Leicester Legends of the 60s - Where The Story Began

[kushiro]

Found another amazing 1961 video that was uploaded to youtube recently. The title is 'Leicester players prepare for the Cup Final'. There's Ken Leek cropping up repeatedly, just before he was told there was no point preparing anymore. The way the film cuts from Leek (at 0.30) to Gillies, then back to Leek with the medicine ball - it's so poignant, Such good views of the ground too.

 

Leicester players prepare for the FA Cup Final 1960-1 - YouTube

 

Reading this quote from Hugh McIlmoyle, chosen in Leek's place, you wonder whether the film might have been shot just moments before that dramatic moment:

 

We were training on the Thursday before the final. Gillies came out whilst we were training. He was always smartly dressed, as if he had just come out of a Burton Menswear window. He very rarely watched us training. He called Leek over. You could see them in conversation and then Ken cleared off down the tunnel and we were all wondering what had happened. Then he called me over and told me I was playing in the final on Saturday! 

[enmac]

1 hour ago, kushiro said:

Found another amazing 1961 video that was uploaded to youtube recently. The title is 'Leicester players prepare for the Cup Final'. There's Ken Leek cropping up repeatedly, just before he was told there was no point preparing anymore. The way the film cuts from Leek (at 0.30) to Gillies, then back to Leek with the medicine ball - it's so poignant, Such good views of the ground too.

 

Leicester players prepare for the FA Cup Final 1960-1 - YouTube

 

Reading this quote from Hugh McIlmoyle, chosen in Leek's place, you wonder whether the film might have been shot just moments before that dramatic moment:

 

We were training on the Thursday before the final. Gillies came out whilst we were training. He was always smartly dressed, as if he had just come out of a Burton Menswear window. He very rarely watched us training. He called Leek over. You could see them in conversation and then Ken cleared off down the tunnel and we were all wondering what had happened. Then he called me over and told me I was playing in the final on Saturday! 

The penultimate paragraph of this interview with Mcllmoyle is interesting. Maybe Leek was injured/out of form? Even slight injuries would have been of concern in the days of no substitutes. Both played the week before. Don't understand how after 60 years the reasons have never leaked out. Ha ha. 

https://www.lcfc.com/news/1607505/former-player-remembers-hugh-mcilmoyle/featured

 

[enmac]

1 hour ago, enmac said:

The penultimate paragraph of this interview with Mcllmoyle is interesting. Maybe Leek was injured/out of form? Even slight injuries would have been of concern in the days of no substitutes. Both played the week before. Don't understand how after 60 years the reasons have never leaked out. Ha ha. 

https://www.lcfc.com/news/1607505/former-player-remembers-hugh-mcilmoyle/featured

 

From the horse's mouth:

 

We celebrated very hard after the semi-final win and I got into a bit of bother,' he said. 'The manager, Matt Gillies, took a dim view of it and I was left out of the final side.

 

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/Worthington+Cup+-+Hero+Ken's+priceless+memories.-a070899555

[deep blue]

On 15/02/2021 at 19:48, Webbo said:

It wouldn't surprise me, my dad did talk a lot of crap. Its just 1 theory amongst many. 

There were strong rumours at the time that he had drink problems, though. Such a shame he had to be dropped as it killed our chances in the final.  If I remember rightly, we had done the double over Spurs in a season where they had blown away all-comers.  Leek had scored both home and away and he terrified them.  It gave them such a boost to know they didn't have to face him in the final..

[davieG]

A bit ironic really Spurs are called bottlers but we bottled that and even more so the '63 final.

[kushiro]

Still a mystery, isn't it?  If he was dropped because 'we celebrated hard after the semi-final and I got into a bit of bother', why wasn't it until two days before the Final that he was told - more than five weeks later? And why has no-one revealed exactly what kind of 'bother' it was? It says in 'Of Fossils and Foxes' that in the records of the club's boardroom meetings, the page relating to the build up to the final was removed.  

 

Youtube's clever algorithm keeps throwing up more Leicester 1961 videos - so here are two more criminally under-viewed clips of our (anti-) hero in that Cup run:

 

This is the 4th round v Bristol City. By the time Leek scored, Richie Norman's OG had long ceased to matter:

Leicester City v Bristol City FA Cup 4th round 1960-1 - YouTube

 

And here's a much better version of the quarter final replay at Barnsley where you can see Leek's winner properly:

Barnsley v Leicester City FA Cup 6th round replay 1960-1 - YouTube

 

It's amazing how much footage there is of us in 60/61. Wish there was a similar amount for 62/63 (and for one of my favourite seasons - 83/4 - with Lineker / Smith / Lynex ripping defences apart - what I wouldn't give to see the 3-3 v Liverpool - but as far as I know only ONE of our games was televised all season - 4-1 v Watford (plus that hilarious 22 minutes in puddles v Southampton). Didn't someone from the club used to privately record the games from the TV gantry? Maybe in an attic somewhere...

