murphy

I don't see the logic here. As I was saying to Rita Ora over breakfast, I've been here many years too and I make shit up all the time.

I have to admit that I was excited by the appointment too. I thought that one of the established journeyman managers on the circuit were not going to make the difference, so why not take a punt on an exciting up and coming manager with a stellar playing career and an impressive nascent coaching record. It could have gone two ways. Unfortunately for us it went south and I've never seen a more tepid and moribund character in a dugout.

I think that Puel was a good manager for us and it would be very harsh to put him among the McLintocks, Coopers and Taylors. It is worth remembering that Puel followed after we had nearly been relegated. He came in and made us a solid team. He also oversaw a transition into becoming a possession based team so you might expect teething problems but he did it really quite seamlessly. Add to that some stellar recruitment (Ricardo, Tielemans) and the development of Harvey Barnes and I would say that he laid the foundations for our future success. Rodgers certainly benefitted from the hard yards that Puel put in.

Taylor was backed with much greater funds than O'Neill. He just wasted it on utter toss. He had a great opportunity to build upon O'Neill's foundations yet he blew it so badly, with signings so obviously unfit for purpose, that it might have been mistaken for an act of deliberate industrial sabotage.

I think we need to learn from past mistakes. That means that we stop offering huge, inflated contracts to journeymen for a start. We should also return to the pre-Rodgers recruitment model that sets out to unearth gems rather than known quantities and plodders like Ayew. Identify hungry young players with high ceilings on the way up. Players with resale value and extend our scouting network globally rather than relying on agency recommendations. Continue to develop youth, we have the set up and this seems to be the one area of the club that has remained successful. New DoF. We have continue to make the same mistakes over and over. I don't think we can change unless we change our personnel. The infamous internal review was an embarrassment and changed nothing. Finally, I don't think we can afford to build gradually as op suggests. The gap will simply widen and we will drift. I am beginning to think that the way to bridge the gap is that a promoted team should simply bank the money, don't waste it trying too compete. Expect relegation then take a second bite at the cherry. Getting promoted a second time with previously banked funds, might allow a decent enough war chest to compete.

Have we established that we haven't actually ever had any bids for Wout Garfunkel then?

So who has bid and how much was offered? Genuine question, I must have missed this.

Nelson is proven at this level and has a much higher ceiling than any of our other cbs. The only way to get him there is to play him. It is likely the only way we keep him too.

What's this? Faes has had bids and we have turned them down?

And why has no other club been in for him? He has wanted to leave since 2023. So, @Clogger_, was that username chosen in tribute to your man Wout?

Our first goalkeeper!

Of course there is. Man City currently lie 13th. They may deserve to be there but that is not the same thing as saying that they are in a false position. They are in a false position because, despite the fact that they might not be the force that they were, they have enough quality that it is extremely unlikely that they will stay there over the course of a season and if you don't believe that I will happily have a cheeky tenner with you. Aren't you contradicting yourself here? Saying that Wolves improved their ppg only by changing their manager in one breath then saying that it is a 'weak argument' that we could expect the same ppg by keeping Cooper. Personally, I think that by keeping Cooper our ppg would have declined as the effect of weekly beatings was accumulative and we looked a beaten team before we kicked off. The that idea that our ppg would not improve goes back to the original idea of clubs (Wolves and Palace) being in false positions, which you reject, but I say was born out by the final standings, but we shall agree to differ here. We really were that bad. They weren't as they went on to prove.

I have to take issue with this oft-repeated line defending Cooper. We were outside the relegation zone, not because of anything Cooper did, but because Crystal Palace and Wolves were in false positions and had gotten off to disastrous starts. They went on to recover to 53 points (12th) and 42 points (16th) respectively. We were nowhere near that. Had we continued at Cooper's 0.8pts per game-ish we might have scraped 30 points or so. I don't think that Cooper unseats Taylor as the anti-goat but he deserves to be in the conversation. He snuffed out any glimmer of a chance we might have had before a ball was kicked blowing the budget on his fetish for experienced journeyman plodders.

Agreed. Cooper set us up to fail.

And we don't yet know the full extent of the damage caused by that wholly avoidable 2023 relegation as we are still living through it.

Wasn't it Mark bright? ,I seem to remember first game of the season after selling Lineker, he was back with his Everton side . We won 3-1, Bright scored two and never did much again for us.

Worst manager in my lifetime is Peter Taylor for spending fortunes, relative to his predecessor, to turn a silk purse into a sow's ear. Baffling signings, one after another and has now found his level plying his trade at Canvey Island. His legacy was administration and a lost decade. Least likeable manager, Brendan Rodgers for shamefully going through the motions when he didn't get his way. You must have a very special talent to win the first FA Cup in our history whilst also being almost universally reviled by the fanbase.

Trouble is, Rodgers suggested (demanded?) the recruitment team. Lee The Legend Congerton.

How did Southampton get £120+ million for players that scraped 12 points in a whole season? Witchcraft!

It's not net revenue it's gross isn't it? It's not taking into account any fees paid for those players.

I detect a slight note of disbelief...

Stop moaning

He has a 100m personal best of 10.5 seconds. He was pretty quick.

Yet you haven't quoted any. Expressing disappointment is not the same as not giving a chance. Of course he will be given a chance, we have no choice. It doesn't matter how many times you say a balanced view is OK, or whatever, (very gracious of you, thanks), that is irrelevant. In case you have forgotten, we are talking about a third party who has had the sense not to get involved in this and his position, which you defended, that the criticism of this signing was writing him off before he had kicked a ball for us, as if that were relevant.

You were defending OPs comment which was basically implying any criticism was writing him off before he'd kicked a ball for us etc etc As it stands we don't have the luxury of being able to judge how good or bad he is in our team, we can only say whether we think that it's a good signing or not. Some do, some don't and there's nothing wrong with that. I don't remember reading anybody writing him off or saying he's shit.