Australian Open 2009

[Father Ted]

No doubt that was somehow connected to football hooligans.

Why?

[purpleronnie]

Why?

Not sure he's being serious.

I'm sure if that happend over here (imagine ), it would have been linked to none existent football hooligans.

I heard the they were operating a zero tollerance after last year problems, worked well.

[Uncle Albert]

Murray was class today - second set was brilliant. Next round will be more testing.

[SOCCERROO FOX]

Gasquet and Gonzales was a quality match

[SOCCERROO FOX]

Well done to Dokic!! Didn't think she'd be able to get past Wozniacki, even being on home turf

Shes now thru to the Quarters after an epic game that went close to 3 hours. One of the best female games i have ever seen getting up 8-6 in the last. For a wildcard to get this far and buring the hatchet with all Aussie fans hope the juggernaut continues.

Also good to see after over 3-4 years she is back in the top 100

[Darkzzz_]

Novak is looking good at the moment.

Would like to see him in the final.

This year is a real toss up between 4 of them.

Murray is looking amazing so far.

[FilboFox]

Hmm... surprise surprise... told you he'd not win it.

[Darkzzz_]

Hmm... surprise surprise... told you he'd not win it.

To be fair I never said he would.

I have always said, Murray isn't good enough to win a slam just yet. There are players who are simply better.

I really enjoyed the match and thought it was a good game of tennis, Verdasco the worthy winner for sure.

The first time he has beaten Murray and what a way to do it.

Nadal hardly broke a sweat in his game winning on straight sets.

I reckon Federer will win it this year.

[FilboFox]

To be fair I never said he would.

I have always said, Murray isn't good enough to win a slam just yet. There are players who are simply better.

I really enjoyed the match and thought it was a good game of tennis, Verdasco the worthy winner for sure.

The first time he has beaten Murray and what a way to do it.

Nadal hardly broke a sweat in his game winning on straight sets.

I reckon Federer will win it this year.

Nicely summed up there.

But in all fairness, I wasn't specifically targeting you... it was more a general statement to all those Murray fans who've been carried along by this ridiculous hype that is surrounding him.

I said it many weeks ago, you can't defend your way to a Grand Slam title... and Murray once again, despite showing that he does have some very good shots in him, predominately tried to defend the whole time and Verdasco was therefore able to go for his big shots... and to great effect.

I'm not sure if it was on this board but I do also remember saying I thought he'd go out in the 4th Round... so I'm quite happy that I've got that right! Would have liked it better if he'd lost in the 1st Round though... that'd have really shut up the press from talking him up like they do.

[FilboFox]

On a side note, I too was ecstatic to see Dokic making the Quarters! Very well done to her as I can only imagine the difficulties of being back there with everyone supporting you... she's a damn good player though and certainly not one to be taken lightly!

And a quick last message to once again voice my support for Serena Williams! Glad to see her making the Quarters again... albeit due to the other player retiring...

[Darkzzz_]

Nicely summed up there.

But in all fairness, I wasn't specifically targeting you... it was more a general statement to all those Murray fans who've been carried along by this ridiculous hype that is surrounding him.

I said it many weeks ago, you can't defend your way to a Grand Slam title... and Murray once again, despite showing that he does have some very good shots in him, predominately tried to defend the whole time and Verdasco was therefore able to go for his big shots... and to great effect.

I'm not sure if it was on this board but I do also remember saying I thought he'd go out in the 4th Round... so I'm quite happy that I've got that right! Would have liked it better if he'd lost in the 1st Round though... that'd have really shut up the press from talking him up like they do.

Thats ok. Just wanted to clear that up.

There is a huge media circus following Murray, they will always talk him up and when he falls they always come up with some excuse but they never say he was beaten by the better player. I kind of feel sorry for athletes here. There is so much pressure thrust upon them.

I have learnt that about this country in all sports not just tennis, It is the way of the media over here, They hype everyone up to fail.

[Ultra]

Murray had said before the match that he was less than 100% fit.

But given his form in recent tournaments, this defeat is still a real disappointment, and does nothing to dispel the fears that he may become a Tim Henman-style choker, unable to win one of the grand slam events.

[martyn]

Christ, this defeat bringing out the worst in people already.

