Thracian Posted 11 September 2005 Share Posted 11 September 2005 Okay, we've had a day enjoying the fruits of a welcome victory. There were genuine plusses from the day: a) Two goals from De Vries b) The promising home debut of young Sheehan. c) The obvious quality and efforvescence of Hume. d) The defence keeping a clean sheet. e) The successful return of Hughes. f) The promise of Kisnorbo. g) The matchwinning start to our new strike partnership. h) Moving up into the middle of the table. None of these are insignificant but let us not kid ourselves. Sheffield Wednesday were a poor side with no pace, no ideas, no invention and no great hope that I could see. And what worried me most against such indifferent opposition was how we failed to go for the throat, how we failed to maintain the pressure that led to our goals, for the remainder of the match. We were never made to surrender ground but we conceded it. Some players turned off. Suddenly lacked urgency. Decided the job was done. Sheffield could have scored from one of two or three chances and how ridiculous had we been left fighting to prevent an equaliser in the last quarter. I've seen it before Stoke was another game where we got complacent when ahead, and I don't like it. We need to maintain the tempo throughout if we can, not release our stranglehold. Make this a habit and even the good sides will find it more difficult to break us down. It's another reason why I like Hume so much. He's a harrier. He doesn't let people rest. Hughes also seems to have the energy for a 90-minute contribution. The question is, can others like Momo and Williams instill more urgency into their own play? Would it be beneficial to have them playing some of their football as defenders in training...just to get used to the different requirements and to get them more used to tackling, shepherding players into negative areas, reacting to the attacking runs of opponents?. Both players have strengths, but it is their weaknesses that are so apparent at times. People who win championships/promotions have certain qualities which set them apart. One is concentration, another is the work ethic and a third one is ruthlessness. We didn't demonstrate any of these qualities for anything like 90 minutes on Saturday. Loss of concentration could have cost two/three goals, we went into cruise control when two-up (particularly after half-time) and we didn't continue to go for the throat when in the ascendency but, instead, weakened our "high press" and conceded ground. While the players (and the manager) are congratulating themselves on victory they should demand of themselves that they improve in the three areas mentioned - cos on another day and against better opposition, those qualities will be the difference between winning and losing. They will undoubtedly by required to win a top six place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 11 September 2005 Share Posted 11 September 2005 Agree with all of that, early days and a defeat at Cardiff would change it but it's a pleasant feeling to be nearer the playoffs than relegation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louise Posted 11 September 2005 Share Posted 11 September 2005 I'd agree with most of that, however I think it is the manager encouraging the players to sit back on a lead rather than the players turning off. After the Stoke game Levein said that we shouldn't have been attacking when we were 3-1 up as it left us open at the back and we conceded. While I do think that players like Williams and Sylla turn off for large parts of a match I think most of the players are under instruction to get a lead and then sit back on it with occasional attacks on the break, we saw this last season as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuliasz Posted 11 September 2005 Share Posted 11 September 2005 I have to agree with what you have said, the result was a good one but we do seem to lack that cutting edge in just burying games that we should bury due to the laid back attitude of the players when a game is won. I think it would have cost us against a better side. On a different topic though Sheff Weds really need to improve if they are going to stay up, they are one of the worst sides I have seen at the Walkers for some time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultra Posted 11 September 2005 Share Posted 11 September 2005 Agree with many of the points raised above but bear in mind we have SIX more matches in the next three weeks. We rode our luck at times but generally paced the game quite well. We'll need to step up a gear for the trips to cardiff and Wolves though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 11 September 2005 Author Share Posted 11 September 2005 Agree with many of the points raised above but bear in mind we have SIX more matches in the next three weeks. We rode our luck at times but generally paced the game quite well. We'll need to step up a gear for the trips to cardiff and Wolves though! It'll be interesting to see the team - especially now the competition for places is increasing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonia jackson Posted 11 September 2005 Share Posted 11 September 2005 could'nt agree more. as much as i hate to say