1969 Moon Landing

[marty78]

Surely it's the other way round , you should supply evidence that they do still exist ,because I believe he did write to these corporations.

If you don't believe him why don't you do the same and prove him wrong ?

Because its up to him (Collier), or you if you think you can, to prove him right. Maybe they just told him they were lost because they were classified or they thought he was a knob, or maybe he is lying. Who knows.

So we can see the other side of the galaxy in perfect clarity but we can't get a clear picture of the moon's surface? I'm not saying the landings weren't real, just asking the question what have they got to lose by giving everyone a clear picture of the landing sites? I don't believe that can't be done

Okay take a better picture yourself, with a better resolution, of the same region and get it posted up.

[Zingari]

Why should I provide evidence to counter someone else's unsubstantiated claims?

You can always go and see a lunar lander at a museum if you want.

Why waste your time trying to convince silly old twats like me that we went to the moon , when you could just as easily write to Grumman and Boeing etc to prove he is lying to all the the other doubters ?

How can I or anyone else prove that something doesn't exist ?

The onus is on you to prove that it does , can you really not see that ?

[Leicester_Numan]

Space telescopes don't work like traditional telescopes that you get at the end of piers, the vast majority of images we get from hubble are in fact artistic impressions of what the telescope sees after they interpret the spectrums etc that they detect. Hubble is only 347 miles into space, the moon is nearly 240,000 miles. Huble doesn't just zoom in and look at things.

And we don't have the ability to build anything powerful enough here on earth? Why not send the rover like they have to mars then? They could put the issue to bed if they really wanted to do so. So, again, why don't they?

[marty78]

And we don't have the ability to build anything powerful enough here on earth? Why not send the rover like they have to mars then? They could put the issue to bed if they really wanted to do so. So, again, why don't they?

Why don't the hoax believers pay and send one and put it to bed?

[marty78]

Why waste your time trying to convince silly old twats like me that we went to the moon , when you could just as easily write to Grumman and Boeing etc to prove he is lying to all the the other doubters ?

How can I or anyone else prove that something doesn't exist ?

The onus is on you to prove that it does , can you really not see that ?

By that logic if I say I saw Elvis in the supermarket it would be true unless someone could disprove it.

[marko]

And we don't have the ability to build anything powerful enough here on earth? Why not send the rover like they have to mars then? They could put the issue to bed if they really wanted to do so. So, again, why don't they?

You make it sound like it's a 5 minute job that would cost a coupe of quid!!!

[Zingari]

By that logic if I say I saw Elvis in the supermarket it would be true unless someone could disprove it.

No it would be untrue until you produced the evidence.

That's what I'm asking you to do about Colliers claims that the records have all gone .

prove him wrong by producing them.

You make it sound like it's a 5 minute job that would cost a coupe of quid!!!

stop looking for business on here

[marty78]

No it would be untrue until you produced the evidence.

That's what I'm asking you to do about Colliers claims that the records have all gone .

prove him wrong by producing them.

So I have to prove both my claim and Colliers. How does that work?

If I have to prove my claim why does Collier not have to prove his?

[fleckneymike]

Why waste your time trying to convince silly old twats like me that we went to the moon , when you could just as easily write to Grumman and Boeing etc to prove he is lying to all the the other doubters ?

How can I or anyone else prove that something doesn't exist ?

The onus is on you to prove that it does , can you really not see that ?

But we have proved that we have been to the moon. Every single hair brained theory you've put forward has been used to demonstrate that we went to the moon. You're now at the stage where your whole argument is that someone claims to have written a letter to which they got the reply that they've lost the designs. That's it, thats the whole shooting match for you, you're prepared to ignore all the physical evidence, all the third party evidence, all the false claims and throw your lot in with a man who claims to have written a letter (that no one has seen) and got a reply (that no one has seen).

Imagine for a second we reverse the situation and every single piece of evidence for the moon landing had been shown to be false, yet some of us are prepared to still believe because someone wrote a letter that we haven't seen and got a reply saying blue prints existed.

[Zingari]

So I have to prove both my claim and Colliers. How does that work?

If I have to prove my claim why does Collier not have to prove his?

flippin heck

let's just say i went to the supermaket for a loaf of bread and i got home and told the missus there was no bread .

she says "yes they have, prove to me they don't have any" .

unless she goes and looks for her fookin self , how can i prove they don't have any ?

[fleckneymike]

No it would be untrue until you produced the evidence.

That's what I'm asking you to do about Colliers claims that the records have all gone .

prove him wrong by producing them.

Again you have a very tenuous grasp of logic. Please reassure us all that you have a very menial job where you can do very little damage.

[fleckneymike]

flippin heck

let's just say i went to the supermaket for a loaf of bread and i got home and told the missus there was no bread .

she says "yes they have, prove to me they don't have any" .

unless she goes and looks for her fookin self , how can i prove they don't have any ?

WTF!

It's not as if NASA went to the moon whilst no one was watching and then suddenly announced they had done it. The whole world was able to watch, observe, track and inspect what they did whilst they were doing it.

[marty78]

flippin heck

let's just say i went to the supermaket for a loaf of bread and i got home and told the missus there was no bread .

she says "yes they have, prove to me they don't have any" .

unless she goes and looks for her fookin self , how can i prove they don't have any ?

You could get the supermarket to provide written proof and publicly acknowledge they have lost the plans... er I meant run out of bread.

