French Elections

[FilboFox]

Well they are over...

Segolene Royal - 47%

Nicholas Sarkozy - 53%

A very dissapointing result as I really wanted Socialist Royal to win but the Conservatives stay in power in France again... Boo Hiss!

I was amazed at my school how many of the people that had shown interest in the elections were supporting the somewhat nutcase-ish Sarkozy but hey, it's there downfall...

Well done Segolene on a fantastic attempt at the Presidency!

[Mort]

Excellent Result!

Sarko can now give France the kick-up-the-arse it's needed since the late sixties, the country is pretty much on its nees, the vested interests wont easily be swept away, but if Sarko keeps his nerve and faces them down then this could be great news for france and europe as a whole!

[FilboFox]

No... sorry I can't agree with that. Some of the things he suggested really are poor and as the televised debate between the candidates showed, he is incompetant and really hasn't got a clue about what he talking about. He made up several facts about serious issues that Royal had to correct him about... <_<

[BigGibbo]

what we talkin bout frogs for?

[Mort]

No... sorry I can't agree with that. Some of the things he suggested really are poor and as the televised debate between the candidates showed, he is incompetant and really hasn't got a clue about what he talking about. He made up several facts about serious issues that Royal had to correct him about... <_<

The same debate where Royale was in hysterics, maintaining (and I’m not exaggerating) Sarko’s election would mean civil war and blood on the streets? It was a reasonably assured performance from Sarko’s point of view as far as the debate was concerned and the movement in the polls (while not necessarily dramatic) reflected that was the consensus opinion.

The key feature of this election remained that Royale stood on practically Neolithic socialist platform! More subsidies, higher taxes, greater European federalisation and a general entrenchment of the French social model that ruined the country.

Sarko is not an ideal candidate; frankly, he seems a bit of a bastard to me, but the most important thing is that he did not run on a platform of maintaining the outmoded French social model (as many on the French right have done), instead he campaigned on a platform of radical reform, economic liberalisation, rapprochement with the US and a crackdown on crime and the power of groups like the Unions... it wasn't the easy option but it was IMHO the right one.

PS: I’m pretty sure we’re going to disagree on this though

[Daggers]

Apparently, Le Francais adore Le Piat D'Or.

[FilboFox]

The same debate where Royale was in hysterics, maintaining (and I’m not exaggerating) Sarko’s election would mean civil war and blood on the streets? It was a reasonably assured performance from Sarko’s point of view as far as the debate was concerned and the movement in the polls (while not necessarily dramatic) reflected that was the consensus opinion.

The key feature of this election remained that Royale stood on practically Neolithic socialist platform! More subsidies, higher taxes, greater European federalisation and a general entrenchment of the French social model that ruined the country.

Sarko is not an ideal candidate; frankly, he seems a bit of a bastard to me, but the most important thing is that he did not run on a platform of maintaining the outmoded French social model (as many on the French right have done), instead he campaigned on a platform of radical reform, economic liberalisation, rapprochement with the US and a crackdown on crime and the power of groups like the Unions... it wasn't the easy option but it was IMHO the right one.

PS: I’m pretty sure we’re going to disagree on this though

Your not kidding! Segolene did not say she wanted higher taxes, she even said that she wanted to make sure that taxes didn't get any higher! I also don't think that she would have entrenched the French government as she too was talking of reforms and was far more adament that there should be economic changes and a crackdown on crime. This was clear in the debate as she focussed more on it than Sarkozy who was talking of cutting back on some areas of the police force!

As for the debate, yes, Segolene did get worked up over the things that Sarkozy said but so would anyone with any care for people. He suggested that all disabled children should be put back into schools with other children and take away their specialist schools. Where would they then get the support needed to aid them properly?!? Sarkozy did make serious errors in the debate though that people didn't pick up on... virtually all of the serious policies of both sides he made facts up about! One clear example that I can remember is about Nuclear Energy Segolene was asking him exactly how much energy was efficient in France and he fumbled and then answered 50%... Segolene then TOLD him that it was 17% and on France3 the TV news program, it was later confirmed that on this and at least two other occasions it was Royal who was correcting him on his policy facts that he had got wrong... doesn't seem that good to me.

Also, he's no Tony Blair as some have suggested! Blair = Socialist not Conservative which is what Sarkozy is! Time will tell and you will see what happens to France as they increasingly neglect the poorer people of society... the French will regret this move!

