Dannzy

[chili_con_carne]

How on earth is King and Wellens getting in the team ahead of this fella? Danns should start saturday.

I have seen enough of King over the last few years now and as much as I want him to be a legend for us, he just doesn't quite have what it takes.

He's not young anymore, that isn't an excuse. He's nearly 23 apparently. Let's be honest, if he wasn't from the academy no one would want him in the team. He has no pace, he can't really tackle, he passes sideways, he has no instinct on the pitch. I would be interested to see if anyone on here honestly thinks Andy King is a top player? Also everytime i've seen him play for Wales he has looked out of his depth. Sorry andy!

In my opinion we should be looking to sell Kingy in Janurary. I'm sure everyone will disagree though.

[Fox1651]

How on earth is King and Wellens getting in the team ahead of this fella? Danns should start saturday.

I have seen enough of King over the last few years now and as much as I want him to be a legend for us, he just doesn't quite have what it takes.

He's not young anymore, that isn't an excuse. He's nearly 23 apparently. Let's be honest, if he wasn't from the academy no one would want him in the team. He has no pace, he can't really tackle, he passes sideways, he has no instinct on the pitch. I would be interested to see if anyone on here honestly thinks Andy King is a top player? Also everytime i've seen him play for Wales he has looked out of his depth. Sorry andy!

In my opinion we should be looking to sell Kingy in Janurary. I'm sure everyone will disagree though.

i dont think there is much to choose between King / Wellens / Fernandes / Abe / Danns - all good steady midfielders at this level, were missing a Muzzy Izzett sort at the mo in my opinion

[Guest Col city fan]

How on earth is King and Wellens getting in the team ahead of this fella? Danns should start saturday.

I have seen enough of King over the last few years now and as much as I want him to be a legend for us, he just doesn't quite have what it takes.

He's not young anymore, that isn't an excuse. He's nearly 23 apparently. Let's be honest, if he wasn't from the academy no one would want him in the team. He has no pace, he can't really tackle, he passes sideways, he has no instinct on the pitch. I would be interested to see if anyone on here honestly thinks Andy King is a top player? Also everytime i've seen him play for Wales he has looked out of his depth. Sorry andy!

In my opinion we should be looking to sell Kingy in Janurary. I'm sure everyone will disagree though.

Yeah good idea!! having got rid of a couple of our brightest young talents in Hobbs and Waggy, lets go the whole hog and get rid on another! Tell you what, lets sell Schlupp as well...

We've seen that King has something to offer, both under Pearson and last season under Sven - stop having a go an individual players and look at the system Sven is playing them in. This is why King is suffering this season IMO.

As for Danns... super player - another who, I'm afraid, has failed yet to fit into Sven's style of play.

If we sell King, like you are advocating, we would essentially be stripped of up and coming younger talented players.. is this what you want?

Rather than selling him, lets develop him into the player we know he can be

Hows that for an idea?

[davieG]

How on earth is King and Wellens getting in the team ahead of this fella? Danns should start saturday.

I have seen enough of King over the last few years now and as much as I want him to be a legend for us, he just doesn't quite have what it takes.

He's not young anymore, that isn't an excuse. He's nearly 23 apparently. Let's be honest, if he wasn't from the academy no one would want him in the team. He has no pace, he can't really tackle, he passes sideways, he has no instinct on the pitch. I would be interested to see if anyone on here honestly thinks Andy King is a top player? Also everytime i've seen him play for Wales he has looked out of his depth. Sorry andy!

In my opinion we should be looking to sell Kingy in Janurary. I'm sure everyone will disagree though.

You should have titled this topic King Out! as it got next to nothing to do with 'Dannzy'

[Corky]

And what do you think of Wellens then, as you mentioned he should be dropped?

[Libertine]

Nah I wouldn't sell King, he's got some good talent but he certainly shouldn't be untouchable and I'm glad he hasn't been this year so far. As much as I generally disagree with CCF in here I do agree he's not being used correctly now. He's not really the type of player to play at the top of the diamond, no matter how many goals he gets, he's not a playmaker and most of his runs for goals come from deeper positions anyway.

Danns I would like to see start also, ahead of Wellens who is too slow.

[Fox92]

He's not young anymore, that isn't an excuse. He's nearly 23 apparently. Let's be honest, if he wasn't from the academy no one would want him in the team. He has no pace, he can't really tackle, he passes sideways, he has no instinct on the pitch. I would be interested to see if anyone on here honestly thinks Andy King is a top player? Also everytime i've seen him play for Wales he has looked out of his depth. Sorry andy!

