Micky Going to Coventry or Forest

[Chandler]

Well that's going to make our season even more interesting isn't it folks? Makes me feel like a punter who backs the opposition: one way I'm happy, the other I'm rich.

If we go do well, reach the play offs and go up I'll be happy as Larry.

On the other hand if Micky does better with either of these utterly shite outfits than Mr Leveine does with us, that will be rich (and you lot will never ever hear the end of it). And there is no doubt that these outfits are shittier than us: lower league positions no money, crap squads, crap stadia.

I'm lurving it...

[dan_84]

who ever he joins they are going down!!!!!

[Stuliasz]

Simple question for you Chandler, I've been reading your posts over the past few days and I'm sure your intentions must be good but here is my question. Why would you love it if our rivals' achievements over the remainder of the season overshadowed our own as a Leicester City fan just so that you can get one over on the people on this board? Surely the success of our club is more important? Get back to me on this one.

[breadandcheese]

Chandler,

You present yourself as an authority, seemingly elevated above all of us "boneheads". A voice of reason and higher understanding. Yet you simply take the stance of the easy ground, rather than confronting and questioning your own position. As you yourself have said, you will be happy if Leicester do well, yet happy if they do not, as this will justify your opinion and posts.

History has shown throughout the ages that in times of trouble, it takes the brave to stand up and make a change. But there is a section that prefer the status quo, drawing long lists of arguments on why change is bad. "Change could bring a worse set of circumstances", "Do we know this change will work?", "We know the current situation, we do not know what change will bring." Usually, this section of people then begin to turn on others, blaming them and everything else rather than seeing the need for action and the facts in the cold light of day. At every opportunity, they will present themselves as the voice of reason. "If they had all listened to me, we would be better off."

Do these arguments and responses sound familiar. They should do as all your posts stem from these.

Yet people who respond in such manner neglect one major flaw in their argument. They cannot provide a satisfactory explanation for the reason behind the problems and troubles. They become blind to the problem, because of their need to cling on to their position.

I wish Micky Adams every success. But, I still believe it was the right decision to get rid of him. Maybe Levein won't bring the success we crave (although I think he may), but I will still believe it was the right decision to get rid of Micky. The club was performing badly, stemming from the players he signed and tactics he played. In short this club is rotten, and a severe period of rebuilding is necessary. I do not belive Micky is capable of that.

In playing up as this voice of authority, your behaviour is predictable and laughable, not as would be expected from a person who presents himself as a voice of higher intellect. Your pride and ego have made you blind and thus you will never concede even if you are proved wrong and Leicester do improve under Levein's new rebuilding period.

[Ric Flair]

Chandler,

You present yourself as an authority, seemingly elevated above all of us "boneheads".  A voice of reason and higher understanding. Yet you simply take the stance of the easy ground, rather than confronting and questioning your own position.  As you yourself have said, you will be happy if Leicester do well, yet happy if they do not, as this will justify your opinion and posts.

History has shown throughout the ages that in times of trouble, it takes the brave to stand up and make a change.  But there is a section that prefer the status quo, drawing long lists of arguments on why change is bad.  "Change could bring a worse set of circumstances", "Do we know this change will work?", "We know the current situation, we do not know what change will bring."  Usually, this section of people then begin to turn on others, blaming them and everything else rather than seeing the need for action and the facts in the cold light of day.  At every opportunity, they will present themselves as the voice of reason.  "If they had all listened to me, we would be better off."

Do these arguments and responses sound familiar.  They should do as all your posts stem from these.

Yet people who respond in such manner neglect one major flaw in their argument.  They cannot provide a satisfactory explanation for the reason behind the problems and troubles.  They become blind to the problem, because of their need to cling on to their position.

I wish Micky Adams every success.  But, I still believe it was the right decision to get rid of him.  Maybe Levein won't bring the success we crave (although I think he may), but I will still believe it was the right decision to get rid of Micky.  The club was performing badly, stemming from the players he signed and tactics he played.  In short this club is rotten, and a severe period of rebuilding is necessary.  I do not belive Micky is capable of that.