[FilboFox]

As for the hysterical comments on civil war, well maybe it won't come to that but I certainly think that Sarkozy will REALLY stuggle to win round the Royal supporters including me!

[Chairman of the Bored]

Bad news for French rappers then? That's a shame.

[Geo V]

This doesnt affect me going on my annual trip tobring back cheap booze does it??

[Blue Bob]

Does this mean they will go out at night and burn more French cars??

I hope so, I had one and it was sh*t!!!

[Chairman of the Bored]

Does this mean they will go out at night and burn more French cars??

I hope so, I had one and it was sh*t!!!

Already starting judging from the news this morning. Expect a crackdown by Sarkozy and more migration into the UK! 500,000 French already in the UK apparently.

[Dr The Singh]

Terrible results for Sikhs and other ethnic minorities in france. Already the Sikhs are subjected at great discrmination by french policies, sikhs cannot drive, go to school, get a passport, medical treatment, enter government buildings unless they remove there religious items, including the turban, which baptised Sikhs cannot do!!

It's a fooking disgrace, over 50,000 SIkhs faught in WWII in freeing France, over 5000 died, and gues what they wore turbans, if it was good enough for them to wear the turban and fight for france, why is it not now!!!

[Mort]

Already the Sikhs are subjected at great discrmination by french policies, sikhs cannot drive, go to school, get a passport, medical treatment, enter government buildings unless they remove there religious items, including the turban, which baptised Sikhs cannot do!!

Your absolutley right! It's a disgrace when you consider the extent to which France discrimates against ethnic and relgious groups... but that is as true of the secularist left in France as some on the xenophobic right, indeed the left can often be even more intolerant, the entire country is barmy if you ask me

Expect a crackdown by Sarkozy and more migration into the UK! 500,000 French already in the UK apparently.

Most of the French expats voted for Sarkozy, most of the French living in the UK are here because of the economic backwardsness of France, some will probably head back over the next few year if Sarkozy is sucessful in affecting genuine liberal economic reform.

[James.]

Terrible results for Sikhs and other ethnic minorities in france. Already the Sikhs are subjected at great discrmination by french policies, sikhs cannot drive, go to school, get a passport, medical treatment, enter government buildings unless they remove there religious items, including the turban, which baptised Sikhs cannot do!!

It's a fooking disgrace, over 50,000 SIkhs faught in WWII in freeing France, over 5000 died, and gues what they wore turbans, if it was good enough for them to wear the turban and fight for france, why is it not now!!!

Is this really true?

I'm absolutely stunned. I had no idea that was the case.

[Mort]

Is this really true?

I'm absolutely stunned. I had no idea that was the case.

France have a very established "secular" tradition... all signs of public religious observance are very heavily regulated (veils, turbans, crosses, skullcaps etc...) its to do with the "seperation of church and state" but they take it to an insane extreme and its compounded by a significant xenaphobic minority within France... as i say "barmy"

[Dr The Singh]

Is this really true?

I'm absolutely stunned. I had no idea that was the case.

Yes, it is!! The SIkhs have taken the issue with European Parliament and UN, time will only tell if common sense will provail!!

[TrickyTrev]

Your absolutley right! It's a disgrace when you consider the extent to which France discrimates against ethnic and relgious groups... but that is as true of the secularist left in France as some on the xenophobic right, indeed the left can often be even more intolerant, the entire country is barmy if you ask me

Most of the French expats voted for Sarkozy, most of the French living in the UK are here because of the economic backwardsness of France, some will probably head back over the next few year if Sarkozy is sucessful in affecting genuine liberal economic reform.

40% of French-British ex-pats voted Sarkozy.

Another country decides it wants to work longer hours, have less security in order to earn a few more pennies. If Britain could exchange having the 5th largest economy for the 17th largest economy and meant all of us could knock 15 hours a week off of our working time I am sure we would. Hope they know what they are letting themselves in for.

[lookwhaticando]

40% of French-British ex-pats voted Sarkozy.

Another country decides it wants to work longer hours, have less security in order to earn a few more pennies. If Britain could exchange having the 5th largest economy for the 17th largest economy and meant all of us could knock 15 hours a week off of our working time I am sure we would. Hope they know what they are letting themselves in for.

If only it was that simple.

