SCMP rules - Now Championship and League One

[Pita]

47 minutes ago, Pliskin said:

Is he even a billionaire anymore? 

Probably not

[Foxin_Mad]

1 hour ago, Terraloon said:

Sorry but we simply don’t know how the last  game would have played out had relegation not already been confirmed. In that final game all the pressure was off as far as Blackburn were concerned. Similarly how anxious were LC players going into that game knowing that relegation was fact ? I would suggest they went into the game with no jeopardy.

 

Of course the result could have been exactly the same but I for one don’t seek any solace in the claim that there wouldn’t have been relegation without the points deduction. The simple fact was that the club should never have been in the position where firstly a points deduction should have occurred but more importantly six points shouldn’t have made a difference between survival and relegation. Compared to every other club in the  relegation zone you could multiply by probably 5 fold the wages spent by Leicester compared to others.

 

When it comes to sanctions every man and their dog knows if you don’t comply with PSR you get a points deduction. Leicester dodged getting a sanction earlier but did the club take heed? Nope let’s still spend and have a guess what was inevitable !

We all can agree that a points deduction in a financial context has a significant impact but there are mainly two different scenarios 1) Overspending in accord with the rules( this is what we are talking about re Leicester ) and 2) Matters around an insolvency event.

 

Looking at 1) a fine as was stated in the very first PL case against Everton a fine really isn’t going to have that great an impact but a points deduction would  or at least it should act as a deterrent but just as important a points deduction in acknowledges the compliance of all those clubs that did restrict spending and complied. 

Moving to 2) I have a bit of trouble even allowing a club suffering an insolvency event to survive in the same league. Administration and a CVA in many ways is a cop out. Entering these types of insolvency has significant impact on creditors who don’t fall into the category of football creditors particularly  local suppliers and the tax authorities. I realise that a double digit points deduction often leads to relegation but sorry I would go even further and relegate a club entering an insolvency event but I would go even further and bar all directors of a club entering the any types of insolvency event from any future involvement with a club.

You have to factor in the power of a deterrent and a simple points deduction and maybe a transfer embargo doesn’t tip the balance

 

 

 

Whilst I agree out position is entirely of our own incompetence . 

 

I disagree with points deductions for non sporting rule breaches.

 

Why should the fans at a club like Sheffield Wednesday be punished for the EFL allowing a blithering idiot to buy them? There are not many circumstances I can think of recently where teams gain a sporting advantage, maybe they should be pragmatic and look at each individual case.

 

There are far worse issues of cheating that shout be punished by relegating like selling hotels and womens teams, all though this is a technicality this is a blatant middle finger at the rules and anyone who complies.

[LCFCCHRIS]

10 minutes ago, Foxin_Mad said:

Whilst I agree out position is entirely of our own incompetence . 

 

I disagree with points deductions for non sporting rule breaches.

 

Why should the fans at a club like Sheffield Wednesday be punished for the EFL allowing a blithering idiot to buy them? There are not many circumstances I can think of recently where teams gain a sporting advantage, maybe they should be pragmatic and look at each individual case.

 

There are far worse issues of cheating that shout be punished by relegating like selling hotels and womens teams, all though this is a technicality this is a blatant middle finger at the rules and anyone who complies.

I think owners would just treat it like a tax if it were just a fine. Especially if the fines were less than say - 10M. 

 

However as you rightly state,  its definitely corrupt at the highest level so giving any team points deductions in the wake of the Man City 115 charges and Chelsea etc is favouritism. 

[Blarmy]

If everything is shit there is a high probability of multiple points of failure. 

[Foxin_Mad]

52 minutes ago, LCFCCHRIS said:

I think owners would just treat it like a tax if it were just a fine. Especially if the fines were less than say - 10M. 

 

However as you rightly state,  its definitely corrupt at the highest level so giving any team points deductions in the wake of the Man City 115 charges and Chelsea etc is favouritism. 

But like the case of Sheffield Wednesday I presume Chansiri is still wealthy he just decided not to put anymore into them. I don't think he would have paid a fine either, but it was also unfair for the fans to get a points deduction, its not like Sheffield Wednesday were going to win the league with what went on, and if by some miracle they had won the league then maybe they should consider what needs to be done. With a bad foreign owner their is not much that can be done, other than vet better in the first place, or maybe take some kind of security bond at the start of ownership. 

 

Actually a large fine spread between the other clubs for teams who gain a sporting advantage would be much better. Same goes for this Southampton thing imo, if they go up take all their money and share it amongst the Championship next year. 

[lcfc_forever]

The rules stink.

 

Top and Rudkin are fully to blame for our decline but the likes of Man U and Chelsea can run up years of massive financial losses and underachievement yet still face no punishment and bring in the likes of Xabi Alonso to coach them. 

 

The system is rigged, and means those clubs that fly too close to the sun and have one bad season get punished massively. 

