Code of a Killer - Colin Pitchfork

[Thracian]

What the fook is the point in that?! If that's actually what you think then you might as well just kill him because it's going to take about 2 days for a 50 British geezer to pop his clogs in the middle of the sahara desert.

Plus, I don't really know what kind of expectations you have of African nations but I don't think Chad are going to let you bang a bunch of sex pests and murderers in their state without wanting something in return.

a) Of course it matters. I don't believe in killing people. So I would provide him with shelter and sustainance for a day and leave his fate to providence. To God's will if you like or his own wit, whichever you choose.

b) Of course they'd want something in return. That is what "negotiation" is about. Plus a reasonable degree of responsibility for the guy which I'm sure could be part of the negotiations. Either way I am sure the arrangement would consequences far more positive than paying for his upkeep in a British jail for the rest of his days.

[Zingari]

I would have more sympathy for Thrac's argument if he suggested that we went back to the days where prisoners had to earn their keep whilst in prison, rather than living off of tax payers.

i'm pretty sure he has suggested that many times

[Guest]

i'm pretty sure he has suggested that many times

I have; you haven't got us confused again? I'm the one with the less visible beard.

[Finnegan]

I don't believe in killing people.

Huh? When did you change your mind?

I thought you wanted some far-eastern death penalty last time we discussed crime?

And what have your own flirtations with homelessness got to do with me making a point about hysterical mass-media?

[Alexikokopops]

a) Of course it matters. I don't believe in killing people. So I would provide him with shelter and sustainance for a day and leave his fate to providence. To God's will if you like or his own wit, whichever you choose.

Hang on. You don't believe in killing people yet you're willing to dump a guy in the middle of the Sahara desert with one day of rations? You can't blame that on God's will. It's not like he's accidentally stumbled into the desert armed only with a Twix and a can of Fanta.

[Thracian]

I would have more sympathy for Thrac's argument if he suggested that we went back to the days where prisoners had to earn their keep whilst in prison, rather than living off of tax payers.

For more minor crimes that's exactly what I would want. But I'd have no problems dealing once and for all with people like Pitchfork and I seriously wonder if you would if, say, your niece or your sister had been one of his victims.

[Shrenchel]

a) Of course it matters. I don't believe in killing people. So I would provide him with shelter and sustainance for a day and leave his fate to providence. To God's will if you like or his own wit, whichever you choose.

b) Of course they'd want something in return. That is what "negotiation" is about. Plus a reasonable degree of responsibility for the guy which I'm sure could be part of the negotiations. Either way I am sure the arrangement would consequences far more positive than paying for his upkeep in a British jail for the rest of his days.

Are you just on a wind-up.

You're clearly sending him to his death. What good is a tent and a couple cans of spaghetti hoops to anyone in 55 C and possibly hundreds of miles from the nearest water source.

[Finnegan]

I really, really, really, REALLY hate the "if it was a member of your family he raped!" argument.

How the fook do you know what you'd think if it was a member of your family? While there's potential for egg-on-my-face here with this outburst, do you have any idea what it's like to have your daughter, sister or neice raped, Thracian?

Justice is justice. The LAST person, not the first, you should ask to decide upon it is a relative of a victim. Justice for all, be they brother, father, son or lover of anyone involved.

[Thracian]

Hang on. You don't believe in killing people yet you're willing to dump a guy in the middle of the Sahara desert with one day of rations? You can't blame that on God's will. It's not like he's accidentally stumbled into the desert armed only with a Twix and a can of Fanta.

When man first breathed on this planet he had to hunt or scavenge to survive in whatever environment he found himself. If Pitchork wanted the benefits of a protected environment he shouldn't have taken peoples lives and ruined others.

I didn't blame leaving him in the Sahara on "God's Will". It would clearly be the will of the court. His survival or otherwise would depend on providence - defined in my dictionary as "the protective care of God or nature". He'd start no worse off than many others in history.

[Guest]

For more minor crimes that's exactly what I would want. But I'd have no problems dealing once and for all with people like Pitchfork and I seriously wonder if you would if, say, your niece or your sister had been one of his victims.

Killing people as a punishment is a cop out. The families of the victims suffer for many years, whilst the offender gets to live with his guilt for a few? I can't see the logic in that.

The death penalty is also no deterrent.

But we've been through this before.

[Finnegan]

There are times I sincerely hope Thracian is a comic genius with a love for winding everyone up.

Because the alternative is that he's got some weird and dangerous views and is, ultimately, pretty disturbed.

[Thracian]

Oh...

... I'm not quite sure why I had more faith than that in his human rights beliefs. Yknow, Singapore et all.

I've said many times. The Bill of Human Rights is a millstone and one to which I would never subscribe for various reasons not the least of which is that applying it can conflict with the need to acknowledge and make atonement for the lost rights of the victims of crime.

[Shrenchel]

When man first breathed on this planet he had to hunt or scavenge to survive in whatever environment he found himself. If Pitchork wanted the benefits of a protected environment he shouldn't have taken peoples lives and ruined others.

I didn't blame leaving him in the Sahara on "God's Will". It would clearly be the will of the court. His survival or otherwise would depend on providence - defined in my dictionary as "the protective care of God or nature". He'd start no worse off than many others in history.