In playing up as this voice of authority, your behaviour is predictable and laughable, not as would be expected from a person who presents himself as a voice of higher intellect.  Your pride and ego have made you blind and thus you will never concede even if you are proved wrong and Leicester do improve under Levein's new rebuilding period.

52647[/snapback]

To be fair, that's one of the best posts i've readin a long time. Marvelous.

[Stuliasz]

Couldn't have put it better myself.

[davieG]

This is one of the reasons MA's had lost the plot in my eyes and I expressed my concerns when most of them were being signed.

QPR away 25/09/2004 we fielded

Pressman 36

Dabizas 31

Keown 38

Dublin 35

Wilcox 33

Nalis 32

Makin 31

Scowcroft 29

Connolley 27

Gemmil 33

Blake 32

Average age 32.45.

Most were MA's signings.

Ps my thanks to fleckneymike from the FoxFanzine sight for highlighting it.

[Scow]

This is one of the reasons MA's had lost the plot in my eyes and I expressed my concerns when most of them were being signed.

QPR away 25/09/2004 we fielded

Pressman 36

Dabizas 31

Keown 38

Dublin 35

Wilcox 33

Nalis 32

Makin 31

Scowcroft 29

Connolley 27

Gemmil 33

Blake 32

Average age 32.45.

Most were MA's signings.

Ps my thanks to fleckneymike from the FoxFanzine sight for highlighting it.

52654[/snapback]

Blimey, it does put it in to perspective when you present it in that context. Two players under 30, awful stuff.

As for bradandcheese, I agree with Hoof and SF - Best post I've read in a while.

[Hullfox]

crap stadia.

I'm lurving it...

52602[/snapback]

Far be it from me to pick holes in an argument but I think that you'll find that Coventry are moving into the rather nice looking new Jaguar Stadium next season.

I'm lurving it.

[Anish]

Chandler - are you Bill Anderson in disguise?

[Scow]

Chandler - are you Bill Anderson in disguise?

52825[/snapback]

If he says he rates Makin and Blake, then we'll know for sure.

[SilverFox]

Chandler,

You present yourself as an authority, seemingly elevated above all of us "boneheads".  A voice of reason and higher understanding. Yet you simply take the stance of the easy ground, rather than confronting and questioning your own position.  As you yourself have said, you will be happy if Leicester do well, yet happy if they do not, as this will justify your opinion and posts.

History has shown throughout the ages that in times of trouble, it takes the brave to stand up and make a change.  But there is a section that prefer the status quo, drawing long lists of arguments on why change is bad.  "Change could bring a worse set of circumstances", "Do we know this change will work?", "We know the current situation, we do not know what change will bring."  Usually, this section of people then begin to turn on others, blaming them and everything else rather than seeing the need for action and the facts in the cold light of day.  At every opportunity, they will present themselves as the voice of reason.  "If they had all listened to me, we would be better off."

Do these arguments and responses sound familiar.  They should do as all your posts stem from these.

Yet people who respond in such manner neglect one major flaw in their argument.  They cannot provide a satisfactory explanation for the reason behind the problems and troubles.  They become blind to the problem, because of their need to cling on to their position.

I wish Micky Adams every success.  But, I still believe it was the right decision to get rid of him.  Maybe Levein won't bring the success we crave (although I think he may), but I will still believe it was the right decision to get rid of Micky.  The club was performing badly, stemming from the players he signed and tactics he played.  In short this club is rotten, and a severe period of rebuilding is necessary.  I do not belive Micky is capable of that.

In playing up as this voice of authority, your behaviour is predictable and laughable, not as would be expected from a person who presents himself as a voice of higher intellect.  Your pride and ego have made you blind and thus you will never concede even if you are proved wrong and Leicester do improve under Levein's new rebuilding period.

