Fez of Mahrez Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 We have a lot of good centre backs and three decent central midfielders but no good wingers. Our play never really goes down the wings anyway, the only time we play down the flanks is when Fryatt and Hume go out there. Anyone argue against that? 3-5-2 is the way forward, discuss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Hero Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 I agree with everything you've said but would stress that to play this system you really do need two very fit full backs who are mobile and comfortable on the ball and read the game well enough to be in the right place most of the time. I think Stearman could be moulded and Maybury could certainly do it so on the right we might be okay... but down the left, Johannson, Tiatto and Sheehan? Perhaps. I just don't think RK will go down that route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 i agree with the squad we have now i believe this to be the best team -------------------Henderson------------------- -------Kisnorbo---McCarthy---Johnasson---- Stearman----------------------------Sheehan --------Hughes-Wesolowski-Williams-------- ----------------Hume-------Fryatt------------- right bring on the slating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 5 June 2006 Author Share Posted 5 June 2006 I agree with everything you've said but would stress that to play this system you really do need two very fit full backs who are mobile and comfortable on the ball and read the game well enough to be in the right place most of the time. I think Stearman could be moulded and Maybury could certainly do it so on the right we might be okay... but down the left, Johannson, Tiatto and Sheehan? Perhaps. I just don't think RK will go down that route. Oh yeah, we would need to buy a left wing-back. I did forget to include that, well spotted. I hope RK gives it a go. McCarthy and possibly McAuley strike me as defenders who would thrive in a 3-5-2 as they'd benefit both from the extra cover at the back and the extra man in central midfield. Or maybe I'm just a child of the O'Neill years when 3-5-2 helped make Taggart, Elliott, Walsh, Prior etc look like top-class Premiership defenders and I think 4-4-2 would have exposed their lack of pace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Hero Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 i agree with the squad we have now i believe this to be the best team -------------------Henderson------------------- -------Kisnorbo---McCarthy---Johnasson---- Stearman----------------------------Sheehan --------Hughes-Wesolowski-Williams-------- ----------------Hume-------Fryatt------------- right bring on the slating I won't slate it, I just think it's bold. When we're playing teams who sit back it should enable us to commit more forwards to. You can't draw too many in this division. We've got to have goal threats all over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan_84 Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 iv got a horrible feeling kisnobo would play in front of the back 3 if we played 3-5-2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gist Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 I think we should stick to 4-4-2 and get two new wingers, if that is not possible then a 3-5-2 wouldn't be a bad option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mort Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 i agree with the squad we have now i believe this to be the best team -------------------Henderson------------------- -------Kisnorbo---McCarthy---Johnasson---- Stearman----------------------------Sheehan --------Hughes-Wesolowski-Williams-------- ----------------Hume-------Fryatt------------- right bring on the slating As things stand I'd agree, i just think we need a solid anchor in CM... we also need to adress the left which is very weak IMHO... hmmm, could we give Porter a go? I also agree that Sheehan might do well, still as i say the MD worries me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Hero Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 Sheehan as a wing back might be asking a bit much at this stage I think. Worth a go, but to be honest, in a 3-5-2, it's the left wing back position which causes me a bit of concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman of the Bored Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 What if some brilliant tactician at the World Cup invented a brand new formation that no one has ever played before? Perhaps the world is about to change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Hero Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 One which doesn't require any left sided players of a defensive midfielder would be ideal for us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveyboy Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 i think this 3-5-2 system could work very well, but as people are saying we need to sort out the left side, both definsive and offensive. this is the case for either 4-4-2 and 3-5-2 in my opinion becuase i dont really see Sheehan coming through yet then theres Hammill and Tiatto who... well... are not the cream of the crop! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparky Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 in a 3-5-2 system a key aspect of the formation is the defensive midfield role. the defensive midfielder has several vital jobs in that position , he would need to cover for either wing back if they went forward as well as his job of giving protection to the 3 centre backs . weso strikes me as the man for the job the wingbacks would need good engines wich stearman has and sheehan seems fit enough for the role and looks fairly good going forward , the only question mark against sheehan for me would be weather he has the positional sence for the role but if he dont get the chance then how we gonna know . i still think we lack goals in the side other than the front 2 , hughes and williams or any new midfield signing really need to be hitting 15 goals between them if we are gonna push for the play offs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultra Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 