UK on Terror Alert

[Ultra]

So the bigger picture is US hegemony. I do not doubt that in the same way all major world powers seek to maintain economic power (America, Russia, EU, China) and new powers seek to achieve it (Brazil, India, Iran).

American hegemony is doomed because of Arab public opinion, so rather than ignoring them and looking to increase their economic base through trade with regions such as Africa (like China are currently doing), the Americans choose to enhance terror threats.

Your bigger picture is slightly different to mine. In my bigger picture, I see the rise of Islamo-facism, a political ideology with an extremist interpretation of Islam at its base. They are looking to resurrect the Islamic empire of old, an Islamic theocracy.

They perpetrate terrorist attacks everywhere against their enemy, both infidels and Muslims who disagree with their Islamo-facist beliefs. They commit murders on those who seek to live a little free in Middle Eastern countries. Large scale terrorist attacks by groups in places like Egypt and Jordan, Yemen, in Saudi Arabia, in Iraq & Afghanistan. Oppresion of those dressing incorrectly, not saying the right things.

But "Islamo-fascism" has a lot smaller base than either its followers or the US government would like us to believe.

Bin Laden does NOT represent all Muslims and it's wrong and dangerous to assume that he does.

[Daggers]

Explain to me someone, please, how the fudge a smaller bag is intrinsically safer than the old size of hand luggage?

All smacks of smoke and mirrors to me...

[l444ry]

Explain to me someone, please, how the fudge a smaller bag is intrinsically safer than the old size of hand luggage?

All smacks of smoke and mirrors to me...

So that's what the London bombings were then.....a figment of our imagination.

[Daggers]

So that's what the London bombings were then.....a figment of our imagination.

Try highlighting the entire post - and then reading the bit you previously failed to put in bold

(I am referring to the new hand luggage restrictions on international flights!)

[Steven]

So that's what the London bombings were then.....a figment of our imagination.

A hideous reality, however there is no context for these killings. Why are they not placed in the same context as other deaths in the UK which the Government could prevent.

[l444ry]

Try highlighting the entire post - and then reading the bit you previously failed to put in bold

(I am referring to the new hand luggage restrictions on international flights!)

I'm sure you are but drastic actions require drastic remedies. Can't see what the problem is myself!!!

[l444ry]

A hideous reality, however there is no context for these killings. Why are they not placed in the same context as other deaths in the UK which the Government could prevent.

Surely you've just highlighted the problem-: The London bombings couldn't be prevented. But just because the authorities are trying to prevent another carnage doesn't mean they shouldn't try. Just for the record, what other deaths in the UK do you mean which are comparable to mass murder?

[Daggers]

I'm sure you are but drastic actions require drastic remedies. Can't see what the problem is myself!!!

??????????????????????????

Drastic actions and remedies? Let's walk away from hyperbole for a minute.

Exactly HOW does reducing the size of some carry on luggage produce a remedy? I asked for someone cleverer than me to explain it...I'm still waiting. I fail to understand how losing a few inches makes airline travel any safer at all.

It saves airline companies money. It diverts media attention from other issues. Err, I think that's it.

[Steven]

Surely you've just highlighted the problem-: The London bombings couldn't be prevented. But just because the authorities are trying to prevent another carnage doesn't mean they shouldn't try. Just for the record, what other deaths in the UK do you mean which are comparable to mass murder?

Then in my eyes deaths they can prevent should get at least if not more effort than those deaths they cannot. Unless that is of course the Government is deciding that one means of unpreventable death is more important than preventing other deaths. If that is the case then we have a Government and a society whose moral compass is severely malfunctioning. <_<

[Dr The Singh]

But "Islamo-fascism" has a lot smaller base than either its followers or the US government would like us to believe.

Bin Laden does NOT represent all Muslims and it's wrong and dangerous to assume that he does.

I disagree 'Islamo-fascism' in my experience is quite considerable (a %), in the effect that all followers of extremism are not operative ie suicide bombers but are supperters either by donations or underground and then there are those that support the cause ie wanting an Islamic state\Law implemented but disagree in there methods.

There are many grey areas, one must understand Islam and understand the thinking behind 'Islamo-facism'. At this moment the operatives are very small, but the constant manipulation and conversion of good moderate muslims is a fear. Although majority of muslims are good british people, were are reliant on these people to help root out those that are extreme, which is a big ask!!

[l444ry]

I disagree 'Islamo-fascism' in my experience is quite considerable (a %), in the effect that all followers of extremism are not operative ie suicide bombers but are supperters either by donations or underground and then there are those that support the cause ie wanting an Islamic state\Law implemented but disagree in there methods.

There are many grey areas, one must understand Islam and understand the thinking behind 'Islamo-facism'. At this moment the operatives are very small, but the constant manipulation and conversion of good moderate muslims is a fear. Although majority of muslims are good british people, were are reliant on these people to help root out those that are extreme, which is a big ask!!

Especially as, it would seem to me, that much of the Islamic way of life is incompatible with life in the western world.

[Dr The Singh]

Especially as, it would seem to me, that much of the Islamic way of life is incompatible with life in the western world.

It is a choice for muslims, do they accept an authority higher then the Quran (british constitution\laws etc), or is the Quran the highest authority!!! Obviously this is a blanket statement, majority muslim want to live within British society and still be deemed 'good muslims', as soon as muslims become more 'extreme', the Quran becomes the highest political authority and western ideals are rejected. Then there are the grey areas within those ideals. And this is a tool which is used by extremist to radicalise\extreme moderates!!