it but wolves will, well and truely turn us over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 12 September 2005 Author Share Posted 12 September 2005 I'd agree with most of that, however I think it is the manager encouraging the players to sit back on a lead rather than the players turning off. After the Stoke game Levein said that we shouldn't have been attacking when we were 3-1 up as it left us open at the back and we conceded. While I do think that players like Williams and Sylla turn off for large parts of a match I think most of the players are under instruction to get a lead and then sit back on it with occasional attacks on the break, we saw this last season as well. Well it's time he changed and realised he has a responsibility to the paying spectator. Not only that but if a high-up-the-field press results in you getting on top why the hell change? It can easily backfire. When you've scored a goal, try and score another one is the best policy overall. If the opposition have to worry about you in their half then it's a lot safer than havin g to worry about them in ours. Managers forever talk about having belief. They should show some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 12 September 2005 Author Share Posted 12 September 2005 could'nt agree more. as much as i hate to say it but wolves will, well and truely turn us over. Don't be so pessimistic. Wolves record is not so hot and we've got some decent players to pick from now. If City play well they can beat anyone in The Championship. But let's deal with Cardiff first. Get em wound up Craig and show some faith in their ability. Can't imagine Hume and Hughes believing they'll get beaten by anyone. Let's get that attitude to rub off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 12 September 2005 Share Posted 12 September 2005 I've always thought that the best form of defence is attack. I would rather see City going for more, than sitting back and counting down the clock. Two goals is not enough, besides, if they can attack and defend when going for the lead, why should they all of a sudden be unable to do this once they are in front? Perhaps this is why I'm not a football manager? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 12 September 2005 Author Share Posted 12 September 2005 I've always thought that the best form of defence is attack. I would rather see City going for more, than sitting back and counting down the clock. Two goals is not enough, besides, if they can attack and defend when going for the lead, why should they all of a sudden be unable to do this once they are in front? Perhaps this is why I'm not a football manager? Perhaps it's a pity there aren't more football managers with attitudes like yours. It's one thing being sacked cos your team weren't good enough but being sacked cos your team was boring as well is not something I'd want to be remembered for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cisono Posted 12 September 2005 Share Posted 12 September 2005 On a different topic though Sheff Weds really need to improve if they are going to stay up, they are one of the worst sides I have seen at the Walkers for some time. Did they just have a bad day on Saturday or have they been playing like this most of the games so far? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenFilbert Posted 13 September 2005 Share Posted 13 September 2005 could'nt agree more. as much as i hate to say it but wolves will, well and truely turn us over. So then, that's your first post. Pretty rubbish isn't it. I'm sure you'll get better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 13 September 2005 Author Share Posted 13 September 2005 Wolves will turn us over. What do you base that on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anish Posted 13 September 2005 Share Posted 13 September 2005 Wolves will turn us over. What do you base that on? Tonight's performance and result? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 13 September 2005 Author Share Posted 13 September 2005 You're like Levein. You've got no faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gené and Tonic Posted 13 September 2005 Share Posted 13 September 2005 well Thracian, looks like we were complacent. With any luck, Levein, and all the players save Hume and Hammil should be fined a weeks wages for the pathetic performance tonight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martyn Posted 13 September 2005 Share Posted 13 September 2005 Promise of Kisnorbo? He did nothing but run around like a headless chicken on Saturday. Hume needs to start playing matches, at least to excite the crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 13 September 2005 Author Share Posted 13 September 2005 well Thracian, looks like we were complacent. With any luck, Levein, and all the players save Hume and Hammil should be fined a weeks wages for the pathetic performance tonight! Pity it doesn't happen. I used to really hate losing (still do underneath) but I wonder if it's just a bad day at the office for some of the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultra Posted 13 September 2005 Share Posted 13 September 2005 Tonight's performance and result? And did you see the Wolves result tonight? Defeat at home by the bottom club. Maybe there's hope for us yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicester_Mad Posted 13 September 2005 Share Posted 13 September 2005 Promise of Kisnorbo? He did nothing but run around like a headless chicken on Saturday. Hume needs to start playing matches, at least to excite the crowd. Unless he puts the ball in the net he is no more use than MDV. Getting the crowd going is nothing unless he scores goals . