The_Rorab

I can't remember which player it was, but a few seasons back wasn't there someone we had loaned out mentioning that absolutely no-one at the club had kept any sort of contact or dialogue with them whilst out on loan? It does feel like there are areas we lack sometimes when it comes to structural organisation and care.

There's a lot to say and none of it good but I just wanted to pick up on something a few people here have said about the Summer transfer window that has baffled me. I've seen at least 2 or 3 posts essentially saying well it's okay we won't have much money we can always sell KDH for 30mill or what have you. In what world is that a positive??? Sure, we'd have 30mill, but we'd be severely weakening ourselves Sheffield United style. Sure maybe we'd be able to use those funds to frankenstein ourselves more options elsewhere, but it boggles my mind that anyone can think that move would be positive for us.

I cannot fathom that we didn't seem to have any sort of backup option to signing Sensi if we knew it was contingent on selling someone. It's not as if we'd have been unsure how interested other clubs might have been in our players. Casadei left, so surely we could have at least loaned someone else in to replace him. They've had weeks to plan this. It's just negligence. Pure and simple.

The oh it's not his fault we just don't know what's happening behind the scenes you couldn't possibly ever hold someone accountable when you don't know exactly everything he's done, he should be given credit for previous things at the club just screams to me as a similar logic as some of the head in the sand Rodgers defenses that went on last year. Maybe that's harsh, but for me there's echoes of it in the idea that not knowing every single element of something or previous success makes someone above reproach. Obviously different circumstances and remits, but I'm of the opinion that despite having a great manager, we are still in all likelihood an absolute clownfest behind the scenes. Nothing has changed my mind on this, so thank god we're competent on the pitch right now and that largely distracts me from thinking about it. Hopefully we don't get any key injuries or anything going forward.

I do agree with you that securing loans must be difficult with a lot of different variables and there is definitely an oversimplification of the process in the eyes of someone frustrated by it. The issue for me isn't that we aren't seemingly able to loan academy players out, it's that basically every other club IS - we are largely the odd ones out in this, whether that's through failure or a difference in strategy or anything else. I looked at the number of loans we had out in the Prem I think last year and if I remember correctly we were one of like 2 teams with fewer than 10 loans out or something like that. (Apologies for the lack for specificity but I can't be arsed to trawl through my posts to fact check, but will if needed.) Surely it can't be the often touted no one is interested in them, unless we singularly in all of the Championship and Prem teams just have bad players that no-one wants, when everyone else does not. Why would every other club get rafts of loans and absolutely no-one be interested in our players? That argument largely makes zero sense unless you think our youth are uniquely shite. Whether by mistake or design, we don't seem to loan out players at anywhere near the rate of most other clubs. Again this isn't the be all and end all, we still have a great propensity for bringing through academy players into the first team, but it is something that sticks out compared to other teams. So you're right, it isn't a cushy job and likely has a lot of moving parts, but why we aren't showing the same level of output in generating loans as other clubs are is something I wonder about.

I think one thing that can be difficult to reconcile as a fan watching us right now is the thin line between adaptation and proficiency. From the looks of it, we are currently in a natural period where Maresca has been relatively tactically inflexible, and this is ostensibly because both he has his identity and style of football and he is attempting to bed that style into the squad. As a result he likely doesn't want to make changes or any drastic alterations because he believes his tactic will create chances and also the more they familiarise with it the better we should theoretically get, even if in the short-term it doesn't always work out. I don't expect to see him mess around with anything tactically for a good while, even if there are particularly bad games. If things spiral or just never pick up to a particularly high level I'd hope then that some form of adaptation of tactics might occur - but that'll be the test of his capabilities as a manager if and when things aren't going our way. Currently though we're very much solely in the gaining proficiency stage of the tactical setup - I think ostensibly because whilst he could adapt things game-by-game in the way that we, seeing the game and how it pans out might feel would make us better, but too much change too fast when we've only just started to learn a certain tactical style could be detrimental to that instilling of fluency. Which can be frustrating to watch - but fingers crossed it actually benefits us long-term