52647[/snapback]

Good posting matey

[Chandler]

Simple question for you Chandler, I've been reading your posts over the past few days and I'm sure your intentions must be good but here is my question. Why would you love it if our rivals' achievements over the remainder of the season overshadowed our own as a Leicester City fan just so that you can get one over on the people on this board? Surely the success of our club is more important? Get back to me on this one.

52645[/snapback]

Yep, you're right, if MA gets either of these jobs and takes his new club to a higher league position than LCFC it does present a problem for me - I won't feel so miserable about our relative failure. As I said earlier, it is just like a gambler who takes good odds on the opposition. Now, don't tell me you've never heard of any City fan ever doing that!

But if you're asking me whether I would cut my nose to spite my face (ie hope that City do badly and that Adams is successful) I think that the answer to that is obvious...

[Chandler]

Chandler,

You present yourself as an authority, seemingly elevated above all of us "boneheads".  A voice of reason and higher understanding. Yet you simply take the stance of the easy ground, rather than confronting and questioning your own position.  As you yourself have said, you will be happy if Leicester do well, yet happy if they do not, as this will justify your opinion and posts.

History has shown throughout the ages that in times of trouble, it takes the brave to stand up and make a change.  But there is a section that prefer the status quo, drawing long lists of arguments on why change is bad.  "Change could bring a worse set of circumstances", "Do we know this change will work?", "We know the current situation, we do not know what change will bring."  Usually, this section of people then begin to turn on others, blaming them and everything else rather than seeing the need for action and the facts in the cold light of day.  At every opportunity, they will present themselves as the voice of reason.  "If they had all listened to me, we would be better off."

Do these arguments and responses sound familiar.  They should do as all your posts stem from these.

Yet people who respond in such manner neglect one major flaw in their argument.  They cannot provide a satisfactory explanation for the reason behind the problems and troubles.  They become blind to the problem, because of their need to cling on to their position.

I wish Micky Adams every success.  But, I still believe it was the right decision to get rid of him.  Maybe Levein won't bring the success we crave (although I think he may), but I will still believe it was the right decision to get rid of Micky.  The club was performing badly, stemming from the players he signed and tactics he played.  In short this club is rotten, and a severe period of rebuilding is necessary.  I do not belive Micky is capable of that.

In playing up as this voice of authority, your behaviour is predictable and laughable, not as would be expected from a person who presents himself as a voice of higher intellect.  Your pride and ego have made you blind and thus you will never concede even if you are proved wrong and Leicester do improve under Levein's new rebuilding period.

52647[/snapback]

IF YOU WANT TO CRITICISE MY REPLY THAN AT LEAST GIVE ME THE COURTESY OF READING IT BEFORE POSTING ANY SEMI-LITERATE COMMENTS

1. I don't present myself as anything. If you choose to see me as an authority then ta very much.

2. If you think that being in a minority of one backing an unpopular cause is 'easy ground' I don't think you would make it as a surveyor.

3. A bit more precision please. I will enjoy the irony if Adams is more successful with his new club than Levein is with City. I did not say I would prefer this outcome (which I wouldn't). However, if it is the former scenario that prevails, I will ensure that the irony is not lost on you or any other 'fickle bonehead'.

4. History shows us nothing chum because it is largely fiction - propaganda of the victors. And you'd be surprised about the amount of history we accept as absolute truth that is, in fact, absolute shite.

5. 'It takes the brave to stand up...' Tautologous. Cowards, by definition, cannot make a stand. You are saying nothing.

6. '...and make a change.' What, change simply for the sake of change? There has to be a reason for it: ie to improve a given situation rather than make it worse.

7. 'But there is a section...change is bad.' And here you describe opposition simply for the sake of opposition. Stop speaking in abstractions. Put things in context. Change-for-something, opposition-to-something... Turn up to your Logic seminar. Don't bum Mandy before heading off to campus.

