Our neighbour is a decent, hard-working, honest bloke. He's is also a rampant bigot - but if you look at how society is continually shitting on him you can appreciate why. He continues to strive to work, despite redundancy, and continues to live in his Mum's house since she was put into a care home with dementia. Now, as he struggles to pay bills, he is threatened with eviction as they seek to sell the house to pay for her care costs. Meanwhile houses in the street are bought up for the resettlement of immigrants who receive benefits - they have heating, he doesn't. It's not really fair is it? He's being penalised in the face of others who are being treated.

Those on here who know me know I'm hardly a racist - but I do believe in fairness. If you act like a misogynistic twat (claiming it is Gods will) then I should be allowed to call you a misogynistic twat and refuse to have anything to do with you. If you live in the modest house you have lived in all your life then no one should make you homeless...and create another house to be used for the resettlement of immigrants, drug addicts or sex cases (as has been the case for the last 18 months here).

With Labour in free-fall and oblivious to the needs of those outside the ethnic communities, the Tories pointing at pot-holes and graffiti and the LibDems all but absent - the Far Right are the only ones addressing the local issues in my constituency. It is nothing short of a fucking outrageous dereliction of responsibility by the three main parties.

All very sensible and common sense but that's the thing, we should address the issues about which people are concerned rather than merely tell people how terrible the far-right are. I totally agree that we spend far too much time pussyfooting around religious groups, and that this is especially true of the government's policy towards Muslims. However, I sense that has much to do with the fact they haemorrhaged Muslim votes after Iraq to the Lib Dems and, more worryingly, the homophobic and bigoted RESPECT, the far-left's answer to the BNP in terms of religious based prejudice.

The way your local authority has treated your neighbour in relation to the way it falls over itself to give immigrants everything they need and quite a bit besides is New Labour policy in microcosm. People who have lived and worked in Britain all their lives are seeing people coming into Britain and getting an immediate unfair advantage, is there any wonder there's resentment of immigrants? That doesn't make the British people racist, but it makes them more likely to be tempted by racist parties who seem to offer a solution. The rise of the BNP is fairly and squarely the fault of New Labour and its unfair policies. This may sound spectacularly politically incorrect, but as with you, anyone who knows me will realise I'm no racist. You need only read some of my posts to work that out.

The main three parties aren't thick, they know that these are the issues that concern people. The problem is, ironically, that the main three parties aren't thick.

To tackle these issues requires an admission that the generous treatment of religious groups and immigrants is pissing people off and that could be a huge mistake for all three parties. For Labour, it would mean an admission that their past 13 years of kowtowing to Muslims and immigrants has failed to the extent that their traditional voters are going for extremist, far-right parties. Political suicide. For the Tories, it would risk the left-wing press hammering them into the ground with accusations of racist scaremongering. Less risky as the Mirror and Guardian are hardly Cameron lovers, but could alienate floating voters. As for the Lib Dems, they could lose all the Muslim voters they gained from Labour's disastrous foreign policy overnight. It would take balls for a party to come out and say these things, but if they did the far-right would be consigned to the history books.

[marbelladave]

The main three parties aren't thick, they know that these are the issues that concern people. The problem is, ironically, that the main three parties aren't thick.

To tackle these issues requires an admission that the generous treatment of religious groups and immigrants is pissing people off and that could be a huge mistake for all three parties. For Labour, it would mean an admission that their past 13 years of kowtowing to Muslims and immigrants has failed to the extent that their traditional voters are going for extremist, far-right parties. Political suicide. For the Tories, it would risk the left-wing press hammering them into the ground with accusations of racist scaremongering. Less risky as the Mirror and Guardian are hardly Cameron lovers, but could alienate floating voters. As for the Lib Dems, they could lose all the Muslim voters they gained from Labour's disastrous foreign policy overnight. It would take balls for a party to come out and say these things, but if they did the far-right would be consigned to the history books.

This paragraph is a simple summation of (almost) everything that is wrong with the government of this country.

Put simply all decisions are based on their impact to the (ruling) party, there effects on the country and it's people is irrelevant.

We know, for example, that the current government is delaying the tough decisions required to strengthen the economy simply to fook up the new Conservative government that we will (almost certainly) have after the election.

The tactic is simple, the Tories have to be seen to make the cuts, they will have no choice, this makes them unpopular, increasing NuLabours chance in the next election. For what it is worth, were the positions of the parties reversed I have no doubt the Tories would do pretty much the same thing.

Result, the economy is even more fooked than it needs to be, all for party political advantage.

Go through the last 10 years, every major decision made by the government were made in the best interests of the ruling party, not the country.

[davieG]

This paragraph is a simple summation of (almost) everything that is wrong with the government of this country.

Put simply all decisions are based on their impact to the (ruling) party, there effects on the country and it's people is irrelevant.

We know, for example, that the current government is delaying the tough decisions required to strengthen the economy simply to fook up the new Conservative government that we will (almost certainly) have after the election.

The tactic is simple, the Tories have to be seen to make the cuts, they will have no choice, this makes them unpopular, increasing NuLabours chance in the next election. For what it is worth, were the positions of the parties reversed I have no doubt the Tories would do pretty much the same thing.

Result, the economy is even more fooked than it needs to be, all for party political advantage.

Go through the last 10 years, every major decision made by the government were made in the best interests of the ruling party, not the country.

Agree and this is why I hate party politics.

Just to add I doubt invading Iraq was done for party political reasons more to make our position in the USA bed more cosy although maybe Blair thought it would have the same jingoistic response that Thatcher got from invading the Falklands which certainly kept her and the Tories in power.

[Zingari]

Global warming?

Thracian?

