Another Terrorist Arrest.

[Nick]

That sounds like it should be the introduction to a super hero movie. Have you thought about buying a tiger costume and beating up ethnic minorities?

 

I would imagine he was hoping that's what he would be doing as a community volunteer Policeman but was gravely disappointed when he found out his warrant card and his navy blue dangerous tiger suit wasn't a licence to commit genocide.

[Alf Bentley]

Have you thought about buying a tiger costume and beating up ethnic minorities?

 

He could sing that Hull City song while he was doing it: "You're getting mauled by the Tiger!  Mauled by the Tiger!" 

 

 

In all seriousness, even if the security services have kept a lid on most potential Islamist terrorist attacks, it's a bit worrying what might happen when some of these home-grown Jihadis come back from places like Syria with Islamic State training in ideology and guerrilla warfare....

 

Think I'm right in saying that they've actually committed an offence by going off to fight for an organisation correctly deemed illegal in this country....is that right? If so, they should be charged and tried. Any who can be rehabilitated and repent, fair enough, but what about those who don't? I'm normally Mr. Wet Liberal, but I'd be inclined to deem that they've pledged loyalty to a different state, tear up their passports and parachute them into their Islamic State. Probably just an emotional response, but I'm not sure what you do with people who develop a potentially lifelong commitment to mass murder and the violent overthrow of democratic society.....just keep them under observation and jump on them if they're about to do something, as with those who've never been off fighting abroad but get drawn into violent extremism within the UK?

[Buce]

Legally speaking, nobody recognises IS as a state, so technically they can't pledge allegience to it.

As such, I suspect that international law prevents us from making them stateless, however frustrating that may be.

[Rincewind]

Just wondering, would the Secret Service want it to be known that they are interrogating terrorist suspects and even go as far as tell the media that they have intention of arresting more.

[Fox92]

Naughty naughty DT

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2827512/Three-year-old-catches-woman-having-sex-baby-changing-room-man-dressed-TIGGER.html?ito=social-twitter_mailonline

 

That headline.

 

"Three year old catches woman having sex" yeah as if a three year old would know what was going on.

[Jon the Hat]

Just wondering, would the Secret Service want it to be known that they are interrogating terrorist suspects and even go as far as tell the media that they have intention of arresting more.

 

You think terrorists were previously unaware than the Secret Service was involved in anti-terrorism activities?

[Alf Bentley]

Legally speaking, nobody recognises IS as a state, so technically they can't pledge allegience to it.

As such, I suspect that international law prevents us from making them stateless, however frustrating that may be.

 

Yep, I'm sure that's right. Once such people have served any sentence, I suppose they'd just have to have an eye kept on them.

 

More preventive work seems like a good idea - to prevent these blokes getting radicalized in the first place. So often, it just seems to be some ordinary bloke who's a bit lost, looking for meaning and status in life....along comes some committed jihadi ideologist to indoctrinate him and give him a purpose to commit himself to, and next thing he's in Syria (or London) blowing people up.

 

I was hearing people talk about this bloke, Kabir Ahmed, from Derby who's believed to have killed 8 people (including himself) in a suicide bombing in Iraq. People who knew him are saying that he was a normal, decent bloke, but not very bright and easily led, then got indoctrinated at university. Significant resources could be devoted to targeting the people who carry out such indoctrination work and prosecuting them under "incitement to hatred" legislation. That would require close collaboration with everyone from mosques and local communities to schools, youth clubs and student unions. 

[Buce]

Yep, I'm sure that's right. Once such people have served any sentence, I suppose they'd just have to have an eye kept on them.

More preventive work seems like a good idea - to prevent these blokes getting radicalized in the first place. So often, it just seems to be some ordinary bloke who's a bit lost, looking for meaning and status in life....along comes some committed jihadi ideologist to indoctrinate him and give him a purpose to commit himself to, and next thing he's in Syria (or London) blowing people up.

I was hearing people talk about this bloke, Kabir Ahmed, from Derby who's believed to have killed 8 people (including himself) in a suicide bombing in Iraq. People who knew him are saying that he was a normal, decent bloke, but not very bright and easily led, then got indoctrinated at university. Significant resources could be devoted to targeting the people who carry out such indoctrination work and prosecuting them under "incitement to hatred" legislation. That would require close collaboration with everyone from mosques and local communities to schools, youth clubs and student unions.