8. 'Usually this section...cold light of day'. I find this highly ironic. It's YOUR CROWD, the change merchants, that are into the blame game. You blamed Adams and now you blame the players (and then, irony upon irony, you expect them to perfom for you). And of course, you never blame your utterly shit support no, no, no. You barrack players, you never sing and you don't turn up to games.

9. "If they had all listened to me......better off" Aha! An admission of guilt then. So we are WORSE off after all! And what if things get really bad? What if...perish the thought...we end up RELEGATED? Would the change still have been worth it? (don't bother - I know what your ludicrous response to that is)

10. 'Do these arguments sound familiar' etc. My opposition to the campaign against Adams was based on scientific studies. Your hate filled campaign was based completely on frustration arising out of inflated expectations (lead the pack from day one, end season as champions). I kept my head. You lost your cool. Read Kipling.

11. 'Yet people' etc. This paragraph beggars belief. Unlike the vast majority of those who respond to my posts I have provided hard evidence in support of ALL my arguments. Even my serious critics acknowledge that. Do you actually bother to read my posts?

12. I am really getting tired of this. 'Maybe Levein won't bring us success but it was still right to get rid of Micky' (paraphrased). Can't you see how irrational that sentence is?

13. No, let's be accurate, the club started badly and gradually started to improve (11 points from last 6 games under MA). No, more accuracy required, we started badly largely because we couldn't keep 11 men on the park. No, the club is not rotten. It is almost bankrupt (something you idiots keep on forgetting). And, finally, you blame the players because you can't blame Levein (yet).

14. 'My behaviour etc etc. It is predictable because I am consistent unlike you lot who change with the wind. First Adams was a god. Then he was a demon. And now it's the players who are devils.

15. 'My pride and my ego...' am I proud because, heaven forbid, I have the temerity to hold a different opinion to your own? And tell me, my fine philosophising friend, if Levein's rebuilding programme comes to nothing will you concede and admit that you were wrong? I frigging doubt it!!!

Recommended reading - An Enemy of the People ( Henrik Ibsen)

[Hullfox]

Chandler,

You present yourself as an authority, seemingly elevated above all of us "boneheads".  A voice of reason and higher understanding. Yet you simply take the stance of the easy ground, rather than confronting and questioning your own position.  As you yourself have said, you will be happy if Leicester do well, yet happy if they do not, as this will justify your opinion and posts.

History has shown throughout the ages that in times of trouble, it takes the brave to stand up and make a change.  But there is a section that prefer the status quo, drawing long lists of arguments on why change is bad.  "Change could bring a worse set of circumstances", "Do we know this change will work?", "We know the current situation, we do not know what change will bring."  Usually, this section of people then begin to turn on others, blaming them and everything else rather than seeing the need for action and the facts in the cold light of day.  At every opportunity, they will present themselves as the voice of reason.  "If they had all listened to me, we would be better off."

Do these arguments and responses sound familiar.  They should do as all your posts stem from these.

Yet people who respond in such manner neglect one major flaw in their argument.  They cannot provide a satisfactory explanation for the reason behind the problems and troubles.  They become blind to the problem, because of their need to cling on to their position.

I wish Micky Adams every success.  But, I still believe it was the right decision to get rid of him.  Maybe Levein won't bring the success we crave (although I think he may), but I will still believe it was the right decision to get rid of Micky.  The club was performing badly, stemming from the players he signed and tactics he played.  In short this club is rotten, and a severe period of rebuilding is necessary.  I do not belive Micky is capable of that.

In playing up as this voice of authority, your behaviour is predictable and laughable, not as would be expected from a person who presents himself as a voice of higher intellect.  Your pride and ego have made you blind and thus you will never concede even if you are proved wrong and Leicester do improve under Levein's new rebuilding period.

52647[/snapback]

IF YOU WANT TO CRITICISE MY REPLY THAN AT LEAST GIVE ME THE COURTESY OF READING IT BEFORE POSTING ANY SEMI-LITERATE COMMENTS

1. I don't present myself as anything. If you choose to see me as an authority then ta very much.

2. If you think that being in a minority of one backing an unpopular cause is 'easy ground' I don't think you would make it as a surveyor.

