Are we missing

[Jamesino_LCFC]

Wesolowski as we fall back to 2 points from 9 since his injury?

One might also ask, not to do Kelly a disservice but was our short run of success more to do with Wesolowski than Kelly - no critiscism intended just food for thought?

Please dont say that , it will make us feel bad

I think though that a teams success cannot just revolve around one player, and that it must be to do with the team spirit in the camp and obviously the change of manager...

Saturday will be a win though for sure, I cant wait to give the w*anker a reception

[Ric Flair]

Please dont say that , it will make us feel bad

I think though that a teams success cannot just revolve around one player, and that it must be to do with the team spirit in the camp and obviously the change of manager...

Saturday will be a win though for sure, I cant wait to give the w*anker a reception

I just hope the players don't automatically think that because we will be in for a shock. It will be a tough match and the players can't lose focus or belief, it's essential we get a win but it's not guaranteed we will.

[Thracian]

Bouncing these problems about leads me back to a solution I thought about early in the season.

The problem for Kelly is that you cannot expect to fashion chances and score goals without wingers and creative players, plus a proper strike force.

But, on the other hand and with the first requirement being not to lose, you cannot smother the opposition attacks without having a team full of battlers.

Anyway to enable both the team would be:

Henderson

Stearman, Kisnorbo, Gerrbrand, Nils;

Maybury, Joey, Tiatto;

Hume,

O'Grady, Fryatt.

Subs: Logan, Williams, Smith, Hammond, Chambers.

It is not a team I would ever choose because I would never have five of those players anywhere near a team of mine, but then, as Anish would say, what the hell would I know about it with all my silly ideas about attractive, passing football that I could never sustain in reality.

The team I would pick from what little is available:

Loan goalkeeper;

Maybury, Kisnorbo, Gerrbrand, Tiatto;

Williams,

Stearman Gudjonsson, Smith;

Hume, Fryatt.

Subs: Nils, O'Grady, Hammond, Chambers and Logan.

More attackers in the second team.

[Jonbluefox9]

It's a good question but I also think what needs to be taken in to consideration is that they under-performed under Levein and haven't actually played much under Kelly. It's hard to gauge exactly why at the minute, if they get another chance this season and still look crap then i'm clueless for answers.

Ryan Smith is an excellent player, there's no question about that. But he's in-experienced and has faults defensively which when your in a relegation battle might not be a wise move to rely on him regularly.

Stephen Hughes again is inconsistent, he's starting to find his form again but i've always preferred him on the right side of midfield as I don't think he's strong enough to play in the centre when the battles on.

Williams is his own worst enemy, suspect motivation. Something a good manager might be able to sort out but in Kelly's little time as manager it's hard to work out whether Williams would fulfill his undoubted potential.

Sylla isn't good enough or if he is then just like Williams he hides it very well and I hate to see people wasting their talent.

Hume is playing his best football for the club and Fryatt has looke ddangerous in every game i've seen him. He's a natural finisher but i've been a little disappointed in his finishing in the past few games, might have been unlucky but class always prevails and he is class so he'll perform.

Other than that we haven't got much creativity that's playing or not playing.

Imo, that's where Ipswich beat us. Darren Currie was very dangerous for them from open play and corners. Everytime he got the ball it looked like something would happen. I don't think we've got a midfielder like that. Smith on his day can but he regularly fails to either play the killer ball, get a shot on target or deliver decent corners. Hughes and Williams should create but the fact is that Hughes has struggled in this league this season because opponents don't give him the time on the ball that he wants and Williams is too wasteful when he has possession. I can't remember the last time I saw Williams pick the ball up and play a short pass, make a forward run and pick the ball up again. He drops deep, collects, tries to ping a cross field pass and then leisurely jogs forward. On paper in the summer we were all so excited about our excellent group of central midfielders. Williams and Hughes were probably top of most peoples' lists with Wesolowski's promising pre-season and Gudjonsson had shown glimpses last season of what he could do. In reality, Wesolowski and Gudjonsson have been the most effective pairing but Joey's off and Jimbo's injured. As much as I hate to admit it, I don't think Hughes is cut out for Championship football especially in the middle of the park. I think Rob could have played any combination of midfielders on Saturday and we still would've lacked creativity. We lack a Currie but unfortunately they cost money.