I'm not sure what that says about our universities if you can get away with 'not being very bright'.

There's nothing wrong with the idea of throwing resources at stopping the recruiting sergeants in the mosques, youth clubs etc, but I think a good proportion of these home-grown Jihadis are being radicalized over the internet, and short of the kind of censorship that we see from the more repressive regimes (something I'm wholly opposed to) I'm not sure how we'd address that.

[Alf Bentley]

I'm not sure what that says about our universities if you can get away with 'not being very bright'.

There's nothing wrong with the idea of throwing resources at stopping the recruiting sergeants in the mosques, youth clubs etc, but I think a good proportion of these home-grown Jihadis are being radicalized over the internet, and short of the kind of censorship that we see from the more repressive regimes (and I don't want to see that) I'm not sure how we'd address that.

 

Good point re. internet indoctrination. Maybe for them it's a case of understanding and counter-acting the process by which they end up viewing these extremist sites. For example, understanding whether these sites are being recommended by contacts or whether they're ending up there by Google searching for other topics (e.g. "Islam", "Syria", "jihad", whatever). If the recruiting sergeants are targeted by the police/intelligence services, it shouldn't be beyond the capability of the authorities and/or the mosques to set up web sites offering more moderate interpretations of Islam and/or more balanced views on Syria/Iraq, disproving some of the wilder claims of the extremists....Such sites needn't avoid criticism of the West, but could guide people more towards democratic expression, peaceful protest etc.

 

A comprehensive strategy to offer roles and opportunities to young people who might be vulnerable to radicalisation could also play a part. There's a long-established correlation between unemployment and involvement in extremism of all sorts - doesn't explain all of it, but can explain some of it. The same presumably applies where people feel they're earning crap pay for crap jobs that earn them little respect. You're looking at long-term issues there, though, building an economy with a better class of employment, good quality education and apprenticeships etc. It does matter, though.

 

I remember spending a few months on placement in the Basque Country, years ago, when ETA and Herri Batasuna (political wing of ETA) were still active and loads of unemployed youth were involved with them - gave them a feeling of purpose and status unavailable elsewhere, I suppose.

[Buce]

I take what you're saying regarding the link between low pay/unemployment etc. and extremism, Alf, and it's a valid point: however, many of these jihadis come from comfortable, professional backgrounds (wasn't the guy who tried to blow-up Glasgow airport a doctor?), so there's clearly something else going on.

Regarding internet sites, I would bet my house that the most extreme sites are sited on the 'dark web', and only accessable via the TOR system. Finding stuff on the dark web is not as straightforward as just googling, it usually relies on being 'in the know'. I imagine that kind of information is being passed on via social media.

The ironic thing is that TOR was developed by the US govt, which continues to fund it.

[Alf Bentley]

I take what you're saying regarding the link between low pay/unemployment etc. and extremism, Alf, and it's a valid point: however, many of these jihadis come from comfortable, professional backgrounds (wasn't the guy who tried to blow-up Glasgow airport a doctor?), so there's clearly something else going on.

Regarding internet sites, I would bet my house that the most extreme sites are sited on the 'dark web', and only accessable via the TOR system. Finding stuff on the dark web is not as straightforward as just googling, it usually relies on being 'in the know'. I imagine that kind of information is being passed on via social media.

The ironic thing is that TOR was developed by the US govt, which continues to fund it.

 

Yes, I'm sure that it's not just blokes on the dole. Young men from all sorts of backgrounds can be questing for a purpose, a cause, a status...or just more open to extreme "black and white" solutions. I certainly don't claim to have an extensive understanding of what really motivates such people deep down or precisely how they get involved in terrorism. But it needs to be a priority for the authorities to find that out - and I'm sure that it is (though how successfully is another matter).

 

If terrorist recruits are using such "dark web" sites, that suggests that there are people directing them there who need to be targeted. I'm sure that the secret services are onto that - as the Edward Snowden case suggests - but how successfully is another matter, again.

 

I hope that a lot of serious work is being done on this, anyway. Even if Islamic State seems more interested in fighting in the Middle East than international terrorism, at least some of the people who have worked with them are bound to want to launch attacks when they get back home - and will have been exposed to a lot of techniques and equipment for doing it.