Nath Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 Back in August we asked members to complete a questionnaire detailing their views on safe standing. Having received and collated the responses, summary aspects of the results are as follows: Probably the most interesting part of the results was that despite only 18% of our members personally wishing to stand, 75% of them still thought supporters should be given the right to choose whether to stand or sit at football grounds. The other salient points to come out of the survey were: If safe standing went ahead somewhere between 10% and 20% of the capacity should be set aside for standing 4% of people would be put off attending football matches if safe standing was brought in 37% of members thought it could increase crowd trouble and hooliganism 44% thought it could make grounds more unsafe 20% thought their view of the game would be made worse 76% thought it would improve atmosphere 14% of people thought the overall match day experience would be less enjoyable 52% of people did think there could be such a thing as safe standing at football.... The above points have purposely been listed in a manner that is neither pro standing or anti standing, as the view from the Trust board has always historically been that we welcome freedom of choice in this matter but with emphasis on the word 'safe' in this safe standing debate. The results of the survey have helped reaffirm this standpoint that as a membership we welcome dialogue on possible freedom of choice to either stand or sit at football providing necessary safety assurances are in place. Full results in respect of all 16 questions that were asked (& comparisons with the national survey) will be detailed in an article later this week in order for you to read the whole results in order to draw your own independent conclusions. Many thanks to all who contributed feedback in respect of the safe standing questionnaire. Foxes Trust Linkage
Simi Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 Lovely. This is going to come in handy very soon. Considering this is only members of the FoxesTrust this is great. Further constructive comment to come...
Nath Posted 23 November 2007 Author Posted 23 November 2007 I though the same. How many young enthusiastic driven supporter's are in the trust? ... Bias result's!
lcfc_jme Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 18% of our members wish to stand, 75% of them thought supporters should be given the right to choose whether to stand or sit at football grounds...somewhere between 10% and 20% of the capacity should be set aside for standing 1. 4% of people would be put off attending football matches if safe standing was brought in 2. 37% of members thought it could increase crowd trouble and hooliganism 3. 44% thought it could make grounds more unsafe 4. 20% thought their view of the game would be made worse 5. 76% thought it would improve atmosphere 6. 14% of people thought the overall match day experience would be less enjoyable 7. 52% of people did think there could be such a thing as safe standing at football.... That all sounds quite promising from my own personal viewpoint, I'd say. 18% of members wish to stand - The Foxes Trust isn't representative of all City fans, and there will be a lot more enthusiastic people who were not surveyed giving their support for standing. With that being said, this isn't a bad number really seeing as the all of the people questioned believe up to 20% of capactiy should be set aside for standing. 75% think supporters should be given the choice - seems like the vast majority think it's only fair people should be allowed to choose. Hardly the picture some would paint of people being strictly anti-standing and made all the more suprising by the continued ducking of debate by all clubs, SAG's and the FLA who label it as a debate not worth having as not enough people are bothered etc etc. 4% would be put off attending games - only 4%. Aww bless, I bet that'll cost clubs an awful lot of money. What happens to the argument that women and children would definitely be put off attending because of all the rowdy fans in standing areas? I'd be fairly sure that more than 4% of our match-attending fan base is made up of women and children. And besides, I'm pretty sure that 4% would be made up for by more people entering the standing area of the ground anyway. 37% think it will increase crowd trouble and hooliganism - sounds like a fairly high number, though it still isn't a majority. However, there's no evidence to suggest that standing at the football increases hooliganism or crowd trouble - thousands of away fans stand week-in, week-out and most matches pass without incidents. Hooliganism was stamped out on the terraces during the 80's, wasn't it? 44% think it could make grounds more unsafe - presumably they're thinking of the old-style English terracing, and not the new, more modern safe-standing areas used in grounds in Germany. The safe-standing areas of these grounds in Germany do not make the stadium more unsafe at all. Infact, I think I read somewhere that there has been no reported instances of injuries caused in these standing areas, yet thousands of fans gather there every game. Sounds mighty dangerous, doesn't it? 20% thought their view would be made worse - because presumably, they'd wish to go into the middle of the standing area and sit down? If you put all the standers in a corner of the ground or a block behind one of the goals, it'll obstruct the view of nobody. 76% thought it would improve atmosphere - and that it would as well. An overwhelming majority. It's no secret that atmosphere is better at away games than it is at home games, and I'd say it's more because most people stand at away games. It's easier and more practical to sing when standing up. The club are as embarrassed as the fans about the lack of atmosphere in the Walkers - the majority of people surveyed have said they think this would improve the atmosphere. I'd say it's a good time for our club to use their initiative and listen to what their fans are saying.. 14% thought the matchday experience would be less enjoyable - fair enough, it's no good alienating fans, but that leaves 86% who don't think their matchday experience would be affected or it would be better. This 14% would cause the club a bit of a financial loss, but I'm pretty sure that they'd have no problem attracting fans back to the stadium if the idea of introducing safe-standing areas was carried out and successes on the pitch under the new management team began occurring. 52% did think there could be safe-standing at football - again, it's a majority. And I'm presuming of the 48% who don't believe there can be safe-standing, not many of them have seen how well behaved crowds in Germany are, the German model that safe-standing would see introduced and are actually thinking it'd be a return to the days of terracing in the 80's. Personally, with all that being said, I'm pleased with the inital findings of the survey. As somebody who's definitely pro-choice, it makes me happy to know the issue is being discussed and that a majority believe it could be implemented, it would improve atmosphere and are like-minded in believing there should be a choice. I'm looking forward to reading the entire article when it's published, and I'd be interested to know what the people higher up at our club think about it.
James. Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 Excellent post JME. I can not think of any justifiable argument as to why there should not be CHOICE. There's a long road to go before this is a reality but I see it as more a distinct possibility than a pipe dream.
Simi Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 Excellent post JME.I can not think of any justifiable argument as to why there should not be CHOICE. There's a long road to go before this is a reality but I see it as more a distinct possibility than a pipe dream. Same old story..."Hillsborough" Definitely a step in the right direction for the campaign, will be very interesting to see what the people higher up the scale have to say about this. Most of the figures are in our favour as well which is a real positive aspect. I'd love to see results if this was passed to everyone at the club who has there e mail address in the system.
Finnegan Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 How have their been FIVE replies and SUAS hasn't posted yet?
Simi Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 How have their been FIVE replies and SUAS hasn't posted yet? He'll be on the piss. But I've rang him and told him the situation! You signed up Finners, to SUSD?
Foxes_Trust Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 Just to confirm that given the average age of the Trust membership (not many in the 16 -25 bracket which traditionally is the highest age band to support standing), we would agree that overall we would expect if all City fans responded, then the %'s wanting to stand themselves would be higher. The most important statistic to us is that 75% are pro choice The Foxes Trust Board have always followed a policy of being pro safe standing, but felt we should consult members to ensure this policy was what our members wanted us to continue to pursue & we feel the results have confirmed this. For comparison, some Trust's at other clubs don't support safe standing & we are known by SUSD as being one of the most positive Trust's towards their campaign.
lcfc_jme Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 Excellent post JME.I can not think of any justifiable argument as to why there should not be CHOICE. There's a long road to go before this is a reality but I see it as more a distinct possibility than a pipe dream. There certainly is no reason why there shouldn't be choice, and these results seem to back that up. As Ched pointed out, whenever somebody mentions bringing back standing at the football, Hillsborough always gets brought up, which is quite unfair. Hillsborough could have been prevented if there were no fences at the front of the stand. If the area wasn't overcrowded due to incompetent turnstile operating and stewarding. Hillsborough was not a result of standing, it was a result of dangerous levels of overcrowding. I'd like to think that the lessons we have learnt from the disaster, together with the new structures the "safe-standing" would bring, would go a lot further to ensuring something like this never happened again. Yes, there's a long road to go before this becomes a reality, but it has to be said that the campaign is going from strength to strength and has made an awful lot of progress in the last couple of months. The arguments against standing are crumbling all the time and the wheels of change have been set in motion.
Simi Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 Just to confirm that given the average age of the Trust membership (not many in the 16 -25 bracket which traditionally is the highest age band to support standing), we would agree that overall we would expect if all City fans responded, then the %'s wanting to stand themselves would be higher.The most important statistic to us is that 75% are pro choice Cheers for putting this out there. No doubt that the range of 16-25 would contain more people wanting to stand. You only had to look at N Block last year to see that, I still feel very passionately about how the club treated that, but them giving it a go suggests that they do support standing. They told us straight standing would be permitted but 'some sitting' must be involved. No doubt the fear of the reaction of the SAG was at the forefront of their minds. Don't just let it settle at this though, continue to pressure the club on there stance, as will we.
Foxes_Trust Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 We also actively lobbied our local MP's to support the early commons day motion to examine the safe standing issue again & the vast majority signed.
Simi Posted 23 November 2007 Posted 23 November 2007 We also actively lobbied our local MP's to support the early commons day motion to examine the safe standing issue again & the vast majority signed. I know Standupandsing has been in contact with his local MP lately. A lot of Leicester seem to be behind the idea, we just can't let it slide.