 

Sadly there doesn't seem to be any footage of the game Leek says is his career highlight - Wales 3 Scotland 2, when his two late goals gave the Welsh victory in 1964. One man who would have been feeling sick that day was our own Dave Gibson, whose goal for the Scots looked like being the winner until Leek's double. 

 

 

[enmac]

2 hours ago, kushiro said:

Still a mystery, isn't it?  If he was dropped because 'we celebrated hard after the semi-final and I got into a bit of bother', why wasn't it until two days before the Final that he was told - more than five weeks later? And why has no-one revealed exactly what kind of 'bother' it was? It says in 'Of Fossils and Foxes' that in the records of the club's boardroom meetings, the page relating to the build up to the final was removed.  

 

Youtube's clever algorithm keeps throwing up more Leicester 1961 videos - so here are two more criminally under-viewed clips of our (anti-) hero in that Cup run:

 

This is the 4th round v Bristol City. By the time Leek scored, Richie Norman's OG had long ceased to matter:

Leicester City v Bristol City FA Cup 4th round 1960-1 - YouTube

 

And here's a much better version of the quarter final replay at Barnsley where you can see Leek's winner properly:

Barnsley v Leicester City FA Cup 6th round replay 1960-1 - YouTube

 

It's amazing how much footage there is of us in 60/61. Wish there was a similar amount for 62/63 (and for one of my favourite seasons - 83/4 - with Lineker / Smith / Lynex ripping defences apart - what I wouldn't give to see the 3-3 v Liverpool - but as far as I know only ONE of our games was televised all season - 4-1 v Watford (plus that hilarious 22 minutes in puddles v Southampton). Didn't someone from the club used to privately record the games from the TV gantry? Maybe in an attic somewhere...

 

Sadly there doesn't seem to be any footage of the game Leek says is his career highlight - Wales 3 Scotland 2, when his two late goals gave the Welsh victory in 1964. One man who would have been feeling sick that day was our own Dave Gibson, whose goal for the Scots looked like being the winner until Leek's double. 

 

 

I find it hard to understand also. Both Leek and McIImoyle played in the Saturday before the final. The fact that Leek left the club only weeks after points to a serious disagreement. Gillies managed City for a long time. Did he have any fall outs with any other players? His obituary points out that he was "diplomatic and mild mannered." Doesn't make any sense. 

[enmac]

2 hours ago, enmac said:

I find it hard to understand also. Both Leek and McIImoyle played in the Saturday before the final. The fact that Leek left the club only weeks after points to a serious disagreement. Gillies managed City for a long time. Did he have any fall outs with any other players? His obituary points out that he was "diplomatic and mild mannered." Doesn't make any sense. 

Slightly off topic. City in the 50s.David Coleman commentating. First footage I've seen of Arthur Rowley. 

 

Watch "Leicester City v Swansea Town 1955-6" on YouTube
https://youtu.be/0BCV6Bjlpu0
 

[enmac]

Here's a goal by Rowley. Probably the only one on video. 

 

https://youtu.be/GUMhA6y_J0k
 

 

 

 

[kushiro]

13 hours ago, kushiro said:

 It says in 'Of Fossils and Foxes' that in the records of the club's boardroom meetings, the page relating to the build up to the final was removed.  

 

 

 

In another section of that magnificent book it says that at the club's centenary celebrations in 1984 Leek and Gillies had put the past behind them. I wonder how the conversation went?

 

They both seem pretty cheerful in this photo taken on that day. Leek on the left, Gillies sitting with his coach Bert Johnson to his left:

 

 

 

 

 

[enmac]

2 hours ago, kushiro said:

 

In another section of that magnificent book it says that at the club's centenary celebrations in 1984 Leek and Gillies had put the past behind them. I wonder how the conversation went?

 

They both seem pretty cheerful in this photo taken on that day. Leek on the left, Gillies sitting with his coach Bert Johnson to his left:

 

 

 

 

 

Perhaps it wasn't Gillies? Maybe chairman /board? Saw a picture of the rule book from that era. Extremely extreme regarding "rules". 