3-5-2 may well be the best formation for the squad we now have. However I'd put Maybury as the right wing-back ahead of Stearman at the moment. Maybury is more mobile and offers more attacking options. I'm not convinced about any of the options on the left side, though. I remember from last year how Sheehan was predicted to be the figure who would turn our season around. When that proved not to be the case, he was set back months, and hasn't yet fully recovered. There's no sense in rushing him again unless RK can be sure he's ready. Maybe we should wait and see who else comes into the club before opening day on August 5th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daggers Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 A scientific appraisal of the various systems looks at the available passes that can be completed, or 40 metres or less. This gives: 5-3-2 ~ 48 passes available 4-2-4 ~ 54 passes available 4-3-3 ~ 56 passes available 4-5-1 ~ 62 passes available 4-4-2 ~ 66 passes available So, this gives us a rule of thumb for possession ~ but scoring can be related to where we obtain possession. It has been shown that: 13% of possession is gained in the attacking third, leading to 66% of goals scored 46% of possession is gained in the middle third, leading to 26% of goals scored 41% of possession is gained in the final third, leading to 8% of goals scored Consequently, a team that can hold its possession in the final third and gain possession in the attacking third is best placed to win. Guess who got a new book for the summer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Hero Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 3-5-2 may well be the best formation for the squad we now have. However I'd put Maybury as the right wing-back ahead of Stearman at the moment. Maybury is more mobile and offers more attacking options. I'm not convinced about any of the options on the left side, though. I remember from last year how Sheehan was predicted to be the figure who would turn our season around. When that proved not to be the case, he was set back months, and hasn't yet fully recovered. There's no sense in rushing him again unless RK can be sure he's ready. Maybe we should wait and see who else comes into the club before opening day on August 5th. Spot on. To play 3-5-2 we need at least one more (probably defensive minded) midfielder and someone to play that left wing-back role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nationwider Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 Spot on. To play 3-5-2 we need at least one more (probably defensive minded) midfielder and someone to play that left wing-back role. R.Kelly should sell his Granny to get Jamie Clapham in to fill the LWB role. I'm in on the 3-5-2 campaign. Attritional, yet successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Hero Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 Rob Kelly really does strike me as a 4-4-2 man. Having said that, last year he was working with Levein's team I suppose and it's more conceivable (clutching at straws) that he'd change things formation and system wise between seasons when he's got time to work on things for prolonged periods and assemble his set of players to play it than during a season when attempting to achieve survival with someone elses' players. One thing I'd say about a 3-5-2. When played well, it's flowing, versatile and facilitates getting numbers forwards and back whilst maintaining both width and still having numbers in the middle. When played badly - it's often catastrophic. Particularly when the wing backs aren't up to it and either get caught out positionally leaving the centre back exposed or just not getting forwards enough meaning no width in the forward third. We really would have to get the wing backs right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 i'm only in favour of 3-5-2 if we cannot get 1 of maybe 2 decent wingers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l444ry Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 Surely it's ludicrous to think that a change of systems will suddenly make average players into world beaters. The only reason that system worked for us is because the genius Martin O'Neill used it. I can't think of any other worthwhile examples of it being successful anywhere. No top International countries employ it or any successful Premier League side. It's players that win games not systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daggers Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 It's players that win games not systems. Yup - but a poorly chosen system can prevent players from doing that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l444ry Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 Yup - but a poorly chosen system can prevent players from doing that Or poor players in the right system...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted 5 June 2006 Share Posted 5 June 2006 Surely it's ludicrous to think that a change of systems will suddenly make average players into world beaters. The only reason that system worked for us is because the genius Martin O'Neill used it. I can't think of any other worthwhile examples of it being successful anywhere. No top International countries employ it or any successful Premier League side. It's players that win games not systems. brazil use wing backs, current world champions, does that ring any bells? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 6 June 2006 Author Share Posted 6 June 2006 I certainly don't think 3-5-2 would suddenly turn us into world-beaters but I think the players we have suit the system more (i.e. five good centre-backs and no good wingers). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daggers Posted 6 June 2006 Share Posted 6 June 2006 I certainly don't think 3-5-2 would suddenly turn us into world-beaters but I think the players we have suit the system more (i.e. five good centre-backs and no good wingers). Sometimes I wish everyone could revert to the good old fashion 2-3-5 - that was great to layout on the subbuteo turf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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