[Jonbluefox9]

Bouncing these problems about leads me back to a solution I thought about early in the season.

The problem for Kelly is that you cannot expect to fashion chances and score goals without wingers and creative players, plus a proper strike force.

But, on the other hand and with the first requirement being not to lose, you cannot smother the opposition attacks without having a team full of battlers.

Anyway to enable both the team would be:

Henderson

Stearman, Kisnorbo, Gerrbrand, Nils;

Maybury, Joey, Tiatto;

Hume,

O'Grady, Fryatt.

Subs: Logan, Williams, Smith, Hammond, Chambers.

It is not a team I would ever choose because I would never have five of those players anywhere near a team of mine, but then, as Anish would say, what the hell would I know about it with all my silly ideas about attractive, passing football that I could never sustain in reality.

The team I would pick from what little is available:

Loan goalkeeper;

Maybury, Kisnorbo, O'Grady, Tiatto;

Williams,

Stearman Gudjonsson, Smith;

Hume, Fryatt.

Subs: Nils, Gerrbrand, Hammond, Chambers and Logan.

More attackers in the second team.

I don't think O'Grady would make a very good centre back. He's physical but to be a good centre back you need much more like positional sense, timing in the tackle, decent distribution etc. I'm not sure if he has any of these things.

[Ric Flair]

Imo, that's where Ipswich beat us. Darren Currie was very dangerous for them from open play and corners. Everytime he got the ball it looked like something would happen. I don't think we've got a midfielder like that. Smith on his day can but he regularly fails to either play the killer ball, get a shot on target or deliver decent corners. Hughes and Williams should create but the fact is that Hughes has struggled in this league this season because opponents don't give him the time on the ball that he wants and Williams is too wasteful when he has possession. I can't remember the last time I saw Williams pick the ball up and play a short pass, make a forward run and pick the ball up again. He drops deep, collects, tries to ping a cross field pass and then leisurely jogs forward. On paper in the summer we were all so excited about our excellent group of central midfielders. Williams and Hughes were probably top of most peoples' lists with Wesolowski's promising pre-season and Gudjonsson had shown glimpses last season of what he could do. In reality, Wesolowski and Gudjonsson have been the most effective pairing but Joey's off and Jimbo's injured. As much as I hate to admit it, I don't think Hughes is cut out for Championship football especially in the middle of the park. I think Rob could have played any combination of midfielders on Saturday and we still would've lacked creativity. We lack a Currie but unfortunately they cost money.

I totally agree with what you say there. Currie did only cost £250k though.

I'd like to see us take a punt on the two french wingers from Brighton and Vaughan from Crewe in the summer.

[Ric Flair]

I don't think O'Grady would make a very good centre back. He's physical but to be a good centre back you need much more like positional sense, timing in the tackle, decent distribution etc. I'm not sure if he has any of these things.

I think that confirms my statement about Thracian's been smoking the old hoburn.

[Thracian]

Imo, that's where Ipswich beat us. Darren Currie was very dangerous for them from open play and corners. Everytime he got the ball it looked like something would happen. I don't think we've got a midfielder like that. Smith on his day can but he regularly fails to either play the killer ball, get a shot on target or deliver decent corners. Hughes and Williams should create but the fact is that Hughes has struggled in this league this season because opponents don't give him the time on the ball that he wants and Williams is too wasteful when he has possession. I can't remember the last time I saw Williams pick the ball up and play a short pass, make a forward run and pick the ball up again. He drops deep, collects, tries to ping a cross field pass and then leisurely jogs forward. On paper in the summer we were all so excited about our excellent group of central midfielders. Williams and Hughes were probably top of most peoples' lists with Wesolowski's promising pre-season and Gudjonsson had shown glimpses last season of what he could do. In reality, Wesolowski and Gudjonsson have been the most effective pairing but Joey's off and Jimbo's injured. As much as I hate to admit it, I don't think Hughes is cut out for Championship football especially in the middle of the park. I think Rob could have played any combination of midfielders on Saturday and we still would've lacked creativity. We lack a Currie but unfortunately they cost money.