My biggest concern is simply the pervasive notion and mantra of "when we come good", comparing us to Burnley last year etc. I should state I think it's likely a positive that we're trying to establish a distinct style of play, and I think in general the one we're attempting to create is a positive style that should allow us to generally have the better of teams. I also think that it's way too soon in the season to be truly concerned, implementing what we are will obviously take time given the shambles of preseason and general squad instability amongst other things. However every time I see someone say wait until we really kick into gear when we've adapted to it, or that we'll be brilliant when we've had time with the system I can't help but be concerned that we'll still be repeating that mantra of when it clicks it'll be amazing halfway through the season or more. I do think we'll likely get better with the system, but there does seem to be an almost surety going round that at some point it will definitely all click and we'll canter to promotion. Hopefully it will, and really this is all just a load of nothing really because we've started brilliantly points-wise even if performances have been a bit hit and miss, and it's off the back of only one loss. I really hope it does all click down the line but by no means do I think it's a surefire bet that we'll magically unlock HMS Piss the League mode after a while of adaptation. We'll see how it goes in the next few games!

For me, I don't necessarily think we have a tactical issue, other than potentially familiarity - just in terms of I think we're still not quite at the level where the tempo of the passing is quick enough or incisive enough when we look to progress the ball forwards in many cases. That hopefully will come with time, and hopefully some more players through the door before the window shuts where we'll see more fluency in patterns of play. The groundwork for me is there, and we just need to finetune and keep working on how we play and performances should hopefully improve consistently. I think our biggest issue is simply overcoming the demons of previous collapses - I still think we have a bit of a mental issue at the club where when we concede we can just completely cede control of the game to the opposition and just collapse a bit - I don't think it's a coincidence that some of our worst spells in our games thusfar have come 2nd half after conceding against Coventry and 2nd half today having just conceded before HT. Luckily we've been up against poorer quality teams, and been a bit more solid defensively and had the grit to grind things out when it's looked dicey though, which is a marked turn from the last few years! Hopefully both will continue to improve as Maresca works more with the team, and as we hopefully build up more confidence with more wins and consistency in the team.

Yeah, I mean I don't necessarily think it's nefarious regardless of whether it is the case or not, and I could easily be wrong - I just think it seems a logical possibility. It could also simply be that he doesn't consider any of the other academy players good enough to make the bench right now, therefore Ward is a good stopgap on the bench that doesn't rock any boats or give any players the wrong impression of how he regards them I guess, but I'd hope it's not that one because that's a bit of a damning take on our U21 players if they can't get on the bench ahead of Danny Ward as a 2nd GK! Hopefully it doesn't matter and we can finally get some transfer movement out of the club that renders it moot going forward!

Yeah, I do understand that perspective - though surely we're trying to move Ward on one would hope, so why would he be exempt from the squad removal? Again though, I gave an example, you could put any of the academy players on the bench who presumably aren't all trying to move on from the club and are available, no?

I've got to be honest, I can't really conceive of any way that 2 GKs on the bench isn't a signal of at least some level of discontent on Maresca's behalf about the state of the squad - and I'm not trying to say he's fed up with the club or anything fearmongering like that - simply that in my opinion that seems like the only plausible reason a manager would ever put 2 GKs on the bench in that circumstance. Again I might be wrong but the fact, disregarding that he could put any of the highly paid players that are missing out onto the bench, that he could put for example Booth from the U21 side who just scored a brace last game for the U21s, to reward good performance and maybe bolster the lad's confidence and show that there's a pathway into the first team with good training and performance - and with it being a 2nd GK chosen ahead of ALL other players at the club at his disposal demonstrates in my opinion that the reason for it cannot be tactical - there is basically no tactical reason to ever have 2 GKs on the bench. I think it's likely that it is Maresca trying to highlight that he doesn't have the squad he needs before the deadline, as well as serving to excise players he doesn't want or that don't want to be here from the squad in the hopes that that expediates their departures. I find it a bit of a frustrating move, because I'd always much rather see a place on the bench go to an academy player over a basically superfluous extra keeper, but if it helps get players out and therefore players in, I definitely can't complain. Plus I mean, we HAVE won 3 from 3 regardless, so it's hard to be particularly mad right now - but still I don't think it's anywhere near invalid to suggest that the double keeper on the bench move might stem from squad composition frustration - otherwise that extra bench slot surely should be filled by an academy player in a more useful position imo. tl;dr: dropping the wantaway or players we want away from the squad makes logical sense to me as a move, putting a second GK on the bench over literally any other outfield player does not, therefore I think there's likely an ulterior motive behind it - though obviously that's just my assumption, but I feel its fairly logical.