I agree. All the posters that love him will be out in force now seeing as they never critisize him, but I don't personally see what he offers. Sometimes will nick a goal, but I think Danns is good enough to get goals from midfield. To be fair, we haven't really seen him in his natural positon.

The only thing about King is that he can holdhold the ball well, and thats perhaps his biggest advantage over the other midfielders, but I think Johnson can come in and do that job now, he just needs to get generally fully fit.

I don't think he is a top player, but he can improve seeing as he is 23, but he has no pace which cannot be improved. Mind you, theres no pace in the midfield really because Johnson and Wellens have no pace either. I just think there is something missing from Kings' games.

[Freeman's Wharfer]

How on earth is King and Wellens getting in the team ahead of this fella? Danns should start saturday.

I have seen enough of King over the last few years now and as much as I want him to be a legend for us, he just doesn't quite have what it takes.

He's not young anymore, that isn't an excuse. He's nearly 23 apparently. Let's be honest, if he wasn't from the academy no one would want him in the team. He has no pace, he can't really tackle, he passes sideways, he has no instinct on the pitch. I would be interested to see if anyone on here honestly thinks Andy King is a top player? Also everytime i've seen him play for Wales he has looked out of his depth. Sorry andy!

In my opinion we should be looking to sell Kingy in Janurary. I'm sure everyone will disagree though.

Except that one that helps him to pop up with several goals every season. Form is temporary, class is permanent and King has obvious class.

[Guest Col city fan]

I agree. All the posters that love him will be out in force now seeing as they never critisize him, but I don't personally see what he offers. Sometimes will nick a goal, but I think Danns is good enough to get goals from midfield. To be fair, we haven't really seen him in his natural positon.

The only thing about King is that he can holdhold the ball well, and thats perhaps his biggest advantage over the other midfielders, but I think Johnson can come in and do that job now, he just needs to get generally fully fit.

I don't think he is a top player, but he can improve seeing as he is 23, but he has no pace which cannot be improved. Mind you, theres no pace in the midfield really because Johnson and Wellens have no pace either. I just think there is something missing from Kings' games.

Did Paul Scholes have much pace? Neither had Bryan Robson. I'm not advocating that King is in the class of either of these two players...of course he isnt..but that instinct of being able to burst into the box, unnoticed, to pop one in is not about fleet of foot, its about having a quick mind. Not many players have this and typically it can't be taught. Its the diamond that is thwarting both King and Danns.. not their ability

[Fox92]

Did Paul Scholes have much pace? Neither had Bryan Robson. I'm not advocating that King is in the class of either of these two players...of course he isnt..but that instinct of being able to burst into the box, unnoticed, to pop one in is not about fleet of foot, its about having a quick mind. Not many players have this and typically it can't be taught. Its the diamond that is thwarting both King and Danns.. not their ability

I don't think the diamond is to anyone's advanatage really. Players like Scholes, and even Lampard nowadyas, don't have much pace but their brains are quicker, hence why they play/played at the top level throughout their careers. One of King's greatest assets is arriving to score goals, but, what player is he? Is he meant to be like box-to-box Muzzy Izzet style player? He is isn't he? But he always looks tired, especially for a younger footballer.

[chili_con_carne]

And what do you think of Wellens then, as you mentioned he should be dropped?

I personally rate Wellens more than King. But from what I have seen of Danns at Palace and the games i've seen this season I can't understand why Danns is on the bench.

[chili_con_carne]

Yeah good idea!! having got rid of a couple of our brightest young talents in Hobbs and Waggy, lets go the whole hog and get rid on another! Tell you what, lets sell Schlupp as well...

We've seen that King has something to offer, both under Pearson and last season under Sven - stop having a go an individual players and look at the system Sven is playing them in. This is why King is suffering this season IMO.

As for Danns... super player - another who, I'm afraid, has failed yet to fit into Sven's style of play.

If we sell King, like you are advocating, we would essentially be stripped of up and coming younger talented players.. is this what you want?

Rather than selling him, lets develop him into the player we know he can be

Hows that for an idea?

You don't understand though King is already developed. He's 23. That is not young in football terms, in general life it is. 16 is young for football. If we get promoted to the premiership then there is no way King could compete at that level. I would love to be proved wrong, but he hasn't got that spark or energy I like to see from a midfielder.

[Guest Col city fan]

I don't think the diamond is to anyone's advanatage really. Players like Scholes, and even Lampard nowadyas, don't have much pace but their brains are quicker, hence why they play/played at the top level throughout their careers. One of King's greatest assets is arriving to score goals, but, what player is he? Is he meant to be like box-to-box Muzzy Izzet style player? He is isn't he? But he always looks tired, especially for a younger footballer.