We haven't got a Owen Garvan either.

[Ric Flair]

We haven't got a Owen Garvan either.

James Wesolowski. Better than any midfielder in the division.

[Jonbluefox9]

I totally agree with what you say there. Currie did only cost £250k though.

I'd like to see us take a punt on the two french wingers from Brighton and Vaughan from Crewe in the summer.

Gareth Williams- £500K

Darren Currie- £250K

Don't want it to seem like I have it in for Williams. I think he is a very talented footballer but he really has an attitude problem. Comparing the fee we spent on him with the amount Currie cost Ipswich it makes me feel like we were ripped off. It'll be interesting to see if we keep Williams on next season. I suppose finances will dictate to a certain extent. I wouldn't be overly sad if he left but if he went for nothing, which I think he can do in the summer, it would be a bit demoralising because he has potential. A frustrating player.

[Ric Flair]

Gareth Williams- £500K

Darren Currie- £250K

Don't want it to seem like I have it in for Williams. I think he is a very talented footballer but he really has an attitude problem. Comparing the fee we spent on him with the amount Currie cost Ipswich it makes me feel like we were ripped off. It'll be interesting to see if we keep Williams on next season. I suppose finances will dictate to a certain extent. I wouldn't be overly sad if he left but if he went for nothing, which I think he can do in the summer, it would be a bit demoralising because he has potential. A frustrating player.

He's got another year left on his deal so if we let him go for free this summer I think it would be ludicrous. I still think with the right management he could be very good at this level. Levein managed to get him playing well at the end of last season at times but then things went off the boil. I know it's obviously more down to the player than the manager but with the new found confidence in the team and Rob Kelly being abit of a motivator I think Williams should start on saturday alongside Gudjonsson with Maybury and either Smith or Hughes on the wing.

Currie is a great player but Ipswich tend to think he's abit of a show pony and drifts in and out of matches. Both games this season though he's seemed to of caused alot of problems.

[Thracian]

James Wesolowski. Better than any midfielder in the division.

Exactly, we haven't got him. His absence and that of McCarthy have completely knocked our confidence and mostly because we simply have no comparable cover for either.

People will ask how does losing one match indicate a loss of confidence but when people talk before a game using that horrible phrase "if we can take something from the game" - in other words if we can pinch a sodding draw - then my interpretation is that confidence is flat.

[Durnerz]

Bouncing these problems about leads me back to a solution I thought about early in the season.

The problem for Kelly is that you cannot expect to fashion chances and score goals without wingers and creative players, plus a proper strike force.

But, on the other hand and with the first requirement being not to lose, you cannot smother the opposition attacks without having a team full of battlers.

Anyway to enable both the team would be:

Henderson

Stearman, Kisnorbo, Gerrbrand, Nils;

Maybury, Joey, Tiatto;

Hume,

O'Grady, Fryatt.

Subs: Logan, Williams, Smith, Hammond, Chambers.

It is not a team I would ever choose because I would never have five of those players anywhere near a team of mine, but then, as Anish would say, what the hell would I know about it with all my silly ideas about attractive, passing football that I could never sustain in reality.

The team I would pick from what little is available:

Loan goalkeeper;

Maybury, Kisnorbo, O'Grady, Tiatto;

Williams,

Stearman Gudjonsson, Smith;

Hume, Fryatt.