To clarify I don't think it's a quota signing because we have form for this exact profile of transfer over the past 5 years or so and it fits that profile to a T.

We've signed a number of Villa academy rejects over the past few years in and around this age group, weird that this is the only one I've seen called a quota signing whereas Lewis Brunt, Mitch Clark or Viktor Johansson weren't? Wonder why.

It seems Maresca doesn't rate Iversen, Ward, Souttar, Thomas, Soumare, and Daka, in varying degrees, Castagne clearly wants to leave and really if we can get in replacements with their contracts on the verge of expiring next year we really should be trying to move on some combination of Vestergaard, Praet, Ndidi, Nacho, Hamza this year in order to not lose all of them on frees next year and make losses on them. Obviously nowhere near all that will happen - but this window has been crying out for us to make some sort of attempt to shift the huge swathes of surplus players we have on our books but for whatever reasons we've yet again utterly failed in that regards thusfar.

Currently this is how many players the other Championship clubs have out on loan at a quick glance: Birmingham: 3 Blackburn: 2 Bristol City: 6 Cardiff: 5 Coventry: 1 Huddersfield: 1 Hull: 6 Ipswich: 6 Leeds: 6 (but all are first team players with their weird loan clauses to continental sides) Leicester: 1 Middlesbrough: 4 Millwall: 3 Norwich: 8 Plymouth: 3 Preston: 2 QPR: 1 Rotherham: 4 Sheff Weds: 0 Southampton: 5 (though 2 are established/older players to continental sides) Stoke: 4 Sunderland: 2 Swansea: 1 Watford: 5 West Brom: 3 As usual, we're lagging a bit with only Opoku out, but honestly given that I'd imagine Maresca probably wanted to look at a lot of players at the club I'm not too concerned yet - our numbers aren't exactly abnormal right now looking at the rest of the league - Leeds for example have 0 academy players out on loan as far as I could find - probably due to similar levels of new manager and relative unfinalised squad. So we'll see by the end of the window what the number is, though if it's anything like previous years we'll be lucky to see even 3/4 going out which would be a bit of a disappointment imo, but hopefully we can get some outgoings in the next few weeks as our squad gets more complete!

I'm gonna be honest, it wouldn't surprise me if we severely underperformed in terms of selling anyone - that's the faith I have in our negotiating abilities when it comes to offloading players we don't want or need to move on. Iversen deserves to move on, Ward, Nacho, Castagne, Praet, Vestergaard, Ndidi should all have left imo but that was my feeling at the start of pre-season when I blindly hoped we'd have more of a rebuild than we seem to have ended up actually doing. As it stands in the now - I'd try to get rid of Ward, Nacho, Castagne, Vestergaard and Praet - as what I deem the most recoupable assets unless we can somehow swing an Ndidi sale to Saudi for big money and/or just players that I think need to go. I would literally pay someone to get Ward off our books and I only say that half tongue-in-cheek! Though that would be under the proviso that we actually get players in afterwards - with Coady injured I can see us keeping Vestergaard yet again, and Ndidi I imagine will be kept around based on his pre-season usage. I can see logic behind keeping Nacho and Castagne in terms of their ability but honestly with a year left on contracts I would just much rather have the money and new players to actually make our squad look less imbalanced and address issues that haven't been solved yet despite the season having just started. I can take or leave Soumare and Hamza simply depending on how Maresca rates them but again wouldn't bat an eyelid if either left really. The rest I'd keep - and really at the point we're at now I highly doubt we end up shifting more than say 4/5 and that's me being optimistic. Gun to my head we sell 2. Something like Nacho and Castagne and that's it - and we end up only getting in one more transfer and a couple loans.