Countries like Britain and France can't afford to lock themselves down to the outside world, curl up into a nice warm ball and hope for the best.

There's a limit as to how protected your market can be, and how secure your jobs are. The problem France faces is the fact that their jobs are too secure. That might sound odd, but that's the root of the problem - those who have jobs will always have that job. Someone who doesn't yet have a job has a bloody hard time finding one - hence unemployment pinned at around 10% with some youth unemployment numbers over 25%. If your economy is running high unemployment, it can't produce as much - and in very simple terms, that's going to restrict the government's ability to shore up all these unemployed folk. An economy that isn't running anywhere near full employment is a grossly underemployed producer.

Worse still, to compound the problem, most of 'Old Europe' - France included - are suffering from demographic deterioration. That is, the population is ageing quickly. More pensioners, greater demands on the government purse, even more reason to get the country back to work. Further demands on the government coffers are not what France needs right now - it's debt is already too high for the European Central Bank's liking, and has been for a few years now. Not that the ECB was ever actually going to punish someone for breaking one of the Euro-zones key macroeconomic rules - heaven forbid we should upset the French and Germans (with a rule the Germans themselves insisted on)!

The same would be true for Britain - there's a limit as to what we can easily protect and afford to support. We too have an ageing population - ours ages less quickly than France and Germany - but because we haven't locked out millions of youth and legal immigrants from our jobs (as in, it's easier to hire and fire in the UK) we don't suffer the same consequences of high unemployment. As a country, we need legal immigrants to come here and work - to support our own citizens who are on the verge of retiring. The biggest financial issue across North & West Europe in the next 20-50 years will be national pensions - as the population ages and more retire, our low-ish birth rates won't be enough to support those pensioners.

Still, whether Sarkozy is actually going to change things remains to be seen. Eleven years ago, a man in his early 60s declared that we was going to change France, to heal it's social divisions. And what exactly did the sixty-something Chirac do during his 11 years of power? Absolutely squat...

[Jordan]

The upcoming parliamentary elections will be another huge factor in whether Sarkozy will be able to enact his reforms or not, but I'd guess that those votes will go in his favor.

The American media has been quick to hail Sarko's win because of his promises to restore a positive Franco-American relationship, but in reality, that issue wasn't high among the French voters' priorities.

I'd normally side with the left and I think Sarko has a bad habit of speaking off the cuff too often, but since I was unimpressed with Royal's policies and opinions, I didn't support either candidate. Sarko is a potentially polarizing figure and he'll face stiff opposition from the unions, but he'll make his decisions and his opinions known with conviction--that's something that may have appealed to many French voters, whether or not they always agreed with his beliefs.

[FilboFox]

Well as far as I'm concerned, Sarkozy is a complete waste of space!

One of his arguments as I may already have pointed out is not only about religious people having to conform to HIS society, but that he wants children who have mental disabilities put back into 'normal' schools. OK you say, but what happens then... the children will have to cope by themselves and won't be able to do anything. This was one of Segolene's points as she said that if they needed constant help then specialist schools should be kept open for them to work in and get the attention they need to advance.

We have already had two nights of riots in France over his election and if he keeps up with some of the policies that he wants to instigate then I can see a LOT more happening. Although if the French vote Segolene's socialists into the parliamentary seats then his power is basically cut by 80% so that would be good!

[Jordan]

he wants children who have mental disabilities put back into 'normal' schools. OK you say, but what happens then... the children will have to cope by themselves and won't be able to do anything. This was one of Segolene's points as she said that if they needed constant help then specialist schools should be kept open for them to work in and get the attention they need to advance.

That's not necessarily a bad thing in all cases if he's committed to promoting what's known as "inclusive education," but I'll admit that I'm ignorant of his plans for this.

[FilboFox]

That's not necessarily a bad thing in all cases if he's committed to promoting what's known as "inclusive education," but I'll admit that I'm ignorant of his plans for this.

Yes but what he was saying was that ALL mentally and physically disabled children should be put back into 'normal' schools. This would then lead to more bullying in cases and severe problems in their general education as they would have less "one on one" aid as the schools would not be able to accomodate every child all the time as is needed in some cases. Therefore in my opinion, Sarkozy made a VERY poor decision in this and Segolene had every right to not only question this in a televised debate but also to get somewhat angry with the suggestion as a Socialist who puts the needs of the people ahead of larger companies as Sarkozy will.