Yes he bloody would. How many people in history were born in a completely random part of the middle of the sahara desert?! Almost nobody. For thousands of years people that have been born there have been born into tribes that have already located the most inhabitable environments, water sources etc etc.

Physiologists reckon a man with an endless supply of food would last 2-3 days in the sahara desert. It would just be an expensive death penalty and there's no way of getting away from that.

[Guest]

I've said many times. The Bill of Human Rights is a millstone and one to which I would never subscribe for various reasons not the least of which is that applying it can conflict with the need to acknowledge and make atonement for the lost rights of the victims of crime.

The right to life (Article 2 ECHR, incorporated into English law by the HRA 1998) is not absolute.

[Thracian]

Huh? When did you change your mind?

I thought you wanted some far-eastern death penalty last time we discussed crime?

And what have your own flirtations with homelessness got to do with me making a point about hysterical mass-media?

I don't ever recall advocating the death penalty here and - unless angered by the commitment of some unspeakable crime - cannot imagine that I would because my own solution seems to fit my beliefs so much better and would have virtually the same effect.

I do, however, remember explaining the philosophy of punishment elsewhere and defending the idea of others choosing to have serious deterrents (after due warnings) instead of the often ineffective approach that we take.

[Thracian]

Yes he bloody would. How many people in history were born in a completely random part of the middle of the sahara desert?! Almost nobody. For thousands of years people that have been born there have been born into tribes that have already located the most inhabitable environments, water sources etc etc.

Physiologists reckon a man with an endless supply of food would last 2-3 days in the sahara desert. It would just be an expensive death penalty and there's no way of getting away from that.

And I quite imagine that thousands of unwanted kids have been abandoned far from "home" and any number of other situations where people might have unwillingly had to survive against the odds.

As for our murdering rapist if his potential for survival is the 2/3 days you mention it t would certainly his mind - just as he should have focused on the potential consequences before committing the crime.

As for the expense, it would be infinitely cheaper than keeping him prisoner for life.

[Thracian]

i'm pretty sure he has suggested that many times

Indeed I have.

[Thracian]

Are you just on a wind-up.

You're clearly sending him to his death. What good is a tent and a couple cans of spaghetti hoops to anyone in 55 C and possibly hundreds of miles from the nearest water source.

Not a lot but I'd recommend that whoever it was made the best of it. People can be extraordinarily resourceful.

[Thracian]

The right to life (Article 2 ECHR, incorporated into English law by the HRA 1998) is not absolute.

Sounds like a potentially long debate but if that's the case what's the problem with the Saharan holiday?

[Thracian]

I really, really, really, REALLY hate the "if it was a member of your family he raped!" argument.

How the fook do you know what you'd think if it was a member of your family? While there's potential for egg-on-my-face here with this outburst, do you have any idea what it's like to have your daughter, sister or neice raped, Thracian?

Justice is justice. The LAST person, not the first, you should ask to decide upon it is a relative of a victim. Justice for all, be they brother, father, son or lover of anyone involved.

No. In fact the first person who should be consulted and involved once a guilty verdict has been established is the victim's nearest.

Because they are the only one's directly affected and the only one's who know specifically instead of theoretically what it feels like, what they have lost and how their lives have been irreversibly changed.

They are the ones left with the lasting mental picture of their suffering child or children.

Indeed the insensitivity of so often sheltered judges to the suffering caused by crime is illustrated time and again by some of their decisions which sometimes go as far as trivialising what happened.

As for the "egg-on-face" comment I have no need of second hand experience nor would I want it. I was twice abducted myself as a 12/13-year-old and it scares you shitless. That I escaped without coming to any harm in no way lessened the trauma of the experience nor have the fears about the possible price of failing to escape ever gone away.

How the Pitchfork victims must have felt, or, for instance, Holly Wells and Jessica Chapman before they were killed, can only be imagined, but your apparent humanity towards such swine is so misplaced as to be pitied.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soham_murders

[Hullfox]

My mum and dad lived on the same street as him when it happened (a small cul-de-sac) - in fact my mum was pregant with me at the time!

I was told the story that one day he tried to get in to our house when my mum was alone and my dad was at work - thankfully she didn't allow him in.

My brother lived in the same street!

[fox123]

Just going back to Pitchfork briefly, I was speaking to my best friend about this recently, he is a Forensic Psychologist based at Long Lartin prison (home to some of the most notorious terrorists and offenders in the UK), he has written a drama, based on the book The Narborough Bloodings and from factual evidence he has found himself. He is trying to get it aired at the moment with out much luck, I am hoping they sway of it being the first case solved by DNA and the fact he is trying to get released will hold some sway in his Drama being released.... having read it I must say it is bloody brilliant (bias I may be). Time will tell if it does get put into production.

Edit to say, My friends believes Pitchfork will never be released.

[dayday]

Anybody been watching this,my sister was rawing her eyes out last week,she was good mates with Dawn,brought all the memories back for her.

[johnny the fox]

I knew of pitchfork a little bit...he is due for parole next year....

[Voll Blau]

The attempts at a Lestoh accent from most of the cast are dreadful, with one or two exceptions.