Frank to be Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 If you don't believe in people making money who is going to create the jobs? The government who are acting in the interests of society will create jobs that benefit society.
Webbo Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 The government who are acting in the interests of society will create jobs that benefit society. How are the govt going to pay for those jobs?
Frank to be Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 How are the govt going to pay for those jobs? Through taxation like they always do, and if they don't have enough, maybe they'll just have to print some more. Ultimately, it's not about the money. We need to get away from this idea that money is everything, it isn't. Society would be much better off if people worked for the benefit of each other rather than financial gain.
Webbo Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Through taxation like they always do, and if they don't have enough, maybe they'll just have to print some more. Ultimately, it's not about the money. We need to get away from this idea that money is everything, it isn't. Society would be much better off if people worked for the benefit of each other rather than financial gain. So the govt pay 100% of your wages and take back say 40% in tax? Can you see the flaw in that equation? Anyway if money isn't everything what are you complaining about?
Bettsj2 Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Through taxation like they always do, and if they don't have enough, maybe they'll just have to print some more. Ultimately, it's not about the money. We need to get away from this idea that money is everything, it isn't. Society would be much better off if people worked for the benefit of each other rather than financial gain. Money is everything. Always has been and always will be.
The Longstop Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Through taxation like they always do, and if they don't have enough, maybe they'll just have to print some more. Ultimately, it's not about the money. We need to get away from this idea that money is everything, it isn't. Society would be much better off if people worked for the benefit of each other rather than financial gain. I'd give up now if I were you, Webbo is tearing you apart. So the government should just create a job for everyone and pay for it out of taxation? Guess that makes sense if 100% of their wages are taxed.
Frank to be Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 So the govt pay 100% of your wages and take back say 40% in tax? Can you see the flaw in that equation? Anyway if money isn't everything what are you complaining about? I didn't say there wouldn't be businesses. Even today there are many wonderful businesses who do great work and create jobs without being motivated solely by profit. I'm complaining because as a society we can do much more to help each other, the planet and all living things if only we'd stop focussing so much on how much money something makes and focus more on the benefit it has to society.
The Longstop Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Most of the jobs the tories have 'created' are low paid, ultra-low productivity jobs that have come about through EU immigration. The only jobs you could credit the tories for are the ones they've given to their rich mates. The tory fixation with wealth makes me laugh, a) because the relentless pursuit of wealth has no benefit and b) because on average everyone is worse off under the tories anyway. What we need is to refocus on the important things in life, such as providing equal opportunities, a fair society, and looking after the weak and vulnerable. A vote for the tories is a vote for a select handful of people who you don't know and who don't care about you getting an even more unequal share of the things in life we're all entitled to. The jobs came about through EU immigration? Chicken and egg pal. Most of the jobs were created in the private sector (and I mean small startup businesses as much as big business there) and that's why EU migrants have flocked here to take them. Supply and demand. They are dragging down wage inflation though, and then you'll have Labour moaning about the living wage. If Labour had created record employment, slashing the public sector and more than making up for it with private sector jobs while keeping the full/part time split at the same rate and also clearing people off the incapacity benefit list (which Labour used to fudge unemployment figures) would you be slagging them off? In tough economic times the coalition have done a fantastic job getting Britain back working.
Webbo Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 I didn't say there wouldn't be businesses. Even today there are many wonderful businesses who do great work and create jobs without being motivated solely by profit. I'm complaining because as a society we can do much more to help each other, the planet and all living things if only we'd stop focussing so much on how much money something makes and focus more on the benefit it has to society. Most are though and if you don't believe they should be allowed to make a profit why would they invest their money to create jobs? Why would they even stay in this country at all? And if they don't make any money what are you going to tax them on?
The Longstop Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 I didn't say there wouldn't be businesses. Even today there are many wonderful businesses who do great work and create jobs without being motivated solely by profit. I'm complaining because as a society we can do much more to help each other, the planet and all living things if only we'd stop focussing so much on how much money something makes and focus more on the benefit it has to society. Quite concerning that we have morons like this eligible to vote in this country, people who think only businesses who don't like making too much profit should be allowed and everyone else should work in the public sector. Where will the money come from to pay their wages? From the government apparently. They must have a lot of money stashed away which we didn't know about. The sort of clowns who blindly vote Greens or Lib Dems based on a snippet of propaganda they've heard. There really should be an IQ test and 10 simple questions about how an economy works which you need to pass before your vote is accepted.
Webbo Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Quite concerning that we have morons like this eligible to vote in this country, people who think only businesses who don't like making too much profit should be allowed and everyone else should work in the public sector. Where will the money come from to pay their wages? From the government apparently. They must have a lot of money stashed away which we didn't know about. The sort of clowns who blindly vote Greens or Lib Dems based on a snippet of propaganda they've heard. There really should be an IQ test and 10 simple questions about how an economy works which you need to pass before your vote is accepted. Keep it civil mate, we can argue without getting personal.