*cough*

I'm not sure if there is a strict , "can say this , can't say that" , about global warming , but there is an element of religious fervour about it, as expressed by none other than Boris Johnson ( of all people ) in reply to James Lovelocks almost hellfire and brimstone warnings

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/persona...-its-place.html

I'm not intending , and don't want to speak for him, but I think this is the type of attitude he may be reffering to.

OK no-one gets burnt at the stake for expressing opinions opposite to the accepted line , but maybe he has a general point about such issues taking on almost a sort of religious fervour .

Hopefully he may get back to this and answer more fully but he doen't seem as prolific as yesteryear

[Daggers]

You don't need to be in Holland. Freedom of speech has been continually eroded in this country and freedom of thought is forever having to compete with the constant, sometimes subtle, sometimes pounding mental conditioning of the Left's PC and political philosophy impositionists.

Global warming is the latest major example, following on from the Weapons of Mass Destruction bullshit and Labour's facilitating multiculturalism and immigration-by-stealth as opposed to concensus.

Pretty clear to me that he feels he can't speak his mind about global warming.

Simple question: what? Somehow I don't reckon we'll ever get close to an answer.

[Zingari]

ok , anyway , back to the main point of the thread

Geert Wilders, the anti-immigration Dutch politician banned from the UK last year for being a threat to race relations, could soon be prime minister of the Netherlands following the collapse of the Dutch coalition government at the weekend.

The government's fall, following a disagreement between the dominant Christian Democrat party and its coalition partner, Labour, over extending the country's Nato commitments in Afghanistan, means that a general election will have to take place within the next three months.

The most recent opinion polls suggest Wilders, leader of the populist, anti-immigration Freedom Party (PVV), will claim up to 25 seats in the new parliament, making it the second largest party after the Christian Democrats. Labour would get around 21 seats.

Of course, a lot can happen in three months, and Labour, which has benefited from its opposition to keeping Dutch troops in Afghanistan, could see its new-found popularity melt away in the heat of a general election campaign. The controversial Wilders, meanwhile, has reason to believe two high-profile brushes with authority over the next three months could increase his popularity among voters.

Wilders, who is described by the Muslim Council of Britain as "a relentless preacher of hate", is best known here for being banned from entering Britain in February 2009 when he was invited by two members of the House of Lords to a showing of his 17-minute "anti-Koran" film Fitna in the Palace of Westminster.

As a result of publicity from the ban, Wilders's party moved in to first place in opinion polls. He challenged the travel ban and had it overturned in October; he has since accepted a second invitation to the House of Lords and will address members on March 5 – which should do no harm to his poll rating in the run-up to the election.

Meanwhile in his home country, Wilders is on trial for inciting hatred and discrimination against Muslims and ethnic minorities – a trial he calls "a lawsuit against freedom of speech, democracy and the truth".

Wilders began his parliamentary career as an MP for the centre-right People's Party for Freedom and Democracy, before leaving to found his own party when he found himself at odds with the party line that Turkey should be allowed to begin accession talks with the EU.

Wilders went on to found the PVV as a right-wing, mostly libertarian party. Policies include a smaller state and lower taxation; a focus on education and more accessible healthcare; and elected mayors, police chiefs and prime ministers (currently, as in Britain, the Dutch vote for a political party). Perhaps the PVV policy most worrying for British tourists who enjoy weekends in Amsterdam is the party's harder line on recreational drugs.

But the PVV's flagship policy is its anti-immigration stance. The party proposes the ending of immigration from non-western countries – along with official recognition of the primacy of Christian, Jewish and humanist traditions.

Most of Wilders's racial policies are directed at Islam, which he sees as fascistic. He spent two years in his twenties working in Israel, during which time he travelled widely in the Arabic world, where he was reportedly deeply affected by the absence of democracy. In contrast, he sees Israel as a "true friend" and admires its Counter-terrorism policies.

Two years ago he told the Guardian: "I have a problem with Islamic tradition, culture, ideology. Not with Muslim people." However, he does promote a policy of repatriation for immigrants who offend.

Despite seemingly sharing many beliefs with far-right European parties, such as the BNP, Wilders rejects fascism. His criticism of homophobia, at least, sets him apart from such organisations. "My allies are not Le Pen or Haider. We'll never join up with the fascists and Mussolinis of Italy. I'm very afraid of being linked with the wrong rightist fascist groups," he says.

Politics aside, Wilders's courage is not in doubt: he has been sentenced to death by al-Qaeda and has a permanent police guard because of regular death threats from within the Netherlands. He sleeps at a different location every night and can only see his wife once a week. Wilders describes this regimented lifestyle as "a situation that I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy". He certainly has a lot of those.

http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/60055,news-c...s-to-lead-dutch

[Guest Bilo]

This would set a very bad precedent indeed if it actually happened, but I vaguely recall similar headlines about Jean-Marie Le Pen and the French NF a few years ago that came off to nothing. Still, this needs to be fought by the good people of Holland.

[Zingari]

This would set a very bad precedent indeed if it actually happened, but I vaguely recall similar headlines about Jean-Marie Le Pen and the French NF a few years ago that came off to nothing. Still, this needs to be fought by the good people of Holland.

Sadly , I think with the vacuum in Dutch politics at the moment , that Wilders could be very influencial in the next government,

this is what many commentators are saying

Wilders' party comes first or second in most opinion polls on the next election, and could win up to 24 seats in the 150-seat parliament after becoming the second biggest Dutch party in the European Parliament last year.

So far the CDA and VVD have left the door open to a coalition with Wilders. But in recent polls, just 27 percent of respondents said their reaction to a combination of the three in a cabinet would be 'positive' or 'very positive'.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLDE61M1...ype=marketsNews

[Zingari]

bump ;

should get quite interesting in the next few days

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11464025