I do have a question and I don't mean this in a disparaging way, but do you genuinely think our board/behind the scenes operations haven't been shambolic in recent years?

To be fair, you are correct - but football is a business where you can't get overawed and lost in past successes if the current situation is dire. Rudkin absolutely should get credit for his role in our successes, I don't disagree there - but there is no disputing that he has also and more recently been part of what is ostensibly a colossal embarrassment of a relegation into the Championship from an incredibly strong position only a few years back. Obviously we can't know exactly what part he has to play in said collapse, but as Director of Football - he has to shoulder some degree of blame for where we are imo - because as a club we look to have been run horrifically in the most recent years, beyond simply looking at performances and relegation. Just as say managers who were brilliant like Ranieri, and even though I dislike saying it, Rodgers in the first period of his tenure; they were brilliant and achieved a lot for us there should be no disputing that, but neither for example despite those successes should have been retained when they were sending us downwards as a club. Unfortunately despite the fact that we sacked Ranieri probably at the correct time, we let Rodgers stagnate and send us backwards for far too long - which was a glaring mistake. Obviously the role of DoF is far less simple to equate to poor performance as a club in the way the manager is, but I'm more talking about the overarching point. So yes, Rudkin has been a part of our successes and that shouldn't be ignored, but on the basis of looking at how we've been run as a club in the past few years, I think both statements of he should get credit for that, and he is possibly no longer fit for purpose here are true.

I would genuinely rather see Alex Smithies play every game in that scenario than Ward.

I've got to admit if we're baulking at a 10mill pricetag due to FFP concerns then I have real concern about this rebuild. Not to be a downer, I think this is a good player to bring in, but definitely some worries there about our direction this summer.

I uhh don't think that's what that means. I think it actually means we've been shockingly bad at signing competent wingers and playing in a way that gets the best out of them.

I cannot believe that people still don't rate Nacho, or consign his great goalscoring record basically every time Rodgers deigned to let him play to just fluke purple patches. Can't fathom how you can have watched us for the last few years and not rate him - baffling.

I will say there is no proof that Steffen is Prem quality given he's basically never played in the Prem - I have an American friend who really doesn't rate Steffen in the slightest - thinks he's okay at playing out from the back but a pretty rubbish shot-stopper with a real howler in him but we'll see. I have reservations over each deal here that is mainly finance-related, but provided that we're actually signing some players of a different profile after this then that will definitely go some way to assuage my concerns - we absolutely need some players with some kind of resale value after these ones otherwise we could really struggle long-term if we don't go up at the first time of asking. I'm trying not to be too concerned, because on the face of it I'm happy we're actually getting things done, and on the face of it the profile of player is one that should be good enough for our ambitions. I just don't trust the board to have learned from previous windows finance-wise I think is the crux of the issue, so the reported fees and my assumption of the wages involved is something that I find concerning with these deals - but hopefully that'll be unfounded.

I rate the Coady signing a lot more than Winks, though in truth I don't have misgivings about their abilities, moreso than concerns about how much money we're going to be giving them. It depends on whether signing players presumably on decent Prem wages continues as a trend or whether they're the exceptions - if the latter, I'm happy enough with both, but the former I would definitely be concerned about our recruiting focus. Also, whilst the soundbite of beating other Prem clubs to the signing of Coady for example sounds good - I worry that the reason if that we're offering too much money.

I think at the end of the day by the end of Rodgers' tenure no-one was progressing or playing particularly well. I don't think Thomas had a particularly good last year, but new managers have revitalised players in poor form or stagnating in development before - so I'm not really writing off anyone before seeing them under a new regime - hopefully the Rodgers shackles being off can help a lot of players at the club!