[breadandcheese]

It is a choice for muslims, do they accept an authority higher then the Quran (british constitution\laws etc), or is the Quran the highest authority!!! Obviously this is a blanket statement, majority muslim want to live within British society and still be deemed 'good muslims', as soon as muslims become more 'extreme', the Quran becomes the highest political authority and western ideals are rejected. Then there are the grey areas within those ideals. And this is a tool which is used by extremist to radicalise\extreme moderates!!

I'm not sure I agree with that. I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. Religion for most people is a private domain. It is when these Islamo-facists try to push it into the public domain, that problems arise.

For most, religion is a belief in God, such that he will decide and guide. He/she has a plan and we all go with it. When those elements attempt to take religion into the public domain, it is usually fuelled by a belief that if people start to adher to certain actions, then God will act. Almost a belief in being the orchestrator of the plan, rather than God.

Take for example a conversation I had with a barber in town (a new place to cut my hair). He, a moderate muslim who drunk alcohol, had threesomes (he was quite an open barber in what he told me), started talking about politics. I informed him that I had some Jewish blood somewhere down the family tree. His response was, "You shouldn't have told me that, I'm a Muslim." For the rest of the haircut, he told me how when the end of days comes, the Muslims will slaughter the Jews and infidels, even trees will uproot themselves to stop anyone hiding behind them."

My view on this is simple. I think this guy a nutter, but he can have his private beliefs. Those are his private religious beliefs. It is when he attempts to force them into the public domain, preaching to others or making this happen, that is when the worry occurs in my eyes.

After he told me his views, I said to him, maybe that will happen in the end of days, but it is for God to decide when that is, not me, him or any of the other terrorists who believe it around the corner and believe they can start this final end of days battle. The problem comes when those who misinterpret, try to affect change, rather than let the God who they have so much belief in, guide and decide.

For this, no amount of foreign policy or happy clappy embracing hugs can do anything. It is up to those teachers in the Islamic world who hold sway, to say, leave it for God to decide, do not try to instigate.

[Dr The Singh]

I'm not sure I agree with that. I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. Religion for most people is a private domain. It is when these Islamo-facists try to push it into the public domain, that problems arise.

For most, religion is a belief in God, such that he will decide and guide. He/she has a plan and we all go with it. When those elements attempt to take religion into the public domain, it is usually fuelled by a belief that if people start to adher to certain actions, then God will act. Almost a belief in being the orchestrator of the plan, rather than God.

Take for example a conversation I had with a barber in town (a new place to cut my hair). He, a moderate muslim who drunk alcohol, had threesomes (he was quite an open barber in what he told me), started talking about politics. I informed him that I had some Jewish blood somewhere down the family tree. His response was, "You shouldn't have told me that, I'm a Muslim." For the rest of the haircut, he told me how when the end of days comes, the Muslims will slaughter the Jews and infidels, even trees will uproot themselves to stop anyone hiding behind them."

My view on this is simple. I think this guy a nutter, but he can have his private beliefs. Those are his private religious beliefs. It is when he attempts to force them into the public domain, preaching to others or making this happen, that is when the worry occurs in my eyes.

After he told me his views, I said to him, maybe that will happen in the end of days, but it is for God to decide when that is, not me, him or any of the other terrorists who believe it around the corner and believe they can start this final end of days battle. The problem comes when those who misinterpret, try to affect change, rather than let the God who they have so much belief in, guide and decide.

For this, no amount of foreign policy or happy clappy embracing hugs can do anything. It is up to those teachers in the Islamic world who hold sway, to say, leave it for God to decide, do not try to instigate.

Islam interms of the Quran is more then just religious\spiritual guidance there is also a political system and a way of life, obviously one must interpretate on how far they must implement the quran etc in ones life and which verses. Hardliners would state that the quran is the highest authority, according to the quran and hadiths and that sharia law should apply and way of life should be done according to the quran, (there interpretation)!

I agree that majority of people see religion as only spiritual but this is one tool that is used to radicalise!!!

The example you gave is a good one, and yes thinking bad and doing bad are different!!!

[Babylon]

Good job I flew out the day before it all kicked off!!!!!! If the terrorists want to blow planes up they should travel on planes from Ibiza.... to say security was low is an understatement!!!!

[Ric Flair]

Good job I flew out the day before it all kicked off!!!!!! If the terrorists want to blow planes up they should travel on planes from Ibiza.... to say security was low is an understatement!!!!

The security are all pilled up, they couldn't give a ****. Only love.

[Babylon]

The security are all pilled up, they couldn't give a ****. Only love.

I don't think you're far wrong!!!!

[Ultra]

Saw this on the news tonight.

Paranoia is still kicking in over the pond..

[lookwhaticando]

Saw this on the news tonight.

Paranoia is still kicking in over the pond..

That would have happened anyway. Perhaps not the sniffer dogs, but certainly the arrest and so on. A few extra precautions were taken under current circumstances, but you can hardly blame them.

Passangers that lose their cool and flip out on board are always going to be handled in this way - usually arrested upon arrival, possibly even causing a diversion. A single unruly passanger can cause all kinds of problem - it's an unwanted distraction for the entire flight crew, and can make other nervous passangers edgier still, which doesn't help anyone.

[golden gordon]

[Thracian]

Great point BreadandCheese!!!

Outstanding.

[l444ry]

With the latest developments (charges) it would seem that the government weren't "crying wolf" after all. Either that or their dastardly plan to take away our civil liberties has been made into an art form.

[golden gordon]

With the latest developments (charges) it would seem that the government weren't "crying wolf" after all. Either that or their dastardly plan to take away our civil liberties has been made into an art form.

yes i hope the usual critics of the police and security services will be as quick to praise as they are to condemn, if indeed they have prevented an attack.