FilboFox, we know you have a hatred for Murray and refuse to believe he's any good but, given his form going into the tournament, i'd suggest that the 'hype' was fairly well justified, especially considering the fact that he had beaten the worlds top three in 7 out of his last 8 meetings (or something like that). Although Murray can be passive (too much do at times) to suggest he is simply a defender is ridiculous. You don't get to #4 in the world being a one trick defensive pony.

Ultra, there is absolutely nothing to suggest he is a grand slam choker . He's 21, has already got to a grand slam final (and lost to an inspired Fed playing the best he has the last 2 years), and won more Masters Series than Henman already. Probably should let him play the next 15 Slams first (by which time he'll be 25) before deciding about his mental state in Grand Slams. Indeed ironically, Verdasco is one of the biggest chokers on tour (see R. Gasquet also).

[purpleronnie]

As big as a fan I am of murrays I dont think he can win a major anytime soon. I think the one off matches against top players he can beat them we've seen that on numourous occassions.

I just dont think he can do it throughout one tournament, he showed in the US open he's close though.

At least he gets to number 4 in the world without relying on wimbledon.

[FilboFox]

Christ, this defeat bringing out the worst in people already.

FilboFox, we know you have a hatred for Murray and refuse to believe he's any good but, given his form going into the tournament, i'd suggest that the 'hype' was fairly well justified, especially considering the fact that he had beaten the worlds top three in 7 out of his last 8 meetings (or something like that). Although Murray can be passive (too much do at times) to suggest he is simply a defender is ridiculous. You don't get to #4 in the world being a one trick defensive pony.

Ultra, there is absolutely nothing to suggest he is a grand slam choker . He's 21, has already got to a grand slam final (and lost to an inspired Fed playing the best he has the last 2 years), and won more Masters Series than Henman already. Probably should let him play the next 15 Slams first (by which time he'll be 25) before deciding about his mental state in Grand Slams. Indeed ironically, Verdasco is one of the biggest chokers on tour (see R. Gasquet also).

Do you watch him play? How then can you not say that the core element of his game is to defend!!?! Even David Lloyd, when he was playing Verdasco, was saying that Verdasco was trying to be like Murray in that he was sitting on the baseline and waiting for Murray to make the mistake! In other words, defending, keeping the ball in play and waiting for the player to make the error!!! That, and I don't just say he defends... I have said, not sure if I said it on here or not... can't remember... but I have said that he defends the vast majority of the time and waits for the chance to be able to hit a more attacking shot. However, that style of play won't work all the time... and certainly not for the vast majority of the time in Grand Slams where it's a 5 set match and you have to play for a lot longer.

As for beating the world's top 3 players... well I don't know about Djokovic as I can't remember them playing recently... but as for Nadal and Federer, it's all well and good beating them at the start of the year when they are just looking to set themselves up for the Oz Open and are trying to find some form or alternatively, beating them at the end of the year when they are knackered which I'm sure they were considering the year's they'd both had... but if you can't beat them, or match them consistently at the Slams, it means **** all. Federer trounced Murray when it mattered in the US Open final and Nadal had already said he was fatigued before their semi-final match in which he still managed to push him!

And then you say the hype was justified... what a load of sh*te! Murray defended his title in Qatar... he's managed to beat the worlds top players a few times during the end and start of a season... but he's still, in comparison, done **** all compared to them. Nadal, Federer and Djokovic when they are fully fit and playing their best are FAR better players than Murray and to say that Murray was the favourite going into this tournament is a joke! Yes, he's had some good form... but when you get to a Slam, you have to play a lot more players and for a longer period of time... and considering we all know that Nadal, Federer and Djokovic can all do it, but we are yet to see whether Murray can, to call him a favourite and hype him up like they all were is, yes, ridiculous!

Yes, I do hate Murray... I won't go into why again... but what I hate just as much, if not more, are the fans who support him and try to argue he's possibly better than the other top players and hype him up beyond belief... I mean come on! I've heard "Favourite for the Oz Open", "He's the World number 1, I don't care what the rankings say", "He'll win his first Slam this year"... what utter drivel! At the Oz he was never going to outlast the other top players what with the heat, them playing far better than him so far by the looks of things, at the French he won't stand a chance against the clay-court specialists, Wimbledon is a fast paced game and unless he's improved dramatically from now till then he won't be able to do much better than he did last year... and then there is the US Open... he may have a slight chance but he'll certainly not be the favourite with Federer, Nadal and Djokovic around... and what with this revised 2009 schedule, all of them should be fresher and fitter for that tournament meaning his chances drop even more.