Subs: Nils, Gerrbrand, Hammond, Chambers and Logan.

More attackers in the second team.

I used to skin O'Grady, would you like me up front as well?

[Thracian]

I used to skin O'Grady, would you like me up front as well?

If you're good enough son. Are you saying he's a bad player or that you're a good one?.

[Durnerz]

If you're good enough son. Are you saying he's a bad player or that you're a good one?.

He's not the best at tackling,and i've never been the quickest, i'll let other members of this board (e.g Parsons) who have seen me play to judge me.

[Stevosevic]

He's not the best at tackling,and i've never been the quickest, i'll let other members of this board (e.g Parsons) who have seen me play to judge me.

O'Grady doesnt need to tackle. I doubt very much you are better them him as he is now playing in the leicester 1st team, where are you playing?

[Durnerz]

O'Grady doesnt need to tackle. I doubt very much you are better them him as he is now playing in the leicester 1st team, where are you playing?

He will if Thrac wants to play him as a centre back!

[Thracian]

He's not the best at tackling,and i've never been the quickest, i'll let other members of this board (e.g Parsons) who have seen me play to judge me.

Anybody out there?. Is Durnerz any good?. Which reminds me of something I wanted to ask? Are there any local footballers who really have the ability to play non-League or higher and who do they play for? I used to know the scene backwards years ago but I've since lost track. Email me if this is the wrong forum to comment.

[Thracian]

He will if Thrac wants to play him as a centre back!

It reflects my frustration really. We are always losing goals to headers from corners, free-kicks because we don't have any really dominant aerial defenders, especially when McCarthy's out. Dion was the best but his so-called mistakes against Stoke cost him permanently.

O'Grady just struck me as stronger and better in the air than Gerrbrand or Nils but the reality is we don't really have an alternative that fills you with confidence.

If we can't defend corners and near the penalty area free kicks, I suppose the next best thing is to play high enough not to conceded them.

[Thracian]

He's not the best at tackling,and i've never been the quickest, i'll let other members of this board (e.g Parsons) who have seen me play to judge me.

Anyway, based on what you say, I've revised my opinion and put Gerrbrand back. Not that it fills me with confidence.

[Milky]

Anyway, based on what you say, I've revised my opinion and put Gerrbrand back. Not that it fills me with confidence.

i read in the leeds match programme that Gerrbrand told levein before he signed him that if he was after a ball winning centre back that was strong in the air, he wasn't the man to sign, he can only offer the ball playing option and play alongside the other type of player.

[Thracian]

i read in the leeds match programme that Gerrbrand told levein before he signed him that if he was after a ball winning centre back that was strong in the air, he wasn't the man to sign, he can only offer the ball playing option and play alongside the other type of player.

Sounds about right.

[Jonbluefox9]

He's got another year left on his deal so if we let him go for free this summer I think it would be ludicrous. I still think with the right management he could be very good at this level. Levein managed to get him playing well at the end of last season at times but then things went off the boil. I know it's obviously more down to the player than the manager but with the new found confidence in the team and Rob Kelly being abit of a motivator I think Williams should start on saturday alongside Gudjonsson with Maybury and either Smith or Hughes on the wing.

Currie is a great player but Ipswich tend to think he's abit of a show pony and drifts in and out of matches. Both games this season though he's seemed to of caused alot of problems.

Oh right. I thought we signed him on a two year deal but if not then him going on a free this summer won't happen.

For some reason, the bad things that Williams does stick in my mind more so than the good things. His pass for one of Connolly's goals against Stoke City at the beginning of this season was an example of his creative passing range and his goal up at Bolton was superb but the his first 45 minutes at home against Southampton in the league was absolutely shocking and when he comes on as sub I sometimes forget he's even on the pitch. He doesn't appeal to me because of his tendency to back away from a ball if it's 50-50. He seems to have something in his mind which tells him to put himself into reverse instead of going to put a challenge in. He would be much more loved by the supporters if he had a positive mentality instead of his first thought being "I won't win that ball, best get my arse back and defend". We like to see players who believe they'll win 50-50s and put their body on the line for the club. Wesolowski is an ideal example of this but he's injured and someone has to try and fill the gap. He's a one off talent though and I think as Davie G was saying from the start he does leave a hole in the side which we've struggled to fill.