There isnt a 'Muzzy Izzett' style player..... he was an individual with his own attributes, like any other player. He had the opportunity to get forward so often primarily because he had Lennon sitting behind him, mopping everything up.. and we had pace on the flanks - wingers who could get in behind full backs and deliver crosses either aerially, or to the edge of the area typically where Muzzy was loitering. The one thing that Muzzy did more of than king was scoring goals from a way out - often from the edge of the area, or sometimes further out. and he scored some sensational goals.

Did you see Muzzy play very often? He very often 'ran out of puff' too.. and was frequently taken off towards the end of games - but by then, the system that MON had played had enabled him to do his damage. King would benefit from a similar style of play, rather than being asked to make forward runs so often with no final product for him to feed off.

[moseeds]

Seriously?! This is turning into Max Gradel all over again. The way things are going with negative comments about King on the radio and on these boards he will walk from the club sooner rather than later. The lad is class and his statistics prove so. We'd be a lesser team without King in the squad. And yes as an academy boy he should be given more leeway than someone who's here just for the cash. It's what gives the club character and soul. Something the revolving door at Filbert Way has destroyed far too easily.

[chili_con_carne]

Seriously?! This is turning into Max Gradel all over again. The way things are going with negative comments about King on the radio and on these boards he will walk from the club sooner rather than later. The lad is class and his statistics prove so. We'd be a lesser team without King in the squad. And yes as an academy boy he should be given more leeway than someone who's here just for the cash. It's what gives the club character and soul. Something the revolving door at Filbert Way has destroyed far too easily.

But why is he class? I would love to know why you think he is class. Because he scores a goal every now and then?

[One Arm Babba]

I reckon dannz is a propa playa. Kingy n Wellens out

Its a squad game. I'm sure Danns will get his run in the side. He just has to be patient and take the opportunity when it comes.

Look at Peltier. He didnt sulk, just got down to business and its no coincidence that we have shipped 0 goals in the league since he has came back in. Danns is a good pro and will have the same attitude i'm sure. competition is good.

[Guest Col city fan]

You don't understand though King is already developed. He's 23. That is not young in football terms, in general life it is. 16 is young for football. If we get promoted to the premiership then there is no way King could compete at that level. I would love to be proved wrong, but he hasn't got that spark or energy I like to see from a midfielder.

For goodness sake, look at the 'bigger picture'... King is a developing player... and can only improve.. Are you seriously saying that every player reaches their full potential at age 23? what about experience, strength, etc... How old was Ian Wright, for example, when he made the top grade?

And how many Championship players look as though they won't make the grade in the premiership, only to find that they step-up and improve when they need to?

You really are making some ridiculous comments here

[Haydos]

But why is he class? I would love to know why you think he is class. Because he scores a goal every now and then?

[Fox92]

There isnt a 'Muzzy Izzett' style player..... he was an individual with his own attributes, like any other player. He had the opportunity to get forward so often primarily because he had Lennon sitting behind him, mopping everything up.. and we had pace on the flanks - wingers who could get in behind full backs and deliver crosses either aerially, or to the edge of the area typically where Muzzy was loitering. The one thing that Muzzy did more of than king was scoring goals from a way out - often from the edge of the area, or sometimes further out. and he scored some sensational goals.

Did you see Muzzy play very often? He very often 'ran out of puff' too.. and was frequently taken off towards the end of games - but by then, the system that MON had played had enabled him to do his damage. King would benefit from a similar style of play, rather than being asked to make forward runs so often with no final product for him to feed off.

If Sven is telling the players not to shoot from distance, they arn't going to do it. I saw Izzet play a few times under Martin, but not as much as I did in later years. We haven't got a style that Martin had though, we haven't got a holding man for one. In my opinion, King's best position would be the holding man because he passes sideways and backwards more often and although he doesn't tackle, he may well hurry people off of the ball. Some often call King an attacking midfielder, but he doesn't drive with the ball enough so I'd have him holding. That way Wellens and Johnson can get on the ball more as well.

People seem to judge players on goals, such as King, and that shouldn't happen.

[Rustyfox]

like most ppl have said, the diamond formation is restricting most of of midfielders. im pretty certain that when the likes of gallagher & Nugent (maybe Beckford too now) are fully fit he'll revert to 4-3-3... and this will suit our central midfielders. The likes of Danns, Fernandes & Abe can concentrate purely on winning the midfield battle rather than supporting our full backs - it'll allow space for Wellens & johnson to get on the ball - & the width/ extra man in the middle will free King up to make late runs into the box.