3. A bit more precision please. I will enjoy the irony if Adams is more successful with his new club than Levein is with City. I did not say I would prefer this outcome (which I wouldn't). However, if it is the former scenario that prevails, I will ensure that the irony is not lost on you or any other 'fickle bonehead'.

4. History shows us nothing chum because it is largely fiction - propaganda of the victors. And you'd be surprised about the amount of history we accept as absolute truth that is, in fact, absolute shite.

5. 'It takes the brave to stand up...' Tautologous. Cowards, by definition, cannot make a stand. You are saying nothing.

6. '...and make a change.' What, change simply for the sake of change? There has to be a reason for it: ie to improve a given situation rather than make it worse.

7. 'But there is a section...change is bad.' And here you describe opposition simply for the sake of opposition. Stop speaking in abstractions. Put things in context. Change-for-something, opposition-to-something... Turn up to your Logic seminar. Don't bum Mandy before heading off to campus.

8. 'Usually this section...cold light of day'. I find this highly ironic. It's YOUR CROWD, the change merchants, that are into the blame game. You blamed Adams and now you blame the players (and then, irony upon irony, you expect them to perfom for you). And of course, you never blame your utterly shit support no, no, no. You barrack players, you never sing and you don't turn up to games.

9. "If they had all listened to me......better off" Aha! An admission of guilt then. So we are WORSE off after all! And what if things get really bad? What if...perish the thought...we end up RELEGATED? Would the change still have been worth it? (don't bother - I know what your ludicrous response to that is)

10. 'Do these arguments sound familiar' etc. My opposition to the campaign against Adams was based on scientific studies. Your hate filled campaign was based completely on frustration arising out of inflated expectations (lead the pack from day one, end season as champions). I kept my head. You lost your cool. Read Kipling.

11. 'Yet people' etc. This paragraph beggars belief. Unlike the vast majority of those who respond to my posts I have provided hard evidence in support of ALL my arguments. Even my serious critics acknowledge that. Do you actually bother to read my posts?

12. I am really getting tired of this. 'Maybe Levein won't bring us success but it was still right to get rid of Micky' (paraphrased). Can't you see how irrational that sentence is?

13. No, let's be accurate, the club started badly and gradually started to improve (11 points from last 6 games under MA). No, more accuracy required, we started badly largely because we couldn't keep 11 men on the park. No, the club is not rotten. It is almost bankrupt (something you idiots keep on forgetting). And, finally, you blame the players because you can't blame Levein (yet).

14. 'My behaviour etc etc. It is predictable because I am consistent unlike you lot who change with the wind. First Adams was a god. Then he was a demon. And now it's the players who are devils.

15. 'My pride and my ego...' am I proud because, heaven forbid, I have the temerity to hold a different opinion to your own? And tell me, my fine philosophising friend, if Levein's rebuilding programme comes to nothing will you concede and admit that you were wrong? I frigging doubt it!!!

Recommended reading - An Enemy of the People ( Henrik Ibsen)

52879[/snapback]

Chandler

I said it in a previous post and I'll say it again. You spoil your good arguments with your aggressiveness towards others.

Whilst being a fan of Mickey, I felt the time had come for him to go when he did.

Yes, his position was made untenable by the supporters who had grown impatient with the apparent lack of success on the field but even his biggest fans will have to agree that his downfall was attributable in some part to his own inadequacies. It was Mickey who said judge me on being in the top 2 and we were nowhere near that under him. He was also badly let down by some of his signings who were welcomed by most into the club. Signings that by virtue of our financial status were bound to be a gamble but some of which seemed to be made on the basis of historical rather than current ability.

I believe and hope that he will do well elsewhere.

I fully agree with some of your views on the club and it's support, but not the personal attacks that you make. Not everyone on the board has the depth of vocabulary that you possess but it doesn't make their (or indeed your own)viewpoint any less valid.