[enmac]

1 minute ago, enmac said:

Perhaps it wasn't Gillies? Maybe chairman /board? Saw a picture of the rule book from that era. Extremely extreme regarding "rules". 

Clue. Previous post. Board removed page from the minutes regarding this event. 

[deep blue]

26 minutes ago, enmac said:

Perhaps it wasn't Gillies? Maybe chairman /board? Saw a picture of the rule book from that era. Extremely extreme regarding "rules". 

I'm sure that's correct.  I remember one or two references to the chairman/board ruling with a rod of iron and being very "old school" in their attitudes.

 

Re "bottling"the 2 cup finals - I would say we rather "shot ourselves in the foot" in the team selection v Spurs, and even then we had the misfortune of effectively playing with 10 men for much of the game.  We certainly did bottle the 2nd one, v Man U, though.

[deep blue]

11 hours ago, enmac said:

Slightly off topic. City in the 50s.David Coleman commentating. First footage I've seen of Arthur Rowley. 

 

Watch "Leicester City v Swansea Town 1955-6" on YouTube
https://youtu.be/0BCV6Bjlpu0
 

Ah, brings back the memories.  I think that was the first season I went to Filbo, aged 9.

[davieG]

6 hours ago, enmac said:

Perhaps it wasn't Gillies? Maybe chairman /board? Saw a picture of the rule book from that era. Extremely extreme regarding "rules". 

These Board Members were owners of big Leicester Industries and they ruled them with an iron fist as well so probably applied the same rules/logic to the football team.

 

Industry also had a well established them and us where the 'office staff' were considered superior to the 'floor workers' and were treated completely differently.

[deep blue]

Just looking at the attitudes of the board in those times.  Slightly off-topic and a bit later (circa 1970), but I have a definite memory of it being said that after Frank O'Farrell won the 2nd Division with us we were approached by Man U for him.  The board advised him that he should feel obliged to go because of the status of Man U (and he did, and he flopped).

 

 So weird that I wonder if that's a false memory.  Does anyone else recall a story along those lines being circulated?

[gerblod]

I was eleven in '61 and recall Leek being dropped before the final and being mystified by it. Seemed churlish at the time - dropping a star player for something other than injury.

 

But primarily I remember Len Chalmers hobbling up and down the left-wing and feeling outraged by the unfairness of it all. Don't recall who crocked him but it mentions a gash in his shin. That he stuck it is tribute to his mentality, but it was so sad and disappointing to watch.

[deep blue]

3 hours ago, gerblod said:

I was eleven in '61 and recall Leek being dropped before the final and being mystified by it. Seemed churlish at the time - dropping a star player for something other than injury.

 

But primarily I remember Len Chalmers hobbling up and down the left-wing and feeling outraged by the unfairness of it all. Don't recall who crocked him but it mentions a gash in his shin. That he stuck it is tribute to his mentality, but it was so sad and disappointing to watch.

In fact, Len Chalmer's leg was broken.  No subs, of course.  To add insult to injury he was blamed for Spurs 2nd goal - someone passed to him out on the wing, he couldn't turn so he just passed it to a Spurs player who hared through our depleted defence and set up the goal.  Hard Times.

[dynamark]

Twas only a flesh wound.

A monty python line now part of our vocabulary

[enmac]

3 hours ago, deep blue said:

In fact, Len Chalmer's leg was broken.  No subs, of course.  To add insult to injury he was blamed for Spurs 2nd goal - someone passed to him out on the wing, he couldn't turn so he just passed it to a Spurs player who hared through our depleted defence and set up the goal.  Hard Times.

According to Richie Norman, the foul on Chalmers by Les Allen should have been a red card. 

[LanguedocFox]

9 hours ago, enmac said:

According to Richie Norman, the foul on Chalmers by Les Allen should have been a red card. 

A pedant writes: they didn’t have red cards in those days. Allen should have been sent off, but again, in those days players got away with really bad tackles. And it would have taken a very brave ref (a contradiction in terms) to “spoil one of the great national sporting events.”

 

 

 

 

[enmac]

I know. Would have been a red card these days to be more precise. 

[PaulW]

On 15/02/2021 at 15:16, Foxaholic ME said:

The 60s were fabulous with all  due respect to recent  successes the league was much harder and I wonder how they would have  coped with the pitches rough tackling and  playing every game  Probablly  my memory is playing tricks  but apart from Stringy nobody seemed to get injured  

Len Chalmers!?