LCFC Fans Consultative Meeting Minutes – March 2023

[Ian S]

48 minutes ago, Voll Blau said:

Why should people have to stump up £30 to have the opportunity (not even the guarantee) of attending the very occasional away game?

 

Nobody's saying anyone who's not an ST holder or member should get priority, but if we've got a situation where the club aren't even willing to sell to anyone who's not in that exclusive club then there's something extremely wrong with the system that means reference swapping happens to the degree it does (if we're assuming all 45 were no-shows for that reason - anecdotal evidence on here suggests people were refused despite turning up because the child accompanying them was the "wrong child", for example).

 

As for the random selection hardly being a hardship, well it is an inconvenience that *none of us* previously had to go through and it's going to make going to away games just that little bit less enjoyable than it used to be because you have to plan your day around that.

So how does a season ticket holder further down the priority list or a member get priority if those higher up the food chain keep selling on their tickets to non members?

I appreciate it may be an inconvenience caused by those cheating the system but in reality your inconvenience will be a very rare occurrence, do the maths.

Why should those who have stumped up for a season ticket or £30 membership miss out to those who have stumped up for neither.

[Ian S]

43 minutes ago, CosbehFox said:

There’s a very simple answer to your argument - have a tier of general sale at the end of members sale. 
 

There are quite a few legitimate reasons why you may not wish to spend £30 to become a member. For example a shift worker who works weekends. Then if you say they have a couple of kids - then membership prices go up even more. 
 

It’s a hardship in examples like this forthcoming Saturday where due to train engineering work, those not driving are having to take complicated routes. Equally it’s hardly the most driver friendly trip of the season. 
 

Anyway we could also do what I’ve just seen for a Hibernians game where a member has nominated me to have a ticket - they’ve had to put my details into the website and then the E-ticket gets released to me. A pretty easy way of doing this whole process without an inconvenience along the way.  

And if it doesn’t get past members sale? 
Are you suggesting an allocation to non members and non season ticket holders every game? I am not clear on what exactly you are saying.

[CosbehFox]

33 minutes ago, Ian S said:

And if it doesn’t get past members sale? 
Are you suggesting an allocation to non members and non season ticket holders every game? I am not clear on what exactly you are saying.

I am suggesting it follows the pattern of:- 

 

1. Season ticket holders 

2. Members 

3. general sale (non members / non ST holders) 

 

That last tier doesn’t happen currently if allocations are unsold after members sale. 
 

Equally I’d advocate on away games that ST holders don’t get 50 points per season but a 10 point head start on members and a 20 point head start on non members / non STs.
 

In the process a member has a realistic chance of catching a ST or a non member catching a member but there still is a benefit to paying for a ST or a membership.
 

Equally if the club were to get into an end of season Cup final, a non member whose been willing to stick it out all season rather than buying tickets off a season ticket holder would be at the same level as a season ticket holder who is a daytripper for the cup final 

Edited 29 March 2023 by CosbehFox

[Voll Blau]

30 minutes ago, Ian S said:

So how does a season ticket holder further down the priority list or a member get priority if those higher up the food chain keep selling on their tickets to non members?

I appreciate it may be an inconvenience caused by those cheating the system but in reality your inconvenience will be a very rare occurrence, do the maths.

Why should those who have stumped up for a season ticket or £30 membership miss out to those who have stumped up for neither.

There have been plenty of opportunities for people to progress up the ladder and gain points for all but the biggest games in recent seasons. There'd be even more of an opportunity if such a large proportion of away ends weren't syphoned off for box holders and as favours for players as is currently the case.

 

I'm more than capable of "doing the maths" thanks, but nobody needs to "do the maths" to realise that this is an idea that benefits absolutely nobody in cases like Southampton away where, as I keep pointing out, there were empty seats but it *still* wasn't put on general sale after members' sale. And it certainly doesn't benefit anyone who's randomly selected and has to turn up to the ground - i.e. the majority of people selected at Southampton.

 

You are right that there needs to be some priority system, but it's clear as day that the current one isn't working and needs sensible reform along the lines of the idea outlined by @CosbehFox. As usual though, we've got a club unwilling to confront the reality of the situation and instead thinking punitive measures and inconveniencing their own innocent customers is the only way this can be resolved.

[Duncan_K]

Absolutely spot on Cosbeh and Voll Blau. I would also look at points rolling on a 3 year basis. With as Cosbeh says just a 20 point head start on non-members and a 10 point head start on members. I'm sure it used to work something like that years ago. The club essentially drew a line in the sand when we got promoted the last time and decided everyone that was a season ticket holder in the Championship deserved a leg-up and i think that was fair enough at the time, but those of us who have benefitted from that system for years and years have to acknowledge that it's past its time now. 

[Voll Blau]

4 minutes ago, Duncan_K said:

Absolutely spot on Cosbeh and Voll Blau. I would also look at points rolling on a 3 year basis. With as Cosbeh says just a 20 point head start on non-members and a 10 point head start on members. I'm sure it used to work something like that years ago. The club essentially drew a line in the sand when we got promoted the last time and decided everyone that was a season ticket holder in the Championship deserved a leg-up and i think that was fair enough at the time, but those of us who have benefitted from that system for years and years have to acknowledge that it's past its time now. 

That's the point, isn't it? It's not just people who now can't get a leg up who want change, it's those of us who currently benefit from the current rigged system too. The club would do well to remember that.

[Drew Peacock]

20 hours ago, Ian S said:

It tells us what we all already know, quite a percentage of those high up the priority points sell their tickets and keep collecting the away points, it’s as simple as that.

It was a high percentage not collected for sure, but that small sample size doesn’t necessarily mean almost half of our away ticket allocation is abused in this way. Only a personal opinion, but whatever the club say, I think they might target some of those who are put on the list for whatever reason or suspicions they may have, causing the % of tickets not collected by those checked to be unnaturally high.  

Edited 29 March 2023 by Drew Peacock

[CosbehFox]

1 hour ago, Drew Peacock said:

It was a high percentage not collected for sure, but that small sample size doesn’t necessarily mean almost half of our away ticket allocation is abused in this way. Only a personal opinion, but whatever the club say, I think they might target some of those who are put on the list for whatever reason or suspicions they may have, causing the % of tickets not collected by those checked to be unnaturally high.  

The club would rather go down the lines of pinpointing potential ‘touts’ rather than actually look at the reasoning why there is a market to sell on. Eg. The priority points system and the gate keeping of access to tickets.
 

You could say that they are happy to grow the fanbase provided someone coughs up £30 every season. Which is pretty mad given the potential stadium expansion and the need to be appearing inclusive to fill another 8k seats 
 

 

Edited 29 March 2023 by CosbehFox