mat_j101 Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 LINK Looks like Paul Hartley might be leaving Hearts. If he leaves like Pressley did, he would be available on a free. Hes a good player. Not sure if he would come to a club in the Championship though. Would have thought we would be able to afford his wages though if MM arrives. Worth thinking about??? Just putting it out there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swedging Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Worth thinking about??? More Scottish under-achievers? 'Tis the stuff o' nightmares, I tell ye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wils Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Is our Midfeild cureable then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brummie-FOX Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Maybe Danny Cademarteri could have a go. As TPH stated, he's a legend at curing incurable things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Nibblington Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Is our Midfeild cureable then? Yes. Take most of them out the back and shoot them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Quality player IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Is our Midfeild cureable then? Fez might be if he plays midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brummie-FOX Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 It makes me laugh that when some decent players are made available by their clubs, we all think they will come here. How many players has Rob Kelly signed since he's been here? About 5-6, nobody near the class of Hartley or Pressley. Unless we have a managerial change, I don't see much point in even discussing the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrickyTrev Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Very good player, right midfielder is exactly what we need, can't see him coming to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ithuriel Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Leon , the professional . that should take care of the midfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe. Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Not more Scottish please. We don't have good experience with Scots here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stez Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Not more Scottish please. We don't have good experience with Scots here... gary mcallister, ali mauchlen, david speedie , matt elliott , billy mckinley, etc weren't to bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 gary mcallister, ali mauchlen, david speedie , matt elliott , billy mckinley, etc weren't to bad Tommy Wright (the 1st), Paul Dickov, Davie Gibson... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bert Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Momo Sylla as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 gary mcallister, ali mauchlen, david speedie , matt elliott , billy mckinley, etc weren't to bad Matt Elliott was English. He had a Scottish grandparent (I think it was his grandmother?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
who-izzet Posted 13 December 2006 Share Posted 13 December 2006 Hartley is 30 isn't he? He could be better than what we currently have on the right. Unless we get rid of Sylla & Low I wouldn't bother though. He just adds to the wage bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancunianfox Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 How many players has Rob Kelly signed since he's been here? About 5-6, nobody near the class of Hartley or Pressley. Unless we have a managerial change, I don't see much point in even discussing the issue. I would agree with you if you had said 'unless we have a change in ownership or funding'. Kelly has had no budget to work with so far and in my opinion is still pretty much untested in the transfer market. I don't think there are many managers who can find quality players to play at a pretty high standard of football for the kind of wages that this club could offer. We cannot attract players like these to the club because we no money to spend and a very low wage bill. To suggest that its because Kelly isn't interesting in signing quality players is insubstantiated. I am sure that given the choice he would have signed the good Andy Johnson, but the simplicity of our situation is that the option wasn't available to him. We therefore ended up with the WAJ instead. I agree that out of the four players he has signed two have been dire but thats the way football works. Sometimes signings don't work out. You could spend £30m on one of the best strikers in the world and that may not work out, and sometimes for reasons other than the manager. It figures then that if you spend a few thousand on four players in a league where many other clubs can spend hundreds of thousands or even millions of pounds on players it figures that some of them aren't going to make the grade. At present we cannot compete financially with at least ten sides in the division. I cannot see how that is Kelly's fault. Hopefully we will be able to offer our players more money soon and have a bit to spend on transfer fees too. Then we can begin to think about players like Hartley, Pressley and some of the names that have been banded around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 Quality player IMO. I agree. Proved himself at international level during Scotland's recent revival. He's a consistent goal scorer at all levels and can take a mean free-kick, something none of our first team players seem capable of. And more importantly he can be often seen sporting an Ian Marshall type hair style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancunianfox Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 And more importantly he can be often seen sporting an Ian Marshall type hair style. Thats more than enough to convince me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 I would agree with you if you had said 'unless we have a change in ownership or funding'. Kelly has had no budget to work with so far and in my opinion is still pretty much untested in the transfer market. I don't think there are many managers who can find quality players to play at a pretty high standard of football for the kind of wages that this club could offer. We cannot attract players like these to the club because we no money to spend and a very low wage bill. To suggest that its because Kelly isn't interesting in signing quality players is insubstantiated. I am sure that given the choice he would have signed the good Andy Johnson, but the simplicity of our situation is that the option wasn't available to him. We therefore ended up with the WAJ instead. I agree that out of the four players he has signed two have been dire but thats the way football works. Sometimes signings don't work out. You could spend £30m on one of the best strikers in the world and that may not work out, and sometimes for reasons other than the manager. It figures then that if you spend a few thousand on four players in a league where many other clubs can spend hundreds of thousands or even millions of pounds on players it figures that some of them aren't going to make the grade. At present we cannot compete financially with at least ten sides in the division. I cannot see how that is Kelly's fault. Hopefully we will be able to offer our players more money soon and have a bit to spend on transfer