I think we'll see Nugent & Vassell in the wide positions (Gallagher & Dyer as cover), with Beckford down the centre. im not 100% convinced Beckford can lead the line on his own at the moment, but we can easily mix&match those 5 players. Plus the 4-3-3 will def give us more options going forward

We've got quality CM's (including Danns)... its just a case of getting the best out of them

[Guest Col city fan]

like most ppl have said, the diamond formation is restricting most of of midfielders. im pretty certain that when the likes of gallagher & Nugent (maybe Beckford too now) are fully fit he'll revert to 4-3-3... and this will suit our central midfielders. The likes of Danns, Fernandes & Abe can concentrate purely on winning the midfield battle rather than supporting our full backs - it'll allow space for Wellens & johnson to get on the ball - & the width/ extra man in the middle will free King up to make late runs into the box.

I think we'll see Nugent & Vassell in the wide positions (Gallagher & Dyer as cover), with Beckford down the centre. im not 100% convinced Beckford can lead the line on his own at the moment, but we can easily mix&match those 5 players. Plus the 4-3-3 will def give us more options going forward

We've got quality CM's (including Danns)... its just a case of getting the best out of them

Exactly......

[chili_con_carne]

It's a fact that no one can answer why they believe Andy King is class. Other than the reason's he can score goals and he's from the academy. Is that really enough to warrant a place in our midfield?

[Guest Col city fan]

If Sven is telling the players not to shoot from distance, they arn't going to do it. I saw Izzet play a few times under Martin, but not as much as I did in later years. We haven't got a style that Martin had though, we haven't got a holding man for one. In my opinion, King's best position would be the holding man because he passes sideways and backwards more often and although he doesn't tackle, he may well hurry people off of the ball. Some often call King an attacking midfielder, but he doesn't drive with the ball enough so I'd have him holding. That way Wellens and Johnson can get on the ball more as well.

People seem to judge players on goals, such as King, and that shouldn't happen.

nah, the holding man is the beast of the team.. the one that makes the tough challenges, wins the ball and sets everything off again. This is exactly what Neil Lennon did - the amount of opposition attacks he thwarted by his industry and knowing where to position himself was the fulcrum of MON's teams. He then simply laid it off to Muzzy, Parker and they played the football...

King isnt quick enough or tough enough to play this position - for me this would have to be Fernandes in Sven's team, as Abe just aint good enough.

Brings me back to the point I made in the summer regarding our lack of quality in this position - a stopper, a thwarter - breaks stuff up and starts us attacking again. Fernandes IMO is the best we have in this role.. but not that good at it

[davieG]

It's a fact that no one can answer why they believe Andy King is class. Other than the reason's he can score goals and he's from the academy. Is that really enough to warrant a place in our midfield?

Perhaps you should explain why/where/how Danns and other Midfielders are better/offer more?

How on earth is King and Wellens getting in the team ahead of this fella? Danns should start saturday.

I have seen enough of King over the last few years now and as much as I want him to be a legend for us, he just doesn't quite have what it takes.

He's not young anymore, that isn't an excuse. He's nearly 23 apparently. Let's be honest, if he wasn't from the academy no one would want him in the team. He has no pace, he can't really tackle, he passes sideways, he has no instinct on the pitch. I would be interested to see if anyone on here honestly thinks Andy King is a top player? Also everytime i've seen him play for Wales he has looked out of his depth. Sorry andy!

In my opinion we should be looking to sell Kingy in Janurary. I'm sure everyone will disagree though.

Plenty of people in many, many threads have gone into great detail about what King brings to the team yet all you've done in your opening post is slag off King which even then is only your opinion and say nothing of what Danns offers or makes him so special.

All our midfielders have different attributes and skills and football is about how you can take those skills and combine them to form a team that is stronger than the individual parts taking into account the style of play you choose to adopt and the opposition you are facing. As far as I can see King offers something's that Danns doesn't and vice versa, Sven, having got the defence sorted is now experimenting with the midfield which currently excludes Danns but I'm sure he'll want to see how he performs with the likes of Johnson etc.

[Rustyfox]

Id agree that Fernandes is the best holding player in the team - not for his ability to start play, but to break up oppostion attacks. going back to his Man City days (from what i remember) he did the same there. he's a big lad, likes a tackle and has the attributes to play that position... which would allow 2 other CM's to join the attack (if we played 4-3-3).

The 3 in midfield id like to see wud be Fernandes, Danns & Johnson. That being said, we know Wellens, Abe & King cud replace them and be decent