It could only come from a Labour politician

[The People's Hero]

Thracian - calm yourself down.

You must get so angry about everything?

That weather eh? That bastard weather? Just to wind you up isn't it huh? Bastards.

[Thracian]

You make some good points Thrac, but that isn't one of them. They didn't shoot some random guy on the tube, they shot the guy the surveillance team told them was a bomber from the day before - who is exactly what you say.

We don;t live in some ideal world where everyone gets everything right every time. We all screw up, and everyon needs a bit of leeway. You and I screw up we get away with it more than once because no one dies. What makes you think every link in the chain of events can be any different? Yes we should expect the best possible, but sometimes that is not quite good enough.

The surveillance team were wrong. Their mistake was inexcusable and the result not just about error but also sloppy leadership because it is the leaders who are supposed to put the failsafe's into place..

I'm often staggered by the sorts of people who get to be leaders in our Police Force.

Blair was an example. He never stopped wriggling over the De Menezes affair. He reminded me of that Police chief in Frost.

Look also at the officer who committed suicide recently as the consequences of a long string of affairs started to catch up with him.

His way of life - which made him ridiculously vulnerable to all sorts of undesirable pressure - was supposedly well known within the force yet still he was given a senior position and still people believed he was suited to even higher rank.

I don't expect people to get everything right. But I do expect them to set acceptable standards and to take responsibility for their actions.

[The People's Hero]

I don't expect people to get everything right. But I do expect them to set acceptable standards and to take responsibility for their actions.

You'll find that the only way to reduce your stress levels is to expect very little - or better, nothing.

[Thracian]

Thracian - calm yourself down.

You must get so angry about everything?

That weather eh? That bastard weather? Just to wind you up isn't it huh? Bastards.

It's people like you I worry about. If an armed police unit ever catches sight of those flamboyant shirts you wear, be sure to keep your head down. You're bound to be considered a threat of some sort.

[Zingari]

The surveillance team were wrong. Their mistake was inexcusable and the result not just about error but also sloppy leadership because it is the leaders who are supposed to put the failsafe's into place..

I'm often staggered by the sorts of people who get to be leaders in our Police Force.

Blair was an example. He never stopped wriggling over the De Menezes affair. He reminded me of that Police chief in Frost.

Look also at the officer who committed suicide recently as the consequences of a long string of affairs started to catch up with him.

His way of life - which made him ridiculously vulnerable to all sorts of undesirable pressure - was supposedly well known within the force yet still he was given a senior position and still people believed he was suited to even higher rank.

I don't expect people to get everything right. But I do expect them to set acceptable standards and to take responsibility for their actions.

That bit i 100% agree with

I do think that in the present terrorist threat climate though , we could just accept that however terrible this was , that it was still as a result of a string of errors . with no one person as the murderer or "unlawful killer" .

I'm sure that would only be seen as a scapegoat .

I'm just suprised that this incident seems to overshadow so many other instances of police shootings

A man was shot dead in Guildford only a couple of weeks ago and hardly got a mention in the media .

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/c...icle5270370.ece

[The People's Hero]

It's people like you I worry about. If an armed police unit ever catches sight of those flamboyant shirts you wear, be sure to keep your head down. You're bound to be considered a threat of some sort.

The only problem I've ever had with police is when I'm attending football matches!

I take your point about the shirts though!

It's girls heads I want to keep down though (although apparently the pushing on the back of the head is discouraged).

OLE!

[davieG]

That bit i 100% agree with

I do think that in the present terrorist threat climate though , we could just accept that however terrible this was , that it was still as a result of a string of errors . with no one person as the murderer or "unlawful killer" .

I'm sure that would only be seen as a scapegoat .

I'm just suprised that this incident seems to overshadow so many other instances of police shootings

A man was shot dead in Guildford only a couple of weeks ago and hardly got a mention in the media .

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/c...icle5270370.ece

Yes but he had boring name, although I'm sure the Sun could come up with a few distasteful puns on his surname.

[Zingari]

Yes but he had boring name, although I'm sure the Sun could come up with a few distasteful puns on his surname.

treet it with more respect mr g

[Thracian]

That bit i 100% agree with

I do think that in the present terrorist threat climate though , we could just accept that however terrible this was , that it was still as a result of a string of errors . with no one person as the murderer or "unlawful killer" .

I'm sure that would only be seen as a scapegoat .

I'm just suprised that this incident seems to overshadow so many other instances of police shootings

A man was shot dead in Guildford only a couple of weeks ago and hardly got a mention in the media .

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/c...icle5270370.ece

In many ways the De Menezes incident only goes to highlight all the others. And while people in authority are so keen to excuse the people responsible then there will never be sufficient pressure to effect improvements.

Individuals within our Police force just seem to run amok at times. Nippers getting whacked with batons at football matches, harmless prospective suicides getting despatched, the De Menezes shambles, high speed car chases that leave sometimes innocent pedestrians dead, the list, sadly, seems endless...

I wonder sometimes if police officers are selected more for their bravery and resolve rather than their brains and sense of reason.

[Suffolk_fox]

Thrac,

I still find it difficult to come to terms with your use of the word 'Execute' - I am sure the copper who fired the fatal shots didn't do it with "Bastard Terrorist, this will teach you and your kind" on his mind. I am pretty certain it was more along the lines of "fook, he's still moving! What if he detonates something?"

He was not killed as a punishment, he was killed as a possibly preventative measure. If he had explosives on him, the same copper would have been praised as a hero for his lightning reaction - would you still have used the word "Execute"? I don't think you would have done, even then.

It can be a shockingly thin line between villain and hero and thankfully the only time I had to issue a challenge, I got it right in not opening fire.

[Jon the Hat]

In many ways the De Menezes incident only goes to highlight all the others. And while people in authority are so keen to excuse the people responsible then there will never be sufficient pressure to effect improvements.

Individuals within our Police force just seem to run amok at times. Nippers getting whacked with batons at football matches, harmless prospective suicides getting despatched, the De Menezes shambles, high speed car chases that leave sometimes innocent pedestrians dead, the list, sadly, seems endless...

I wonder sometimes if police officers are selected more for their bravery and resolve rather than their brains and sense of reason.

What is a harmless prospective suicide exactly? A man with a gun? What happens when he shoots a passer by?

Should we allow scum to nick cars and drive around without chasing them down? Surely the resultant increase in numbers would casue far more deaths than police chases do.

The list is not endless at all, in fact it is pretty short. Our police are some of the best in the world. They very rarely shoot people, and when they do it is very rarely a wrong decision.

[Monk]

It's people like you I worry about. If an armed police unit ever catches sight of those flamboyant shirts you wear, be sure to keep your head down. You're bound to be considered a threat of some sort.

He was, on the district line platform of Earls Court before the Chelsea game

[Hullfox]

He was executed.

Ohhhh nooooooo heeeeeee wasnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn't

[Zingari]

Ohhhh nooooooo heeeeeee wasnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn't

well it is panto season