However, you are spot on about some of the support we get. Our home following is abysmal in terms of volume and atmosphere. Some people will retort that it's the shit that we have been served up and the poor design of the stadium though in my mind it's the people.

Some of the best atmospheres I've witnessed across the years home and away have been when we were playing at our worst and in relegation battles.

I believe that the crowd can make the first move to inspire the atmosphere, others feel they need the inspiration from the field first. In our own minds we are all right.

I honestly feel that due to our success of the nineties too many people are of the opinion that we should be replicating that time and time again. They have had (through no fault of their own) no concept until now of the downsides to the footballin roller coaster that is Leicester City.

If we were to hold a poll of who was our best manager, the clear cut winner would be Martin O'Neill. He is given almost god like status by the supporters for his achievements that he brought us and rightly so in my opinion. However as you will well know, it was our support that was calling for his head and campaigning outside the ground in his early days. Something that he never forgot about.

Now, before people jump down my throat and tell me that they weren't there, thats great. What I am trying to articulate is that it seems to be a Leicester thing if that makes sense. The same group of people (not the same personnel, but the "group" ie Leicester fans) went ecstatic recently after seemingly influencing the decision to bring Trevor Benjamin on as sub. And this is where the irony really hits.

It is as you say indicative that CL has got nothing extra from the same group of players that Mickey did. By calling for possibly our worst player (because he tries) it shows how poor the fans perceive us to be.

However, I do think that Levein will make us a better club when he brings in his new faces. Note though that he is already offering 3 1/2 year contracts to players. I don't know for sure but would suspect that Mickey was unable to do that hence the journeymen syndrome that has beset us.

Whether our better club under CL will be better than Mickey would have made it if despite everything he was still here we'll never know but will for a long time will debate.

[breadandcheese]

IF YOU WANT TO CRITICISE MY REPLY THAN AT LEAST GIVE ME THE COURTESY OF READING IT BEFORE POSTING ANY SEMI-LITERATE COMMENTS

1. I don't present myself as anything. If you choose to see me as an authority then ta very much.

2. If you think that being in a minority of one backing an unpopular cause is 'easy ground' I don't think you would make it as a surveyor.

3. A bit more precision please. I will enjoy the irony if Adams is more successful with his new club than Levein is with City. I did not say I would prefer this outcome (which I wouldn't). However, if it is the former scenario that prevails, I will ensure that the irony is not lost on you or any other 'fickle bonehead'.

4. History shows us nothing chum because it is largely fiction - propaganda of the victors. And you'd be surprised about the amount of history we accept as absolute truth  that is, in fact, absolute shite.

5. 'It takes the brave to stand up...' Tautologous. Cowards, by definition, cannot make a stand. You are saying nothing.

6. '...and make a change.' What, change simply for the sake of change? There has to be a reason for it: ie to improve a given situation rather than make it worse.

7. 'But there is a section...change is bad.' And here you describe opposition simply for the sake of opposition. Stop speaking in abstractions. Put things in context. Change-for-something, opposition-to-something... Turn up to your Logic seminar. Don't bum Mandy before heading off to campus.

8. 'Usually this section...cold light of day'. I find this highly ironic. It's YOUR CROWD, the change merchants, that are into the blame game. You blamed Adams and now you blame the players (and then, irony upon irony, you expect them to perfom for you). And of course, you never blame your utterly shit support no, no, no. You barrack players, you never sing and you don't turn up to games.

9. "If they had all listened to me......better off" Aha! An admission of guilt then. So we are WORSE off after all! And what if things get really bad? What if...perish the thought...we end up RELEGATED? Would the change still have been worth it? (don't bother - I know what your ludicrous response to that is)

10. 'Do these arguments sound familiar' etc. My opposition to the campaign against Adams was based on scientific studies. Your hate filled campaign was based completely on frustration arising out of inflated expectations (lead the pack from day one, end season as champions). I kept my head. You lost your cool. Read Kipling.