Buce Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Read the blog and educate yourself. Cityfanlee has a new account!
The Longstop Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Keep it civil mate, we can argue without getting personal. Point taken, fair play.
sphericalfox Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Cityfanlee has a new account! You can tell it's him because it says there are facts in it, but gives ZERO references? These facts are inaccurate are are just opinion? He'll likely edit the blog after someone pulls up the inaccuracies or point out how stupid it is? I think you're on to something. Apologies Moosey, you sometimes at least post a link or two with references.
Strokes Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 This is getting needlessly nasty, We usually enjoy reasonable debate in here. I'll rain check tonight.
The Longstop Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 You can tell it's him because it says there are facts in it, but gives ZERO references? These facts are inaccurate are are just opinion? He'll likely edit the blog after someone pulls up the inaccuracies or point out how stupid it is? I think you're on to something. Apologies Moosey, you sometimes at least post a link or two with references. What does a lefty do when they're losing an argument? Point the finger and start making unfounded accusations. You'll be calling me a closet racist next. Suffice to say I haven't even read this thread prior to today let alone posted on it. Care to give one example of a false stat on my blog? I can back up every one of them.
sphericalfox Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 What does a lefty do when they're losing an argument? Point the finger and start making unfounded accusations. You'll be calling me a closet racist next. Suffice to say I haven't even read this thread prior to today let alone posted on it. Care to give one example of a false stat on my blog? I can back up every one of them. The onus is on you to provide links and references to your sources. As you've not provided one, we'll just have assume that they are opinions not facts. BTW I'm not a lefty. I wouldn't call you are racist; a GOBshite yes.
The Longstop Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/pensions/11152840/Public-vs-private-sector-pay-gap-is-5000-or-a-fifth-of-earnings.html You'll have to do with this for now as we're discussing public/private and I can't be arsed doing 100 links. Most figures like the deficit as a % of GDP can't be contested they are facts, but I've taken from OBR and IMF where necessary. Anything written and without numbers is my opinion, if you like, but I'd like you to find just one example that you deem to be inaccurate if you're trying to discredit me.
Buce Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 You can tell it's him because it says there are facts in it, but gives ZERO references? These facts are inaccurate are are just opinion? He'll likely edit the blog after someone pulls up the inaccuracies or point out how stupid it is? I think you're on to something. Apologies Moosey, you sometimes at least post a link or two with references. I think it's the poor grasp of English grammar that's the giveaway. Moose, for all his faults, at least appears to have had an adequate education from all those non-wealth creating teachers...
The Longstop Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 I think it's the poor grasp of English grammar that's the giveaway. Moose, for all his faults, at least appears to have had an adequate education from all those non-wealth creating teachers... So it's just my grammar that's poor, but you agree with my arguments? In that case care to provide a couple of examples of incorrect grammar from the blog? Or was it just another throwaway comment to try to discredit a blog that doesn't conform to your political leanings?
sphericalfox Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 I think it's the poor grasp of English grammar that's the giveaway. Moose, for all his faults, at least appears to have had an adequate education from all those non-wealth creating teachers... And the endless diatribe formatting is another clue.
The Longstop Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 And the endless diatribe formatting is another clue. Yawn. But let's just pretend I was this other fella you keep going on about. Does that make my points invalid? I'm still waiting on you to provide ONE inaccuracy from the blog.
MiniFox Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Yawn. But let's just pretend I was this other fella you keep going on about. Does that make my points invalid? I'm still waiting on you to provide ONE inaccuracy from the blog. I'm not sure if this is an inaccuracy but "After my award-winning political blog in 2010, the Grumpy Old Baby is back with a remastered version ready for the 2015 election… " What award?
Buce Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 So it's just my grammar that's poor, but you agree with my arguments? In that case care to provide a couple of examples of incorrect grammar from the blog? Or was it just another throwaway comment to try to discredit a blog that doesn't conform to your political leanings? Sorry, but I don't work for nothing - we need to keep creating that wealth, after all. Of course, if you'd like to employ me to edit your blog, you'll find my rates are very competitive. Then again, I'm choosy who I work for..
sphericalfox Posted 6 April 2015 Posted 6 April 2015 Yawn. But let's just pretend I was this other fella you keep going on about. Does that make my points invalid? I'm still waiting on you to provide ONE inaccuracy from the blog. 'New Labour left the NHS statistically pound-for-pound the worst healthcare system in the world.' I'd love to see where you found this 'fact'. As even though the Tories have done everything they could to dismantle the NHS, restructure it, so that it opens the doors for privatisation, and that it can never be reversed, it pound for pound is in fact is one of the best healthcare systems in the world. Yes it has problems, with a system so large that's an inevitability, but it make assertions without ANY facts based upon your own biased opinions, is not only laughable but actually very sad indeed. http://blogs.channel4.com/snowblog/britains-health-service-world/25297
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