[Zingari]

But we have proved that we have been to the moon. Every single hair brained theory you've put forward has been used to demonstrate that we went to the moon. You're now at the stage where your whole argument is that someone claims to have written a letter to which they got the reply that they've lost the designs. That's it, thats the whole shooting match for you, you're prepared to ignore all the physical evidence, all the third party evidence, all the false claims and throw your lot in with a man who claims to have written a letter (that no one has seen) and got a reply (that no one has seen).

Imagine for a second we reverse the situation and every single piece of evidence for the moon landing had been shown to be false, yet some of us are prepared to still believe because someone wrote a letter that we haven't seen and got a reply saying blue prints existed.

As i said before , you're spending a ridiculous amount of time trying to convince me , it really doesn't matter a fook what i think or believe . I've got no power on earth to influence anyone in what they believe .

I

Prove the likes of Collier wrong that the designs etc are still there and and you'll be killing thousands of birds with one stone , not just convincing me.

You could get the supermarket to provide written proof and publicly acknowledge they have lost the plans... er I meant run out of bread.

i think you may have taken me too literally

[fleckneymike]

As i said before , you're spending a ridiculous amount of time trying to convince me , it really doesn't matter a fook what i think or believe . I've got no power on earth to influence anyone in what they believe .

I

Prove the likes of Collier wrong that the designs etc are still there and and you'll be killing thousands of birds with one stone , not just convincing me.

i think you may have taken me too literally

Collier is dead, and has been for quite a while.

[Zingari]

WTF!

It's not as if NASA went to the moon whilst no one was watching and then suddenly announced they had done it. The whole world was able to watch, observe, track and inspect what they did whilst they were doing it.

i'm talking about proving the whether or not the Grummon designs still exist or not ,, you must know very well that neither i or anyone else can prove they don't exist.

Collier is dead, and has been for quite a while.

and that's relevant how ?

[marty78]

As i said before , you're spending a ridiculous amount of time trying to convince me , it really doesn't matter a fook what i think or believe . I've got no power on earth to influence anyone in what they believe .

I

Prove the likes of Collier wrong that the designs etc are still there and and you'll be killing thousands of birds with one stone , not just convincing me.

Him and his ilk have been discredited and proved wrong many times but some people can't accept that and always have one more problem they want solving, never try and solve it themselves though, just demand others do it for them. Like you are right now

i think you may have taken me too literally

I answered very fairly I thought.

[marty78]

i'm talking about proving the whether or not the Grummon designs still exist or not ,, you must know very well that neither i or anyone else can prove they don't exist.

You could get testimony from their staff that they were destroyed or lost

[Zingari]

You could get testimony from their staff that they were destroyed or lost

You could do the same and prove they are still in existence , this would then serve as cast iron proof that Collier was lying to the many hoax believers .

As I keep repeating , it doesn't matter a fig what I believe ,

Wave the designs and paperwork to anyone that raises the issue in the future and you'll be bulletproof

[fleckneymike]

i'm talking about proving the whether or not the Grummon designs still exist or not ,, you must know very well that neither i or anyone else can prove they don't exist.

and that's relevant how ?

Lets say you did prove that the blue prints had been lost, what would that prove? We have unused Saturn V, unused Lunar rovers and landers, spacesuits plus everything else used in the programme.

If the blueprints for the Titanic were lost would that mean it never set sail or sank?

The relevance of Collier is that you demanded that I prove him wrong and if I did so instantly thousands of hoax believers would instantly stop believing. It is quite difficult to prove a dead man wrong because he can never acknowledge that I am correct and therefore communicate to the people who believe him that he's been wrong all along.

As you have ably demonstrated, every time a theory is debunked you think up something else.

[Zingari]

Lets say you did prove that the blue prints had been lost, what would that prove? We have unused Saturn V, unused Lunar rovers and landers, spacesuits plus everything else used in the programme.

If the blueprints for the Titanic were lost would that mean it never set sail or sank?

The relevance of Collier is that you demanded that I prove him wrong and if I did so instantly thousands of hoax believers would instantly stop believing. It is quite difficult to prove a dead man wrong because he can never acknowledge that I am correct and therefore communicate to the people who believe him that he's been wrong all along.

As you have ably demonstrated, every time a theory is debunked you think up something else.

it sounds as if you are in doubt now that they are still in existence.

[marty78]

You could do the same and prove they are still in existence , this would then serve as cast iron proof that Collier was lying to the many hoax believers .

As I keep repeating , it doesn't matter a fig what I believe ,

Wave the designs and paperwork to anyone that raises the issue in the future and you'll be bulletproof

I am not claiming the still exist you are claiming they don't. The argument is already bulletproof but it doesn't stop the firing.

[Zingari]

I am not claiming the still exist you are claiming they don't. The argument is already bulletproof but it doesn't stop the firing.

i'd have thought you men of science would have been scrambling over hot coals to take a look at these remarkable designs and paperwork , they are after all historic documents aren't they ? are they of no interest to you whatsoever , have you never asked to see them?

[marty78]

i'd have thought you men of science would have been scrambling over hot coals to take a look at these remarkable designs and paperwork , they are after all historic documents aren't they ? are they of no interest to you whatsoever , have you never asked to see them?

No not at all, maybe if I was mechanical engineer I would be fascinated by them. I've never even thought about until today and probably never will again after today.

[The Doctor]

it sounds as if you are in doubt now that they are still in existence.

Or alternatively, he's saying if you were to prove yourself right - what difference does that make?

Even if we don't have the blue-prints anymore (I don't buy that at all) - why are the actual structures built from the blueprints not good enough?