Murray fans need to gain some perspective... he isn't the worlds best player and he isn't likely to win a slam any time soon so stop harping on about him likes he's God's gift to tennis!

[FilboFox]

As big as a fan I am of murrays I dont think he can win a major anytime soon. I think the one off matches against top players he can beat them we've seen that on numourous occassions.

I just dont think he can do it throughout one tournament, he showed in the US open he's close though.

At least he gets to number 4 in the world without relying on wimbledon.

That's better... someone with some sense!

Although I would say that at the US Open, the other players were already saying going into the tournament that they were fatigued because of the long years schedule... that's been revised this year so I would imagine he'll have more a job on to reach the final again. Not impossible though.

Didn't he get to the Quarters at Wimbledon? Or was it the 4th round... either way, that's still fairly far in the draw... last 16 or last 8... so he'll still have some points to hang on to from that.

[martyn]

I'd like you to point out where I said Murray was favourite for the title Seems to me that anyone who does not take your stance regarding Murray is automatically aboard the hype bandwagon claiming he is god's gift.

If you can't comprehend that winning 2 masters series titles back to back combined with his recent record against the top 3 justifies a tag as being "one of the favourites" then well more fool you. Similarly, he is far more likely to be bookies favourite in this country owing to the fact he is British, and in many cases is likely a jingoistic bet as opposed to a genuine belief. Also, does 2008 count as recent? If so, Murray's last 2 matches versus Nole are as follows:

2008 ATP Masters Series Cincinnati Hard Murray 7-6(4) 7-6(5)

2008 ATP Masters Series Canada Hard Q Murray 6-3 7-6(3)

Similarly, to use the argument about Fed/Nadal "trying to find form" or whatever is bollocks and I'm not having it. At the Kooyong exhibition (yes i realise it was an exhibition but a highly competitive one), the final set between Murray and Nadal was incredible, some of the best tennis I've seen in recent years. Furthermore, Fed has been struggling for a while, with his forehand being especially ropey and Murray dismantled him in Qatar, absolutely dismantled him final 2 sets. If you are going to use the "tired"/"trying to find form" justification I laugh, because all players on the tour play to similar schedules. If you are willing to use that, then it is as justifyable to say that Murray had an "off day", played an "inspired oponent" or whatever.

About the whole defensive thing, of course he is an excellent defender, but you don't get to where he is with this as a sole or indeed majority component. Indeed "if you watch Murray" (borrowing one of your favourite lines there) his best matches (eg Nadal at the US Open) were when he takes the game to his opponent and uses his cross court backhand to great effect. That is why it is frustrating to see him play like he did against Verdasco today, he was extremely passive and needs to get out of the habit like he did towards the latter part of the year (like Cincinnatti where he played like a man possessed).

Murray was not my favourite for the Oz open, however, he has the talent to win a couple of grand slams in his career. You need to stop being so precious about people defending Murray, because it doesn't automatically assume that they think "he's gods gift". Perhaps you can do some tennis posting whilst Murray is winning/doing well in tournaments as opposed to crawling out of the woodwork at the merest hint of trouble

[martyn]

Also, I'm trying to comprehend how you can deem it "not impossible" for Murray to reach a grand slam final this year, then have the temerity to scoff that people are deluded and spouting "utter drivel" for claiming he can win a grand slam in the same time period.

[Darkzzz_]

Murray is rubbish.

Andrew Castle is the best.

[Milky]

As big as a fan I am of murrays I dont think he can win a major anytime soon. I think the one off matches against top players he can beat them we've seen that on numourous occassions.

I just dont think he can do it throughout one tournament, he showed in the US open he's close though.

At least he gets to number 4 in the world without relying on wimbledon.

Interesting that you weren't saying any of this before he got knocked out

let's be honest here, if that was Henman you'd be slating him, saying he's bottled it and can't handle the pressure of a favourites tag!