11. 'Yet people' etc. This paragraph beggars belief. Unlike the vast majority of those who respond to my posts I have provided hard evidence in support of ALL my arguments. Even my serious critics acknowledge that. Do you actually bother to read my posts?

12. I am really getting tired of this. 'Maybe Levein won't bring us success but it was still right to get rid of Micky' (paraphrased). Can't you see how irrational that sentence is?

13. No, let's be accurate, the club started badly and gradually started to improve (11 points from last 6 games under MA). No, more accuracy required, we started badly largely because we couldn't keep 11 men on the park. No, the club is not rotten. It is almost bankrupt (something you idiots keep on forgetting). And, finally, you blame the players because you can't blame Levein (yet).

14. 'My behaviour etc etc. It is predictable because I am consistent unlike you lot who change with the wind. First Adams was a god. Then he was a demon. And now it's the players who are devils.

15. 'My pride and my ego...' am I proud because, heaven forbid, I have the temerity to hold a different opinion to your own? And tell me, my fine philosophising friend, if Levein's rebuilding programme comes to nothing will you concede and admit that you were wrong? I frigging doubt it!!!

Recommended reading - An Enemy of the People ( Henrik Ibsen)

52879[/snapback]

Ok, please let me respond to your points, before posting my own response. I apologise, I will keep this constructive and try to lay-off cheap comments.

1. You may not actually write on your posts "I am a voice of authority", but your prose and style present you as such, for your posts always take a superior tone. (read your 3rd point for example, classifying us all as boneheads, etc)

2. Yes, you may be in the minority, but your position is on easy ground. You may get abuse, but at the end of the day, you will be happy whatever the outcome, because either a) Leicester will be doing well, or B) you will be proved right. You have a position with insurance.

3. I do not believe you would prefer city to do worse than a Micky Adams team, but then no-one prefers their insurance.

4. "History is largely fiction - the propaganda of the victor". History can never be fiction, by its very inherent nature. So I am guessing you are talking about history books. In which case, I would suggest you study the subject, particularly areas of revisionist historians. If you read the right material, and collect a balanced view, then you can form your own judgements. That is the most important aspect, determining the reliability of sources.

5. Cowards can make a stand, it is just not necessarily pronounced and loud.

6. I believe your response falls under my expected replies of those who prefer the status quo. The decision to remove Micky Adams was not change for change's sake. It was a necessity born out of poor performances on the pitch.

7. I describe your opposition, refusing to see the facts and blaming it on our support, or maybe it was the canteen staff at the club, or maybe... In a second post, I will provide you with what I consider the main reasons for the club's poor performance.

8. see point 7

9. Re-read my original post. "If they had all listened to me......better off" referred to your responses. I do not believe we are worse off. Improvement is not a quickfix as you seem to think. We need to rebuild from a solid base. This takes time, not a few games. We may slip down the league a little, but I consider it to be 1 step back 2 forward, (again, see next post, when I present my view at the bottom)

10. I would love to see your scientific studies. I am sure you took time to set-up a control to judge against, and ensure variables were accurately tested. Posting a few facts is not a scientific study. Don't belittle your argument with crap.

11. You provide evidence, but fail to miss the underlying cause. As I have said, you were blind and still are blind to the problem.

12. 'Maybe Levein won't bring us success but it was still right to get rid of Micky' (paraphrased). It is rational, because I see the major structural faults in our team and performances, all of which Micky failed to solve.

13. We did improve slightly, but this was not enough to hide the major flaws in our team and management.

14. An agreement

15. Pride and ego make you blind.

Now I'll post this up and start writing my own response rather than replying to your points

[breadandcheese]

Ok, I'm gonna try and keep this short, because I've written enough already.

I said this club was rotten. I stand by that, but I now see the rebuilding that Levein has planned, and indeed the rebuilding that has taken place at a commerical level. I see a brighter future. When Chandler talks about the rubbish support, I do not disagree. However, where I disagree, is that I see this as a symptom of events on the pitch, and not a cause.