Daggers Posted 24 November 2007 Posted 24 November 2007 We also actively lobbied our local MP's to support the early commons day motion to examine the safe standing issue again & the vast majority signed. Who did you lobby? Who signed the EDM? How did you lobby them? What follow up do you plan? Why did you not publish this action prior to this thread?
Simi Posted 24 November 2007 Posted 24 November 2007 This is Amanda from SUSD, one of the campaign leaders.. Great effort from the Foxes Trust and I look forward to seeing the whole article.My immediate comment would be to say that 44% of people thinking the ground would become more unsafe is a very high number. I wonder if this is because they're unaware of the German model and perhaps think that us campaigning want to go back to the old style terraces? That 37% of respondents think that standing would increase crowd trouble and hooliganism is also concerning. I very much hope that these responses are given out of ignorance... Still, the good news is that while I'm no mathamatician, the same people that have negative thoughts about safety and crowd trouble would also believe we should have choice. If not, then surely the figure would be much lower?? Am I right or wrong?
davieG Posted 24 November 2007 Posted 24 November 2007 Or 96% of people would NOT be put off attending football matches if safe standing was brought in 63% of members thought it might NOT increase crowd trouble and hooliganism 56% thought it might NOT make grounds more unsafe 80% thought their view of the game would NOT be made worse 76% thought it could improve atmosphere 86% of people thought the overall match day experience could be MORE enjoyable 52% of people did think there could be such a thing as safe standing at football....
Simi Posted 24 November 2007 Posted 24 November 2007 Or 96% of people would NOT be put off attending football matches if safe standing was brought in 63% of members thought it might NOT increase crowd trouble and hooliganism 56% thought it might NOT make grounds more unsafe 80% thought their view of the game would NOT be made worse 76% thought it could improve atmosphere 86% of people thought the overall match day experience could be MORE enjoyable 52% of people did think there could be such a thing as safe standing at football.... When you turn them around like that it really does look a lot better, shame they didn't publicize it like that! I gurantee if the people had been given information on the safe standing areas before they took the questionnaire it would look a lot more positive. Categories like 'restricted views' and the safety one.
Floating Fox Posted 25 November 2007 Posted 25 November 2007 Ahem. Whilst these results are important and encouraging in there own right it still shows the general ignorance of many people. Fed bollocks by the british media about Hillsborough they don't actually understand what a safe-standing area is. How on earth you think that the view would be worse is beyond me. Take yesterday for an example, an ALL SEATED area, I couldn't see the goal! Missed both goals because people we're standing infront of me and this resulted in people running up and down the isle at the back trying to get the best view! Again, I appreciate that what the foxes trust did was for there own terms and will be usefull in our battle but the authorities have known that fans want safe standing for a long time (92% in an official survey) but still choose to ignore the demand and confilct brought about by the all seater rule. Brilliant nanny state isn't it? I encourage people to lobby their MP's and for anyone who wishes to do so This is the link and tell them to sign the newEDM
Foxes_Trust Posted 25 November 2007 Posted 25 November 2007 Who did you lobby?Who signed the EDM? How did you lobby them? What follow up do you plan? Why did you not publish this action prior to this thread? All the details about this were in an article we published way back in January, here is a link http://foxestrust.co.uk/site/index.php?opt...58&Itemid=2 We were not aware of the new EDM which Standupandsing had posted a link to. It is worth individually lobbying your MP & you can point out from the earlier article above that they signed the previous EDM (or not). We will also contact all Leicestershire ones If you live away from Leicester, lobby your own MP (we can't justify doing that) Note of the 40 sigs so far, 2 Leicesteshire MP's have signed - David Taylor & Peter Soulsby
Floating Fox Posted 25 November 2007 Posted 25 November 2007 Note of the 40 sigs so far, 2 Leicesteshire MP's have signed - David Taylor & Peter Soulsby That would be mine!
shrood Posted 25 November 2007 Posted 25 November 2007 StandupSitdown could really do with updating their website. Check it occassionally but all the news on there is from a year ago at least. Wouldn't have heard anything about this EDM unless I'd come accross this. Will certainly lobby my MP and get my mates to do the same. There needs to be more publicity for it though.
David O'Leary Posted 25 November 2007 Posted 25 November 2007 Or 96% of people would NOT be put off attending football matches if safe standing was brought in 63% of members thought it might NOT increase crowd trouble and hooliganism 56% thought it might NOT make grounds more unsafe 80% thought their view of the game would NOT be made worse 76% thought it could improve atmosphere 86% of people thought the overall match day experience could be MORE enjoyable 52% of people did think there could be such a thing as safe standing at football.... Would they advertise it like that though
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.