[Les-TA-Jon]

1 hour ago, lcfc_forever said:

The rules stink.

 

Top and Rudkin are fully to blame for our decline but the likes of Man U and Chelsea can run up years of massive financial losses and underachievement yet still face no punishment and bring in the likes of Xabi Alonso to coach them. 

 

The system is rigged, and means those clubs that fly too close to the sun and have one bad season get punished massively. 

Except teams like Forest, Bournemouth, Villa, Brentford, Brighton have all been able to finish top 8 in recent years without hitting the self destruct button. 

 

The game absolutely protects the big 6 'cartel' and most financial rules protect the status quo, but Leicester's situation is not simply flying too close to the sun and having one bad season is it? It's 4-5 years+ of institutionalised mismanagement with no self-awareness or attempt to course correct - all coming home to roost. 

Edited 18 May by Les-TA-Jon

[lcfc_forever]

1 hour ago, Les-TA-Jon said:

Except teams like Forest, Bournemouth, Villa, Brentford, Brighton have all been able to finish top 8 in recent years without hitting the self destruct button. 

 

The game absolutely protects the big 6 'cartel' and most financial rules protect the status quo, but Leicester's situation is not simply flying too close to the sun and having one bad season is it? It's 4-5 years+ of institutionalised mismanagement with no self-awareness or attempt to course correct - all coming home to roost. 

Don't get me wrong, we've been mismanaged for many seasons but the relegation of 22-23 is the one bad season I'm referring as we've spiralled since then as PSR then got out of control because the club was running a top 8 budget. Those clubs you've mentioned have not experienced relegation. 

 

As Whelan said, the effects of that have been felt for some time. 

[Les-TA-Jon]

16 minutes ago, lcfc_forever said:

Don't get me wrong, we've been mismanaged for many seasons but the relegation of 22-23 is the one bad season I'm referring as we've spiralled since then as PSR then got out of control because the club was running a top 8 budget. Those clubs you've mentioned have not experienced relegation. 

 

As Whelan said, the effects of that have been felt for some time. 

The 2023 relegation is arguably the worst PL relegation of all time, in terms of underperformance - and I agree with you that season was part of the beginning of the current death spiral.

 

But whilst PSR had its part to play but I still contend that a good chunk of us going down that season was down to the overall mismanagement of the club. Binning off Kasper and believing Ward was ready to replace. Not sacking Rodgers when it was clear we were in trouble. Making the situation even worse with the Jan spending. Sacking Rodgers too late and wasting precious time and fixtures in replacing him. 

 

I think you put most other clubs that season in the same situation and they all stay up. 

[lcfc_forever]

26 minutes ago, Les-TA-Jon said:

The 2023 relegation is arguably the worst PL relegation of all time, in terms of underperformance - and I agree with you that season was part of the beginning of the current death spiral.

 

But whilst PSR had its part to play but I still contend that a good chunk of us going down that season was down to the overall mismanagement of the club. Binning off Kasper and believing Ward was ready to replace. Not sacking Rodgers when it was clear we were in trouble. Making the situation even worse with the Jan spending. Sacking Rodgers too late and wasting precious time and fixtures in replacing him. 

 

I think you put most other clubs that season in the same situation and they all stay up. 

Fully agree, I think we're saying the same thing. My point is the big clubs can have a disastrous season and be OK but PSR magnified our disaster and began a spiral that Top, Rudkin etc. were ill equipped to handle. 

[Terraloon]

5 hours ago, Les-TA-Jon said:

Except teams like Forest, Bournemouth, Villa, Brentford, Brighton have all been able to finish top 8 in recent years without hitting the self destruct button. 

 

The game absolutely protects the big 6 'cartel' and most financial rules protect the status quo, but Leicester's situation is not simply flying too close to the sun and having one bad season is it? It's 4-5 years+ of institutionalised mismanagement with no self-awareness or attempt to course correct - all coming home to roost. 

I often read that the big 6 as it were are protected and like you many suggest that the rules protect the status quo but I honestly just don’t follow that argument.

Indeed the simple fact is that clubs that are classified as being big six are the ones that have the biggest match day, biggest commercial and biggest sponsorship. When it comes to broadcast income thankfully it’s not distributed on viewing numbers because a fair number of clubs would see a significant drop in the monies received.

 

 

I saw an article a while ago talking about how FFp and PSR actually worked disproportionately in the favour of clubs with lesser income  in the PL who when you look at the  additional sum that they could loose a season it equated to a far greater % allowance than clubs with the biggest incomes.

 

I have heard arguments about income sharing but personally I think that would be football taking a backwards step and ironically to see just how unfair it would be let’s look at season 26/27 where I have a seen an estimate that Leicester will be receiving around 25% -30% of the leagues income. So if income sharing were to be put in place LC would be trading on income of circa £20-£25 m.