[FilboFox]

I'd like you to point out where I said Murray was favourite for the title Seems to me that anyone who does not take your stance regarding Murray is automatically aboard the hype bandwagon claiming he is god's gift.

If you can't comprehend that winning 2 masters series titles back to back combined with his recent record against the top 3 justifies a tag as being "one of the favourites" then well more fool you. Similarly, he is far more likely to be bookies favourite in this country owing to the fact he is British, and in many cases is likely a jingoistic bet as opposed to a genuine belief. Also, does 2008 count as recent? If so, Murray's last 2 matches versus Nole are as follows:

2008 ATP Masters Series Cincinnati Hard Murray 7-6(4) 7-6(5)

2008 ATP Masters Series Canada Hard Q Murray 6-3 7-6(3)

Similarly, to use the argument about Fed/Nadal "trying to find form" or whatever is bollocks and I'm not having it. At the Kooyong exhibition (yes i realise it was an exhibition but a highly competitive one), the final set between Murray and Nadal was incredible, some of the best tennis I've seen in recent years. Furthermore, Fed has been struggling for a while, with his forehand being especially ropey and Murray dismantled him in Qatar, absolutely dismantled him final 2 sets. If you are going to use the "tired"/"trying to find form" justification I laugh, because all players on the tour play to similar schedules. If you are willing to use that, then it is as justifyable to say that Murray had an "off day", played an "inspired oponent" or whatever.

About the whole defensive thing, of course he is an excellent defender, but you don't get to where he is with this as a sole or indeed majority component. Indeed "if you watch Murray" (borrowing one of your favourite lines there) his best matches (eg Nadal at the US Open) were when he takes the game to his opponent and uses his cross court backhand to great effect. That is why it is frustrating to see him play like he did against Verdasco today, he was extremely passive and needs to get out of the habit like he did towards the latter part of the year (like Cincinnatti where he played like a man possessed).

Murray was not my favourite for the Oz open, however, he has the talent to win a couple of grand slams in his career. You need to stop being so precious about people defending Murray, because it doesn't automatically assume that they think "he's gods gift". Perhaps you can do some tennis posting whilst Murray is winning/doing well in tournaments as opposed to crawling out of the woodwork at the merest hint of trouble

Where did I say YOU thought he was the favourite? And no, I don't think that everyone who likes him is on the hype bandwagon as you put it... I just get pissed off with those who are on it and constantly try to say that he has a great chance of winning a Slam when he's just simply not good enough... out of all of the winners of Slams over the past years that I've seen, if Murray was to win a Slam, I'd have to say, unless his game changes in the coming months and years, he'd be the worst out of all of them. That's just my opinion and probably one of the reasons that I am so anti-Murray...

When I was talking about matches vs Djokovic, I wasn't saying he hadn't beaten him recently either... if you read carefully, I was saying that I didn't know because I couldn't remember! And then you have a go at me for saying that he oughtn't be one of the favourites... well no... I don't think he should be classed as THE favourite as some were saying as he, despite winning 2 back to back Masters, is still no where near the standard to win a Slam in my opinion.

As for players playing the same schedule... well yes they do... but do all of them make the semi's and final's every time as Federer and Nadal do pretty much every tournament? Erm... no. In which case, yes, I would say that they were pretty tired at the end of the year and weren't playing their best... certainly Nadal vs Murray at the US Open, Nadal was no where near his best. Be that a combination of Murray playing well, his fatigue or injury or whatever, a combination of factors lead to him not playing the same as he did at Wimbledon where he destroyed Murray. As for the Federer matches where he "dismantled" him, well yes, he was playing very very well but that was due to, as you say, Federer not playing his best and looking very poor indeed. When push comes to shove though, we've all seen what Federer can do to Murray on a hard court... US Open final...

And I will stand by my comment of Murray's main asset and indeed majority component of his game being defending... during the vast majority of matches I've seen him play, he will stand at the baseline and chase everything down, letting the opponent do the dictating for most of the point... ending with them either making the mistake or Murray finally becoming more aggressive and taking control... the core element still remains him defending though...

Yes, in some very good matches, he does take control and play more aggressively BUT even during those matches, had you paid enough attention, you would still see that it is his ability to get the ball back that is a MAJOR part of his game... and in the Nadal match at the US Open, yes he hit winners but he was doing a LOT of defending the whole match through.