[davieG]

Oh right. I thought we signed him on a two year deal but if not then him going on a free this summer won't happen.

For some reason, the bad things that Williams does stick in my mind more so than the good things. His pass for one of Connolly's goals against Stoke City at the beginning of this season was an example of his creative passing range and his goal up at Bolton was superb but the his first 45 minutes at home against Southampton in the league was absolutely shocking and when he comes on as sub I sometimes forget he's even on the pitch. He doesn't appeal to me because of his tendency to back away from a ball if it's 50-50. He seems to have something in his mind which tells him to put himself into reverse instead of going to put a challenge in. He would be much more loved by the supporters if he had a positive mentality instead of his first thought being "I won't win that ball, best get my arse back and defend". We like to see players who believe they'll win 50-50s and put their body on the line for the club. Wesolowski is an ideal example of this but he's injured and someone has to try and fill the gap. He's a one off talent though and I think as Davie G was saying from the start he does leave a hole in the side which we've struggled to fill.

I'm not sure i used those exact words but they are apt. For me it's not just the 50-50 situation, he just doesn't seem to want to be part of the play. All the best creative players I've sen over the years would rip your leg off to get a touch of the ball, they've needed to satisfy their creative spirit. Williams looks like he's hiding all the while, afraid that someone will pass him the ball, sure if it comes to his feet he'll try and do something with it, often quite creative.

Do you ever seem him pass the ball and imediately run into space to receive a return ball, hardly ever. I've sat and watched him in some games for a good 20 mins and he's not only not been involved he's not even tried to be involved. Other players try to find themselves some space, Williams seems to go and find an oppo player to stand next to ensuring that no one passes the ball to him.

I'm sure it's not a conscious thing he does, but he does it none the less, people have described him as shy and I guess that's what we're seeing. I don't hold out much hope of a change though; he was like it at Forest, and he's been like it under Adams and Levein with only the odd cameo of involvement.

Sad really such a waste of natural talent.

[Anish]

I'm not sure i used those exact words but they are apt. For me it's not just the 50-50 situation, he just doesn't seem to want to be part of the play. All the best creative players I've sen over the years would rip your leg off to get a touch of the ball, they've needed to satisfy their creative spirit. Williams looks like he's hiding all the while, afraid that someone will pass him the ball, sure if it comes to his feet he'll try and do something with it, often quite creative.

Do you ever seem him pass the ball and imediately run into space to receive a return ball, hardly ever. I've sat and watched him in some games for a good 20 mins and he's not only not been involved he's not even tried to be involved. Other players try to find themselves some space, Williams seems to go and find an oppo player to stand next to ensuring that no one passes the ball to him.

I'm sure it's not a conscious thing he does, but he does it none the less, people have described him as shy and I guess that's what we're seeing. I don't hold out much hope of a change though; he was like it at Forest, and he's been like it under Adams and Levein with only the odd cameo of involvement.

Sad really such a waste of natural talent.

Absolutely 100% spot on Couldn't agree with you any more.

I used to play in centre midfield and I loved getting the ball and looking for sharp one-twos - and I'm sure many other people here who play are the same. Williams gets the ball, plays a pass and then thinks to himself, "I've done my bit for the next 5 minutes, let me relax for a while." It infuriated me last season when I went to a lot more games, and it's not improved at all this season. I don't think he's good enough to be a good player at this club or any other club challenging for promotion - he just doesn't get involved enough. I'm beginning to think the same about Hughes too - although he does put more effort in so there is some redeeming quality to his game.