Now this club has been in administration, yes, but because we are now under fantastic management by the current board and staff, we are now in a decent position. We may not have loads of money to spend on players, but we are at least on a fairly firm financial base. For this, I thank Tim Davies, the board and all the staff at the club. This to me, was the start of the rebuilding, which did not translate through to the playing side.

To me, the flaws on the playing side stem from Micky. When we went up, he himself said that he would be happy if we finished 17th. That was an indication that there was a strong possibility we would go down. I thought it highly unlikely we would stay-up, given our financial state. But the answer in my mind, and any half-decent manager's, would be to start building a team, with an eye on the season after. In other words, prepare to build a team, so that if we went down, we would cope. This is what Curbishley did at Charlton, Megson did at Albion, Allardyce at Bolton. This did not happen.

We then went down, bravely, and I have no cause for complaint. Micky then bought a load of players in. Now the suggestion that because we had been in admin, Micky could not spend the money he wanted. Well, by my reckoning, Micky has actually spent over £1.25 million (250,000 on Canero, half a mill on Williams and Connolly. That is just 3 players). This amount is more than most managers in this league. To suggest administration as a problem is therefore ludacrous in light of the spending. The legacy of administration on our club, is rightly turning us into a more disciplined spending regime. As such, we are unlikely to see anymore players in til the summer unless we ship out others first.

From a tactical angle, I have always felt Micky's tactics were wrong, but that is a personal point of view, and so I will leave it that to one side, as an explanation.

So what was our club left with when Micky left. We had a squad of players, most of whom were ageing, and struggling to be good enough for this league. Levein has come in and made some interesting observations. Not least that there is no real pecking order at the club, because so many players are coming here as last-stop places for a year or so. This has then had an effect on the team spirit, which has filtered through to the fans.

Chandler mentioned the wise words of Kipling, and how we needed to keep our heads, whilst all around others were losing theres. I believe Micky also lost his head towards the end of his reign. Micky will admit to that. That was another reason he needed to go. When the leader loses his head, it is time for him to be relieved of his duties. it was not change for change's sake.

We may still be doing poorly in the league under Levein, which would make the change look futile. But, it is important to remember that this is not Levein's team. It take time to bring in the players you need. Dare I say, lets look at Derby. There is no doubt that Craig Burley is doing a tremendous job there. He has brought through some youngsters, scouted far and wide for players, bought in some good players on the cheap, and they are now doing well. This took a bit of time. In many respects, Derby had to take 1 step back to go 2 forward. I would also point to the example of Paul Hart at Barnsley. It took him a bit of time to get the players playing as he wants, and bring through one or two others, but for Barnsley's standards, they're not doing too bad.

Either way, I believer we are in a process this season of a step back. It is sad that this season will be a write-off, but ce la vie. It is interesting to see Levein come in and identify faults. The most important aspect (and this is something that I could never see with Micky) is that we are building a team for a few years. Maybury and De Vries on 3-year deals (and not the crazy sort Elsom and Taylor gave to players such as Elliott, or Benjamin) have come in and spoken of this rebuilding. They see themselves as a part of Leicester for a few years.

Yes, this club was rotten, but no longer in my eyes. Getting rid of Micky was rational. It was not change for change's sake. It was not fickle, nor mis-calculated. He was not good enough, he had lost his head, he was not shrewd enough as a manager for my liking. He is gone, that is now Leicester history. In my eyes he will always have a good place in Leicester history for how much he helped this club. I will never boo him.

So Personally, I think it's time to forget about all this baiting of each other. You think Micky should have stayed, I think we had to get rid. Differing opinions. They are irrelevant now. It is time to look to the future and get behind the team.

[breadandcheese]

so much for short, apologies

[Anish]

so much for short, apologies

52917[/snapback]

exactly - those posts were too long so I didn't even bother reading them!