I'm not precious about people defending Murray... I just can't stand people who defend him to the point where they are literally talking him up, somewhat like you are, and making him out to be a better player than he is. If someone can put across a decent assessment of his chances in tournaments and especially Slams then I'll agree with them... however, I'm yet to see many people who I agree with because many do talk him up and make him out to be God's gift to tennis which is utter lunacy... and evidently I was right about this Slam and his chances so I must know something about what I'm saying!

And seriously... look back at other times when I've posted... I've been around and commented at times when he's been winning so don't spout utter cr*p like that... this time, I just didn't particularly want to talk tennis on here as there wasn't much to say... plus I had said everything I wanted to say before about his chances here... when he was winning... now that he's lost, there is something to talk about so here I am, voicing my opinion... maybe you don't agree or like my opinion but that is just the way it is... I don't like the opinions of people on here who rave about him.

[martyn]

As for players playing the same schedule... well yes they do... but do all of them make the semi's and final's every time as Federer and Nadal do pretty much every tournament? Erm... no. In which case, yes, I would say that they were pretty tired at the end of the year and weren't playing their best... certainly Nadal vs Murray at the US Open, Nadal was no where near his best. Be that a combination of Murray playing well, his fatigue or injury or whatever, a combination of factors lead to him not playing the same as he did at Wimbledon where he destroyed Murray. As for the Federer matches where he "dismantled" him, well yes, he was playing very very well but that was due to, as you say, Federer not playing his best and looking very poor indeed. When push comes to shove though, we've all seen what Federer can do to Murray on a hard court... US Open final...

I forgot that Murray's 2008 didnt involve semi's and finals too, my bad.

I forgot Murray's victory over Nadal at the US Open had something to do with fatigue but his defeat at Wimbledon after a 5 set match against Gasquet didn't.

I forgot that Murray has also shown what he can do to Federer on a hard court. (of course federer is the better player before getting accused here)

I forgot that Murray would be the worst Grand Slam winner, even worse than such tennis greats as Gaston Gaudio, Richard Krajicek.

I forgot that you predicted a 4th round Murray exit and thus must have superior knowledge to all and sundry, also forgetting that no doubt you predicted masters series success and a US Open final.

I'm still waiting to hear why people who think Murray can win a grand slam are speaking and I quote "utter drivel" when you yourself also quote it "not impossible" that Murray reach the US Open final this year.

I best stop now else I'll be accused of thinking Murray is god's gift, rather than simply a very good player with chances of winning a grand slam.

[Simi]

Martyn.

Some excellent points, well made.

[Father Ted]

Djokovic underrated? World no. 3 with only 1 Grand Slam victory to his name and he's underrated? There's more chance of Murray catching Nadal than Djokovic given recent results and performances!

Whatever Djokovic says, results speak louder than words. Murray's form is better than anyone else's going into the Australian Open so why shouldn't he be the bookies' favourite?

Federer is another one who's got the hump now that everyone's talking about Murray - you'd have thought he would have enough experience and be wise enough to just concentrate on his game.

When did I ever say Murray wasn't a moody Cvnt? If you took time to look around the forum, you'll see I'm not a great fan of Murray.

Djokovic threw his toys out of the pram because someone other than him is favourite to win the tournament. Again, if you read you'll see I don't think Murray will win a Grand Slam this year. I also never said Djokovic was over-rated either.

"In your face"

The big boys are getting annoyed that someone else is breaking through.

I don't think Murray will win it, or a grand slam this year, but he's earned the right to be favourite for this tournament, as he's the most in-form seeded player in tennis at the minute.

He'll win more Career titles than moody Djokvic will.

I think Murray will win it. He's shown up Nadal and Federer enough times to warrant it. Isn't this his preferred style of court.

Who looks like a twat now??

[Father Ted]

Murray had said before the match that he was less than 100% fit.

But given his form in recent tournaments, this defeat is still a real disappointment, and does nothing to dispel the fears that he may become a Tim Henman-style choker, unable to win one of the grand slam events.

Excuses excuses as usual for Murray. I bet he says he's British now. If he was ever to win a grand slam, he would without a doubt be Scottish.