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 14 September 2005 Share Posted 14 September 2005 Was going to start a new topic called Realism but I guess this kinda fits into this discussion. I'm glad there are a few people starting to get more pessimistic about our chances of improving on last season's dreadful league performance. No longer are we a yo-yo club. All too recently in the past our younger fans have expected us certainly to be challenging for promotion to the Premiership, if not in it. This is not a realistic expectation any more. We were spoiled by having managers as good as Little, McGhee and O'Neill. They are not the norm. Yes, Taylor was exceptionally bad by Premiership standards but he's considered a decent manager by most neutrals. What he has achieved with England Under-21's, Gillingham and Hull indisputably backs this up. People seem to expect Levein to be like O'Neill but managers like that don't come around every five years, we've only had two or three of them at best in the history of the club. Those of us old enough to remember the Pleat years can identify a lot with the position the club is in at the moment, because for all that has happened in the past 15 years, our league position is actually very similar to what it was under Pleat. New stadium, young players, ambitious manager. None of these factors really matter if your team can't produce decent football on a consistent basis. You can't expect us to sign players like Lennon (£750,000), Izzet (£650,000), Elliott (£1.6m), Savage (£400,000) or even Claridge (£1m) any more. What sort of players would O'Neill have ended up with, having to sign a majority of free transfers, instead of having a bit of money to chuck around? The fact is that when O'Neill arrived, we had the nucleus of a decent side and he made some incredibly astute signings to make us mid-table Premiership material. That's not the position that Levein found himself in when he took over: players like Williams, Tiatto and Gudjonsson are not Premiership quality. Yes, a couple of his signings (Hughes and Maybury are the only two that spring to mind) appear to be decent players but you can't expect to build a solid defence around a functional right-back like Maybury. Johansson may turn out, over the season, to be a decent signing too but there's no-one else in the entire defence who looks as solid as these two. The only exception to the rule may be Stearman but with Maybury already playing at right-back and Levein reluctant to play Stearman in the middle, we can't find room in a non-existent defence to fit two of our best three defenders in at the same time without making the unit as a whole even less competent. We've got the same sort of problems in midfield and don't even get me started on the attack (with the departure of Connolly, the last thing we needed was yet another striker who can't score - Hammond may be energetic but we desperately need a player who knows how to finish - the post-mortem on the strikers is on hold until Hume gets match-fit again and we see what he can do). Okay, you got me started on the attack, but it could have got a whole lot more ugly if I was in the mood. People are still talking about the play-offs. It's all very well being ambitious but there's ambition and there's just a plain lack of realism. The fans can only start to get ambitious when they see something to spark that from the players. Look at the teams that ended last season in the play-off positions - Ipswich, Preston, Derby and West Ham. When you look at how good they were (possessing the spine of a decent side and individual players of the quality of Davis, Bent, Nugent, Mawene, Rasiak, Idiakez, Sheringham and Reo-Coker) and compare them to what our club has offered us since we were relegated from the Premiership, there's not a gap at all.. there's a vast chasm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenFilbert Posted 14 September 2005 Share Posted 14 September 2005 We will finish in the play offs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted 14 September 2005 Share Posted 14 September 2005 Those of us old enough to remember the Pleat years can identify a lot with the position the club is in at the moment, because for all that has happened in the past 15 years, our league position is actually very similar to what it was under Pleat. I have said exactly the same on another forum or here. I agree we are in the same position as we were 15 years or so ago and I hope that CL proves to be this decade's version of Brian Little at least. <_< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 14 September 2005 Share Posted 14 September 2005 We will finish in the play offs. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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