Babylon

I'd say absolutely not, players who had downed tools generally don't keep staging fight backs in games like we do. They just roll over when the going gets tough.

He certainly didn't to start with, remember Beckford, Danns and Mills and the like? He basically had to rebuild the team with his own players, whilst all the geniuses on here slated him left right and centre for not playing Mills and Beckford, and hammered him for signing the fat and slow centre back from Forest when we already had loads of great ones like Mills. Unfortunately for him, we aren't a team who was low on confidence and scratching around the arse end of the championship. We'd just got promoted, under a manager the players mostly seemed to like, so it's a going to be harder to get them onside than it was at Forest. But he was very much liked by the players there and he had all of them playing for him.

He wanted experience, but it doesn't mean he's personally picked them. Quite clearly we didn't have the budget to go out and get players in their premier league prime. So the scouting team would have identified what we could afford... and here we are.

It feels more and more like Pearson as time goes on (minus the amazing recruitment and history to buy himself time). We had so many utter rubbish cup games under him where he made loads of changes. He felt as stubborn as an Ox and seemed to refuse to try the obvious sometimes. I think Cooper will (if he's given time), either through pressure building or through stumbling across it due to injury.

Which clearly said it was just players not being selected getting the arse.

All I can say is it's about the equivalent of me picking out "I feel like it's only a matter of time (a win) it's coming; just need to string it together from the start" from his comments and trying to make out that he's obviously well happy and confident in theirs and the managers abilities as he thinks it's coming no problem. They are just players, they aren't great orators. They want to plod through the interview, trot out a few cliches and get back to the changing room and bugger off home.

Getting caught off guard by another teams energy isn't exactly a new thing. He literally states that a lot of emphasis has been placed on how the team is starting slowing, which I would imagine comes from the coaches there. And they've gone and done it again. You can say well that's up to the manager, but the players need to sort themselves out also. We've had this issue for a long time, I watched plenty of games last season where we were utter gubbins at the start and seemed to have to warm into the game.

Seriously you are putting 1+1 together and coming up with 5. The media clearly stated players not playing weren't chuffed, that's hardly a shock is it. That's all players at every club when out of the frame. You are taking a nothing comment uttered my managers and players up and down the country and using it as another stick to beat the manager with.

All we've heard for about 8 years is that we need more "passion and intensity", just said by various managers in different ways. Our players being a bit meh sometimes isn't a new thing.

This is roughly what was said. "I feel like today we weren't really at it from everyone, not anyone in particular" "I feel like we weren't really ready for the fight they were going to give us" "We got hurt early on and put up a fight to get back into it, but it was nieve from us" "We were expecting them to come out with fight obviously we know what they are. But I just feel like we were lacking that in the first half, and should have been a bit better from everyone in the first half". "I feel like it's only a matter of time (a win) it's coming; just need to string it together from the start. Start of games are really important and we've put a lot of empasis on the start of games because we've let teams come onto us" Players say this sort of stuff all the time, whether it's "we weren't at the races first half," "we came out of the blocks slowly," "we didn't get going," "we didn't show enough fight," etc. etc., etc. To suggest it's some sort of categorical proof of anything is ludicrous.

I think you are reading way too much into it.

I think it's safe to say that can be filed under total nonsense. Interviewer "would you like the job" Candidate "only if you get the sack mate" Interviewer "errrr thanks for the application, we'll be in touch"

You have to look at things from his and the clubs point of view, they've backed him in the market and quite a few of those came in late in the window. It's very easy for fans to chuck the baby out with the back water on a whim, but there are big cheques that need to be written to do it. And I think any decent club will give a manager time if they aren't disgracing themselves. IMO we're about a starting line up of Mav, Buonanotte, Fatawu and Vardy away from picking up a win or so. It might not have been a thrilling start, but we've hardly disgraced ourselves. People keep going on about Everton like they are a total washout. They finished 14 points clear of relegation, without points deductions that was 22 points clear. They'd been 2-0 up against a very good Villa and Bournmouth (still leading 2-0 with 87 minutes on the clock). We were pants fair enough, and we should have gone with a more attacking line up considering the goals they have shipped, but it's not like they are a totally hopeless case we're playing. It's a comfortably mid table team from last season.

If you think we have a good squad and it's all down to Cooper. Then 28 games and 84 points to play for is plenty for a manager to turn things around. Pearson took 8 games to do it after us being dead and burried.

I don't think that's fair, my point of view is that many managers have started poorly in their time at a club and turned it around. Whether it's O'Neill, or Pearson with his first season in the premier league. I will wait until 10 games plus before I start firming up any opinion good or bad.

I don't disagree with a lot of what you say. But I think it's a tad unfair to make out like the team is some seasoned premier league bunch. Whilst many have played there, you only need to scrath the surface to find that suspect. JJ and Ricardo have had horrendous injuries and have never got back to what they were. Ndidi and Vardy aren't the players they were. Faes it's debatable he was good enough the first time around, also see Vesty. Winks had to go down a division to find someone to have him. Ayew and Reid are at the arse end of their careers. Daka failed to live up to expectations, Soumare and Kristienson flopped first time around, Thomas couldn't make it at worse teams than us, Coady wasn't wanted at Everton or Wolves and seemingly isn't fancied much here, and I can keep going through most of the others. There is experience sure but few of them are actually at their peak even if they've ever proved themselves at this level. So there are a lot of question marks over their ability. In fact so far I'd say Mav and Hermansen are the standouts this season and neither played at this level (Unless Mav made a couple of starts at Arsenal).

It's not incorrect though is it, you expect me to beleive if we won a game now people would accept 3 wins in 22 games? Do me a favour. And grow up with the Pooper stuff, nobody thinks it's funny.

Pep can bomb out £60m players on a whim because he can just buy a new one. It's a bit different. If he thinks it's best left between him and the player then so be it, whether I agree with it or not.

No player is going to get a guaranteed spot, just doesn't happen. A manager might say he sees them as a key player and they are likely to get a lot of minutes, but that's about the extent of it. The simple most likely answer with JJ and Ayew is that Cooper as it stands is a nervous nelly and wants to err on the side of caution with more defensive players.

He prefers JJ currently, not sure what reasoning you need. You might not agree with it, but most mangers are going to keep it internal. As soon as you start questioning players publicly, you are on a sticky wicket.

I didn't expect us to get relegated, but we were.

Nope, we aren't Forest. How much of a difference did NES make with his 3 wins in 22 games period last season for Forest? His change wasn't created overnight.

It's been 5 league games, not really a great sample size. And I'd say he's been pretty average... you only need to look at the table to see it's hardly been a disaster.

Pretty much my feelings at the moment.

With respect that's purely opinion, we can't know what would have happened either way. How many times in the past have we all (myself included) screamed for a certain combination of players to play, and then when they did they were crap. As someone else said, the league is hard as a newly promoted team, another manager might set up a different way and just lose in a different fashion. I find some of his decisions incredibly annoying, but I'm happy to give him time as I am with all managers. But he simply has to win a game or two pretty soon. IMO he's probably got until the Ipswich away game. Bournmouth, Saints, Forest, Ipswich is that run, so he's got to walk away with two wins from that as a minimum really.