UK on Terror Alert

[breadandcheese]

... and you would dishonour the very things he and others were fighting for, Freedom, Truth, Democracy, Fairness and Tolerance.

How exactly? By fighting islamo-facism? I am quite sure Steven that your grandfather wouldn't take you aside to say, "Steven, my boy, I fought facism so there could be bombs in London. That is freedom."

Not unless your grandfather is Sheikh Omar Bakri or something.

[Janx]

How exactly? By fighting islamo-facism? I am quite sure Steven that your grandfather wouldn't take you aside to say, "Steven, my boy, I fought facism so there could be bombs in London. That is freedom."

Not unless your grandfather is Sheikh Omar Bakri or something.

hoo fecking ray!!!!

[Daggers]

So he's so stupid he can't translate Polica to Police then?

You can say they shouldnt of shot him all you want he ran away and jumped a turnstyle with a rather big ruck sake, if he hadn't of been shot there you'd have to question security.

In Brasil:

1. The police are not to be trusted

2. Someone points a gun at you - run, hide or shoot them first.

He did not have a rucksack, the claim was retracted as bogus.

He did not vault the ticket barrier, he calmly entered his ticket into the machine like all commuters. The retraction of the claim he vaulted them was published in all newspapers and appeared on national TV.

His hand did not move inside his jacket. They got the colour of his jacket wrong. He had no suspicious lumps in his jacket.

All of the original police claims have been retracted and apologised for, they were all false.

[Steven]

twat! you think?

BIG RULES: Things deemed to be totally unacceptable:

* Overt personal abuse of other posters (unless it’s in jest of course!)

<_<

[Janx]

BIG RULES: Things deemed to be totally unacceptable:

* Overt personal abuse of other posters (unless it’s in jest of course!)

<_<

Dont pull that card.... hiding behind rules is another thing that people in this country do far tooo much of...thats why people who go twoccing and killing people in cars get community service because the "rules" allow it.

see I jest!

[Daggers]

It is one of the big rules...

[Daggers]

He would read Razzle. Literally. Assuming it does have words in it. It does have words in it, doesn't it?

I would have absolutely no idea at all...but I bet Master Fox does.

[Janx]

It is one of the big rules...

OK OK hes not a twat... hes just a very silly liberal type.... I will say no more!

[Steven]

How exactly? By fighting islamo-facism? I am quite sure Steven that your grandfather wouldn't take you aside to say, "Steven, my boy, I fought facism so there could be bombs in London. That is freedom."

Not unless your grandfather is Sheikh Omar Bakri or something.

This is not the Crusades in reverse. There is a bigger picture whereby we are encouraged to give up Freedom, Truth, Democracy, Fairness and Tolerance so that the Government can encourage Terrorism by supporting the US and Israel. Nobody is looking to bomb Finland. Ask yourself why?

[Dr The Singh]

This is not the Crusades in reverse. There is a bigger picture whereby we are encouraged to give up Freedom, Truth, Democracy, Fairness and Tolerance so that the Government can encourage Terrorism by supporting the US and Israel. Nobody is looking to bomb Finland. Ask yourself why?

I can understand alot of muslims grief towards the government but to kill innocent people, especailly those that are your countrymen.......................there is definitely something wrong with the mindset of these people and nothing that this country has done justifies such actions and those that do attempt to harm the people or aid the those in such a barbaric actions, have no right to live here!!!!

[Daggers]

Sod the fudging Terror Alert, Master Fox is back!!!

[Steven]

I can understand alot of muslims grief towards the government but to kill innocent people, especailly those that are your countrymen.......................there is definitely something wrong with the mindset of these people and nothing that this country has done justifies such actions and those that do attempt to harm the people or aid the those in such a barbaric actions, have no right to live here!!!!

You and I can rationalise it that way but I wonder how a Southern Lebanese person feels towards the UK when they read that US planes with weapons are being refuelled in the UK, say when a family member has just been killed by Israelis.

