Webbo Posted 26 January 2014 Posted 26 January 2014 I wouldn't lie to win an argument. I didn't say they were housed either, it could be that they were put in hostels and the other 2 didn't want to go into a hostel.
Zingari Posted 26 January 2014 Posted 26 January 2014 I wouldn't lie to win an argument. I didn't say they were housed either, it could be that they were put in hostels and the other 2 didn't want to go into a hostel. Yes i know what you're saying ,I'm not having a dig at you if they reported it in a way that implied , " there are only 2 people sleeping rough in the county and they don't want help" then it sounds like they were trying to create an impression that rough sleepers do it by choice . They really should have said that many others sleeping rough in the previous year had chosen to be housed due to the fine work of the social services and charities. It makes it sound like there isn't a real problem , when clearly there is. Maybe I'm not explaining it very well , but do you see what I mean ?
Webbo Posted 26 January 2014 Posted 26 January 2014 It might well have been a charity/council spokeswoman that they interviewed during the report. I thought about putting it on here at the time but couldn't be bothered to start another argument.
Zingari Posted 26 January 2014 Posted 26 January 2014 It might well have been a charity/council spokeswoman that they interviewed during the report. I thought about putting it on here at the time but couldn't be bothered to start another argument. you must be getting old
Rincewind Posted 26 January 2014 Author Posted 26 January 2014 you must be getting old There is also the NSNO that has been implemented so any rough sleepers would have been spotted and place in suitable as possible accommodation. Why did the two refuse? Were they male or female@ Did they have a dog with them and asked to go to a no dogs allowed place? I'm not having a go at anyone either or making excuses but just say two refused leaves a lot unclear. Well as far as I am concerned anyway. .
MooseBreath Posted 26 January 2014 Posted 26 January 2014 Sorry for being vague but I think they refused because they ####### the ###### #### #######.
Rincewind Posted 26 January 2014 Author Posted 26 January 2014 Did you know that sleeping in a doorway is not classified as homeless by some ouncils? Nor is if the person found is from another City. They are not then top priority for housing therefore not counted in the figures.
SOCCERROO FOX Posted 26 January 2014 Posted 26 January 2014 How do they compile the figures of homelessness? Do they send out a sensus to there home.....oh wait!
Rincewind Posted 26 January 2014 Author Posted 26 January 2014 Well I suppose the Government do it how the hell they want. Nobody will care if they are wrong or right.
Merging Cultures Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 Well I suppose the Government do it how the hell they want. Nobody will care if they are wrong or right. On the whole I think people do care. However, it's probably easier to care about people or families who are made homeless through no fault of their own. But it is harder to care about people who get there and stay there because of drug/alcohol abuse. I am often not clear on your definition of homeless. To me it is people who are sleeping rough. People who do not have their own house but are with family, friends or are in a temporary place are not homeless in my opinion. These are coping mechanisms that prevent them from sleeping rough. Anyway, this is longer than I expected. All that to say people do care on the whole, but you probably get stick on here due to the volume of posts about homeless people!!
Zingari Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 How do they compile the figures of homelessness? Do they send out a sensus to there home.....oh wait! Good question. Don't you think that the question itself gives a good indication as to who to believe when talking about the seriousness of the problem? Surely the charities and organisations that deal daily with all sorts of homelessness from sleeping in doorways to families houses with inadequate facilities are a more reliable reflection of the true situation than some cold unreliable gov figures ?
Webbo Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 Are charities that rely on govt/local govt funding and donations to pay their wages really impartial? Isn't it in their interest to talk up the problem?
Zingari Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 Are charities that rely on govt/local govt funding and donations to pay their wages really impartial? Isn't it in their interest to talk up the problem? Yes i'm sure there is an element of truth in that , but there is also the factor of governments talking and playing down the seriousness and scale of problems such as unemployment ,crime , homelessness etc i suppose we all have a tendency to believe the version that suits our predisposed mindset. Ken has often said that anyone is welcome to go along and see for themselves the problems of homelessness in Leic. so maybe we should all be more inclined to find out for ourselves. if i wasn't such a selfish lazy bugger that's what i'd do.
Merging Cultures Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 Yes i'm sure there is an element of truth in that , but there is also the factor of governments talking and playing down the seriousness and scale of problems such as unemployment ,crime , homelessness etc i suppose we all have a tendency to believe the version that suits our predisposed mindset. Ken has often said that anyone is welcome to go along and see for themselves the problems of homelessness in Leic. so maybe we should all be more inclined to find out for ourselves. if i wasn't such a selfish lazy bugger that's what i'd do. It has been many years since I lived in Leicester, but I used to go and do 'soup runs' with my Dad at The Salvation Army in Jarrom street. We'd make sandwiches and soup and take them into town for the homeless to eat. Not exactly 5* meals, so not encouraging the to be homeless. You wouldn't give up a warm safe bed to try my Dad's french onion soup even though it is quite delicious. Most of the regulars would know where we'd be and they'd come and get their soup and sandwich. Some of the less social would stay in their place of rest and we'd go and harass them about Jesus and force feed them ham and cheese on dry white bread. Sometimes, they wouldn't eat the food. They'd take it and then come back and complain! As I said, it wasn't 5* but I had definitely eaten a few of the sandwiches and several (7) soups and I knew it was good. But the fussy buggers wanted other sandwiches. Anyway, there weren't a loads of people living rough on the street. I remember 20 perhaps. But I am sure there were many more who were at risk of losing their homes or were staying with family and friends after being kicked out. So, I do think there is a role for the DNOs and Ken's of this world, and while there are probably not loads and loads of people living in the streets, there are people who are at risk of being homeless. We don't need a new homeless thread each day though.
