leicsmac

There is a lot of time between here and there. Perhaps Trump might do the UK a favour by being deliberately arrogant and antagonistic in the way that he did for Canada and Oz.

Good to hear! And yet over in the UK, the stance of the party that made big gains yesterday on the matter is as follows: [Reform UK's] other main policy is scrapping net zero targets, which leader Nigel Farage says are destroying jobs and driving up household bills. The party also wants to scrap subsidies for renewable energy, allow companies to drill for more gas and oil in the North Sea and fast-track nuclear energy. Looking to boost the UK contribution to the leading cause of the current global biodiversity extinction event. Which is accelerating fast. I can understand concerns about other issues that might result in a vote for the above party, but I'm yet to hear exactly why this isn't a red line given the stakes. Perhaps someone could oblige?

Fair to say, and this is where it gets really tricky. The UK - among other places - has to balance the problem of making the lives of their own citizens better in all the ways you describe here and more, and focusing on global matters that can and will doom everyone if the UK - among other places - ignore them. Often those two ends are at the opposite scale of means, hence it being bloody difficult. Some people may not care about external policies, exactly as mentioned here, but they will end up in trouble as a result of them whether they care about them or not. So it's hard, but it is important, and necessary, to somehow work the two simultaneously, or the shit hits the fan either way.

This still stands. Understanding is important.

...this is of course operating on the assumption that builder 1 and their counterparts are at all competent and have those aforementioned recommendations. Are they, based on what we're seeing on the other side of the pond right now? I agree that positivity is better but people have overlooked both Trumps obvious damage caused and the links he shares with a potential Reform government for too long. There's being positive, and then there's overlooking the negative becoming naive when it's so obvious.

"If you can't beat them, join them" being the Conservative line of thinking right now, then? It's still rather startling to me that there is such a marked difference between the level of Trump's popularity in the UK and Reform voting polls, given that (making the point again) their policy platforms are broadly aligned.

I have no idea why both Labour and (to a lesser extent) the Tories are not absolutely going after Reform/Farage for their ideological alignment with the Trump administration. What's stopping them? Surely "Vote Reform, get Trump" or something along those lines, along with consistently pointing out the obvious links, would be a fair angle to shoot?

Oh, and FAO Farage et al: That the UK contributes little directly in terms of emissions from manufacturing, power generation, transport etc when compared to the big players is true. However, that is mostly because the UK relies on those big players (China in particular) to manufacture, generate the power to do so, and transport all the stuff that is needed and used to the UK. Outsourced emissions are still the responsibility of the nation that ordered the good or service. NB. It's not like the consequences of this matter are going to dodge the UK just because they "contribute much to it anyway". Floods, droughts, dustbowls and general misery doesn't tend to stop to have their passport checked.

Short term self interest. It's not good, funnily enough.

Exactly. Speaking personally, I'd be interested in talking about policy beyond the UK and immigration, too.

If that's true, then why answer (perceived) ad hominems with more ad hominems? There's plenty of people here wanting to talk about policy without taking man along with the ball. the latest commentary Stateside might not be an unreasonable place to start.

Effective automation would be an answer to that. But then the powers that be wouldn't approve of it being used to liberate from work, either, as they'd lose the power that they have.

He just embodies certain elements of our species that we thought we had left behind, more's the pity.

https://interestingengineering.com/science/all-you-need-to-know-about-the-sixth-mass-extinction-event Most conservation biologists today think humanity has already entered the sixth mass extinction phase due to the acceleration of species extinction. The sixth mass extinction will be the first to result from human (anthropogenic) actions, including human-induced climate change. Neanderthals, Denisovans, and Homo erectus all vanished. Homo sapiens could be next, but when? Animals and plants go extinct all the time; it’s a part of how Earth works. We know this because over the last 500 million years or so, since the origin of multicellular life, there have been at least five major extinction events. Each of these wiped out between 75 and 90 percent of the world’s species at the time over a ‘short’ period of around 2.8 million years or less, and were brought on by dramatic but natural occurrences. Animals and plants go extinct all the time; it’s a part of how Earth works. We know this because over the last 500 million years or so, since the origin of multicellular life, there have been at least five major extinction events. Each of these wiped out between 75 and 90 percent of the world’s species at the time over a ‘short’ period of around 2.8 million years or less, and were brought on by dramatic but natural occurrences. A primer on the world as it is... and what our species is doing to it.

And that's why the local, national and global issues need their own "lanes" rather than getting enmeshed as they have. All of them are important. Looking at the context, no, no he doesn't. He means the US.

I'm not sure that assumption can be made across the board any more tbh. Or if it can now, it may not soon.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx20znjejw1o Of all the ideas Trump and his ilk are spreading to the UK, the forment of disagreement on what needs to be done on this topic could easily end up being the most damaging.

Either set an example and help those places with other options, or join them in a mutual race to the bottom that ends... well, it's obvious how it ends. There are no other choices.

Fair enough. As @Sampson above then says, when you go down that road, you likely end up abandoning a great many human beings to their fate simply because they weren't lucky enough to be born in the right place. How well that sits is clearly up to the beholder.

...and what of the argument that the foreign policy of Reform would not even come close to addressing the origin of these "small boat" attempts in the first place? Or is the cause immaterial and only the solution matters?

You'd be amazed at the amount of people (most of whom haven't been within a thousand miles of a war) who think that it is.

That doesn't seem to stop their counterparts stateside, but here's hoping.

Quite frankly they don't have the power by themselves right now, local or federal, to do so. Not through the usual channels. Countering this isn't just on them - it's on judiciary, local officials and, at a basic level, everyday people.

The vote share for Reform is slightly slanted based on age, but not nearly as much as one might think. This isn't really a problem with one age demographic - there's plenty of young men (and I'm sorry, it is mostly men) who are in favour of their ideas.

Well, those that want to had better get better at controlling the argument then. Stuff like this is already happening: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/justice-department-louisiana-donald-trump-naacp-america-b2743274.html When the Justice Department lifted a school desegregation order in Louisiana this week, officials called its continued existence a “historical wrong” and suggested that others dating to the Civil Rights Movement should be reconsidered. The end of the 1966 legal agreement with Plaquemines Parish schools announced Tuesday shows the Trump administration is “getting America refocused on our bright future,” Assistant Attorney General Harmeet Dhillon said. (Just in case anyone was wondering, "bright" = "white".)