To my way of thinking anyone has the right to fight against injustice in the Gandhi or Nelson Mandela mode as well as the style of the French Resistence.

[Ultra]

To the Singh

But don't you acknowledge the possibility that the government might possibly have something to gain by making any potential threat seem a lot larger than it actually is?

[Steven]

But don't you acknowledge the possibility that the government might possibly have something to gain by making any potential threat seem a lot larger than it actually is?

This underpins the whole "War on Terror". <_<

[Ultra]

Exactly.

Which is why 9/11, the exact causes of which remain unclear, has been exploited to the max by George W and his cronies.

A whole set of draconian laws exist in the States which could never have bee passed before 9/11.

[Dr The Singh]

To the Singh

But don't you acknowledge the possibility that the government might possibly have something to gain by making any potential threat seem a lot larger than it actually is?

I do, and I do understand the implications and timings of terrorist threats to aid a political event or aganda but i don't want that to gloss over the fact that there is a terrorist threat eg july bombings and if there is 1% chance of a terror event happening, i'm all for the spots chacks , delayed plane journeys and arrests. I would not put a price or value or severity on any life, so if it is a minor scare, exaggerated by the government, then so be it!!

[breadandcheese]

This is not the Crusades in reverse. There is a bigger picture whereby we are encouraged to give up Freedom, Truth, Democracy, Fairness and Tolerance so that the Government can encourage Terrorism by supporting the US and Israel. Nobody is looking to bomb Finland. Ask yourself why?

No, I would argue Islamo-facism looks back to the glory days of the Islamic Empire stretching from Persia to Spain. To cower in the face of an evil ideology will simply empower extremists of this variety.

I find it incredible your belief that our government is looking to "encourage terrorism" just so they can support the US and Israel. I work on the belief that people are rational and work for their own self benefit and utility. Supposing your belief has the slightest bit of credibility, our leaders would be looking to gain from this. So what would they be gaining by your belief of this so-called "bigger picture"? What is this so-called "bigger picture"?

To use your silly world war II anology, Modern day Finland can be compared to a 1930s Switzerland. I cannot remember Germany looking to bomb Switzerland. I cannot remember Switzerland looking back at world war II as their finest moment.

[Dr The Singh]

You and I can rationalise it that way but I wonder how a Southern Lebanese person feels towards the UK when they read that US planes with weapons are being refuelled in the UK, say when a family member has just been killed by Israelis.

To my way of thinking anyone has the right to fight against injustice in the Gandhi or Nelson Mandela mode as well as the style of the French Resistence.

What!!!! Actions cause a reaction!!!!! I don't want to go over the Israel\Lebannon thing, but it was Hizbollah that initiated this cause of events, which in fair Israel excagorated to an extent that we all are disgusted. To be fair the Lebonese should look at themselves first, for one allowing Hizbollah to be settled in there territory and look at those who fund and use Lebannon as 'war by proxy' ie Syria and Iran. Britian has been a pawn in this, and politically Britian has always had US planes refuel in UK, although we agree is wrong.

But going back to mindset of people, if only if one is taught\believe that killing of women and children and innocents is permitted one would do so, in the case of Israel they believe it is justified to bomb hizbollah even in areas where there are civilians, but having said that they did issue warnings. Hizbollah on the other hand purposely remain within women and children, as a shield. The issue is complicated. But we have an issue now in Britian where our own want to kill civilians even though the civilians have supported the anti war brigade and TBH, in war there are always casualties of war and in general British soldiers have always played fair and tried to aviod civilian casualties!!!

[breadandcheese]

Exactly.

Which is why 9/11, the exact causes of which remain unclear, has been exploited to the max by George W and his cronies.

A whole set of draconian laws exist in the States which could never have bee passed before 9/11.

Whom and in what way have they benefitted from these draconian laws?

[Ultra]

I find it incredible your belief that our government is looking to "encourage terrorism" just so they can support the US and Israel. I work on the belief that people are rational and work for their own self benefit and utility. Supposing your belief has the slightest bit of credibility, our leaders would be looking to gain from this. So what would they be gaining by your belief of this so-called "bigger picture"? What is this so-called "bigger picture"?