Rincewind Posted 27 January 2014 Author Posted 27 January 2014 There are a;so many people too proud to ask for help when struggling with financial, depression or relationship problems until it is too late. A lot of funding has been cut. Leicester is lucky not to have so many. Derby have lost the majority of its services.
Zingari Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 It has been many years since I lived in Leicester, but I used to go and do 'soup runs' with my Dad at The Salvation Army in Jarrom street. We'd make sandwiches and soup and take them into town for the homeless to eat. Not exactly 5* meals, so not encouraging the to be homeless. You wouldn't give up a warm safe bed to try my Dad's french onion soup even though it is quite delicious. Most of the regulars would know where we'd be and they'd come and get their soup and sandwich. Some of the less social would stay in their place of rest and we'd go and harass them about Jesus and force feed them ham and cheese on dry white bread. Sometimes, they wouldn't eat the food. They'd take it and then come back and complain! As I said, it wasn't 5* but I had definitely eaten a few of the sandwiches and several (7) soups and I knew it was good. But the fussy buggers wanted other sandwiches. Anyway, there weren't a loads of people living rough on the street. I remember 20 perhaps. But I am sure there were many more who were at risk of losing their homes or were staying with family and friends after being kicked out. So, I do think there is a role for the DNOs and Ken's of this world, and while there are probably not loads and loads of people living in the streets, there are people who are at risk of being homeless. We don't need a new homeless thread each day though. i think we can agree on that , but sometimes when people absorb themselves into subjects they care passionately about, it's very hard to curb the enthusiasm of those involved . i don't really care how many threads are started on whatever subject and maybe the mods could merge a few of them . but i suppose that can be a time consuming affair for them too. i usually try to look for an existing relevant thread to post stuff in if possible . Good show to you and your dad for doing all that good work though Did you meet some interesting characters in your time as a sally army soup runner ? or were they mainly just a sad bunch of losers ?
Rincewind Posted 27 January 2014 Author Posted 27 January 2014 What year was this? Anyone remember the hot dog stall in Humbersone Gate/ My dad used to run that back in the 50's early 60's. I often used to be in the back oblivious to all the pissheads rolling out of the pubs.
Captain... Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 someone is not being honest http://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/Leicester-city-homelessness-figures-double/story-15232821-detail/story.html That is still a surprisingly small amount. The problem with taking the Utah approach is that firstly we don't actually arrest homeless people or beggars, I think it is still technically illegal, but either the police have been told not to waste their time or they are just really shit at their job, but I see plenty of homeless people and beggars and they are never being arrested and taken off the streets, so it isn't going to save any money. Cost of housing in the UK is prohibitively expensive, even the cheapest shittiest housing is going to be very costly, along with supporting and helping the homeless. Utah is in the US, if we do this in the UK you will be potentially encouraging European immigrants to come here, knowing that if they end up homeless they will be housed and looked after. I do think that we should do everything we can to help homeless people that want help, and are willing to work, but just handing out houses is not the answer. I would have thought there are charities which can provide a PO box style service for homeless people, so they can put an address down if they are looking for work, maybe have a shower and shave before they go seeking work, if not then there really should be.
Captain... Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 We don't need a new homeless thread each day though. Maybe Ken can do what OzLeicester did with his animal rights thread.
MooseBreath Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 Still nobody has explained the difference between the Utah approach and our housing benefit
Merging Cultures Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 i think we can agree on that , but sometimes when people absorb themselves into subjects they care passionately about, it's very hard to curb the enthusiasm of those involved . i don't really care how many threads are started on whatever subject and maybe the mods could merge a few of them . but i suppose that can be a time consuming affair for them too. i usually try to look for an existing relevant thread to post stuff in if possible . Good show to you and your dad for doing all that good work though Did you meet some interesting characters in your time as a sally army soup runner ? or were they mainly just a sad bunch of losers ? To be honest, it was so long ago I don't really member any of the people. What I do remember was always feeling so scared. Some would be drunk/high or just plain off their rocker, screaming and shouting etc. My Dad did it for years, but now he lives in South Yorkshire. I don't think he does it up at 'The Army' there. All the threads seem to get hijacked on racism or homelessness. I know these are very important relevant issues, but it seems that they become the focus. Mack's thread for instance got hijacked. I just need to be more selective and not take the bait and not join-in!
Zingari Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 To be honest, it was so long ago I don't really member any of the people. What I do remember was always feeling so scared. Some would be drunk/high or just plain off their rocker, screaming and shouting etc. My Dad did it for years, but now he lives in South Yorkshire. I don't think he does it up at 'The Army' there. All the threads seem to get hijacked on racism or homelessness. I know these are very important relevant issues, but it seems that they become the focus. Mack's thread for instance got hijacked. I just need to be more selective and not take the bait and not join-in! i've never been tempted to join the Sallies , but I've met quite a few and i can honestly say that every one of them has been a really nice person and always keen to help out.
Merging Cultures Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 i've never been tempted to join the Sallies , but I've met quite a few and i can honestly say that every one of them has been a really nice person and always keen to help out Where did you meet them? I probably know them.
Webbo Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 My grandma lived on Grassmere Street bang opposite the Sally Army. If we stopped there at the weekend we'd be woken up by the band on Sunday mornings.
Merging Cultures Posted 27 January 2014 Posted 27 January 2014 My grandma lived on Grassmere Street bang opposite the Sally Army. If we stopped there at the weekend we'd be woken up by the band on Sunday mornings. I basically grew up at that one. Played in the band too! They've moved to south Wigston but have kept the Jarrom street facility as a day center for the elderly and for other services. But the band moved on a few years ago.
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