The bigger picture would be the continuation of US predominance in the "new world order", in which any threat, real or imaginary, is eliminated.

Hence the overthrow of Saddam and the Taliban. Hence also the continued supply of aid and arms to Israel to undermine and attack other democratic governments in the region.

But as long as Arab public opinion remains overwhelmingly hostile, the project is doomed.

Hence the attempt to enhance the terrorist threat and thus fuel Islamophobia even further.

[golden gordon]

The bigger picture would be the continuation of US predominance in the "new world order", in which any threat, real or imaginary, is eliminated.

Hence the overthrow of Saddam and the Taliban. Hence also the continued supply of aid and arms to Israel to undermine and attack other democratic governments in the region.

But as long as Arab public opinion remains overwhelmingly hostile, the project is doomed.

Hence the attempt to enhance the terrorist threat and thus fuel Islamophobia even further.

islamic zealots are doing a good enough job of fuelling islamophopia themselves without the help of bush

[Ultra]

Quite possibly, but the role of Jewish and Christian zealots shouldn't be forgotten either..

Both have been responsible for far more deaths during the past decade than Al-Qaida..

[Dr The Singh]

Quite possibly, but the role of Jewish and Christian zealots shouldn't be forgotten either..

Both have been responsible for far more deaths during the past decade than Al-Qaida..

Yes that maybe the case, but it should not make it 'condonable' or easier to stomach!!!

[breadandcheese]

The bigger picture would be the continuation of US predominance in the "new world order", in which any threat, real or imaginary, is eliminated.

Hence the overthrow of Saddam and the Taliban. Hence also the continued supply of aid and arms to Israel to undermine and attack other democratic governments in the region.

But as long as Arab public opinion remains overwhelmingly hostile, the project is doomed.

Hence the attempt to enhance the terrorist threat and thus fuel Islamophobia even further.

So the bigger picture is US hegemony. I do not doubt that in the same way all major world powers seek to maintain economic power (America, Russia, EU, China) and new powers seek to achieve it (Brazil, India, Iran).

American hegemony is doomed because of Arab public opinion, so rather than ignoring them and looking to increase their economic base through trade with regions such as Africa (like China are currently doing), the Americans choose to enhance terror threats.

Your bigger picture is slightly different to mine. In my bigger picture, I see the rise of Islamo-facism, a political ideology with an extremist interpretation of Islam at its base. They are looking to resurrect the Islamic empire of old, an Islamic theocracy.

They perpetrate terrorist attacks everywhere against their enemy, both infidels and Muslims who disagree with their Islamo-facist beliefs. They commit murders on those who seek to live a little free in Middle Eastern countries. Large scale terrorist attacks by groups in places like Egypt and Jordan, Yemen, in Saudi Arabia, in Iraq & Afghanistan. Oppresion of those dressing incorrectly, not saying the right things.

[Dr The Singh]

So the bigger picture is US hegemony. I do not doubt that in the same way all major world powers seek to maintain economic power (America, Russia, EU, China) and new powers seek to achieve it (Brazil, India, Iran).

American hegemony is doomed because of Arab public opinion, so rather than ignoring them and looking to increase their economic base through trade with regions such as Africa (like China are currently doing), the Americans choose to enhance terror threats.

Your bigger picture is slightly different to mine. In my bigger picture, I see the rise of Islamo-facism, a political ideology with an extremist interpretation of Islam at its base. They are looking to resurrect the Islamic empire of old, an Islamic theocracy.

They perpetrate terrorist attacks everywhere against their enemy, both infidels and Muslims who disagree with their Islamo-facist beliefs. They commit murders on those who seek to live a little free in Middle Eastern countries. Large scale terrorist attacks by groups in places like Egypt and Jordan, Yemen, in Saudi Arabia, in Iraq & Afghanistan. Oppresion of those dressing incorrectly, not saying the right things.

Great point BreadandCheese!!!