fees too. Then we can begin to think about players like Hartley, Pressley and some of the names that have been banded around. Our wage bill is as big as at least half the teams in this league if not more, and many of the lower waged teams are doing better than us. RK was directly responsible for Welsh, Low, McAuley, Kenton, Johnson & Tiatto ( I'd hazard a guess the last 3 have wages matching some of the best in this league). Many people, who also support RK reckon he was very influential in the signings of McCarthy, Hume, Fryatt, Henderson, Johansson & Hammond of which only Hume and possibly McCarthy are proving their worth in this league at this time. That's 12 players! He's had plenty of opportunity to demonstrate his ability to spot a 'good un' he's either failed miserable or his ability to get the best out of players is very suspect or both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 I would agree with you if you had said 'unless we have a change in ownership or funding'. Kelly has had no budget to work with so far and in my opinion is still pretty much untested in the transfer market. I don't think there are many managers who can find quality players to play at a pretty high standard of football for the kind of wages that this club could offer. We cannot attract players like these to the club because we no money to spend and a very low wage bill. To suggest that its because Kelly isn't interesting in signing quality players is insubstantiated. I am sure that given the choice he would have signed the good Andy Johnson, but the simplicity of our situation is that the option wasn't available to him. We therefore ended up with the WAJ instead. I agree that out of the four players he has signed two have been dire but thats the way football works. Sometimes signings don't work out. You could spend £30m on one of the best strikers in the world and that may not work out, and sometimes for reasons other than the manager. It figures then that if you spend a few thousand on four players in a league where many other clubs can spend hundreds of thousands or even millions of pounds on players it figures that some of them aren't going to make the grade. At present we cannot compete financially with at least ten sides in the division. I cannot see how that is Kelly's fault. Hopefully we will be able to offer our players more money soon and have a bit to spend on transfer fees too. Then we can begin to think about players like Hartley, Pressley and some of the names that have been banded around. Not that I want to laud the efforts of other managers because all circumstances are different at every club, but Cotterill at Burnley has worked wonders with hardly any money. All of his signings that have ever cost money have come from him signing players for a pittance and then selling them for a much bigger fee and then using the money wisely to take his team to another level. On a much briefer scale, Geraint Williams at Colchester has made a mockery of clubs like ourselves and Leeds. They've got a stadium that fits just 5,000 fans in and a wage bill that's probably smaller than most League One clubs, yet they are acers ahead of us in quality and organisation this season. Jamie Cureton and Chris Iwelumo?? 20 league goals between them already!!!!. There are more examples I could give, but as i've said all circumstances are different with each club and it's not just about signings, etc. The fact is, this club is under-achieving yet again. Ok, so we aren't promotion material and to become that with this current set-up would mean we'd need a manager who could work miracles and get his team to punch above their weight. But that's exactly what good managers get their teams to do. Some decent managers struggle at times and perhaps Kelly is one of them, but with zero managerial experience before this gig it's hard to prove that. I just don't have the faith that given a slightly larger transfer budget that he could take this club in to the premiership. MM if he arrives won't give Kelly an abundance of cash, he'll provide enough that if the manager is wise and clever enough should be able to move this club forward, but it's whether our manager can do that. I have my doubts and MM is a ruthless man and that's a good thing for this club as we've had nancy boys run this club for far too long and look where it's got us. 3 years in the arsehole of a division and no sign of improvement. How this club can still be worth the same as it was when the shareholders rescued us 4 years ago is beyond me, but if MM has offered them their money back then it's their lucky day. Kelly will need to have some lucky days to survive much longer than January. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Honcho Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 He couldn't cut it down south when he was a youngster and even with 10 years experience under his belt since then I doubt he'd cut it now! Probably just as inadequate as the players we have now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancunianfox Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 Many people, who also support RK reckon he was very influential in the signings of McCarthy, Hume, Fryatt, Henderson, Johansson & Hammond of which only Hume and possibly McCarthy are proving their worth in this league at this time. That's 12 players! Thats 12 players only if you bump up his signings by rumour! Geez. I think there are way too many rumours flying around at the minute. Having said that its like that on most clubs forums at the minute. In fact, from what I have heard from and read written by lots fans of the teams we were beat by in November felt that they were lucky (Norwich in particular) and that we aren't a bad side. They also thought that Levi Porter was our best player by a mile. Its an interesting comparison to compare the views of supporters who have watched the same match. As a supported who cannot make it too lots of games in a season I personally don't think Radio Leicester is a big help either. I mean does anyone else find that they think their listening to a different game when the change to the commentary of the team we are playing againsts feed? I know I certainly do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 He couldn't cut it down south when he was a youngster and even with 10 years experience under his belt since then I doubt he'd cut it now! Probably just as inadequate as the players we have now. Might be worth the gamble. I'd not pay a transfer fee for him though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancunianfox Posted 14 December 2006 Share Posted 14 December 2006 There are more examples I could give, but as i've said all circumstances are different with each club and it's not just about signings, etc. The fact is, this club is under-achieving yet again. Ok, so we aren't promotion material and to become that with this current set-up would mean we'd need a manager who could work miracles and get his team to punch above their weight. But that's exactly what good managers get their teams to do. Some decent managers struggle at times and perhaps Kelly is one of them, but with zero managerial experience before this gig it's hard to prove that. I just don't have the faith that given a slightly larger transfer budget that he could take this club in to the premiership. MM if he arrives won't give Kelly an abundance of cash, he'll provide enough that if the manager is wise and clever enough should be able to move this club forward, but it's whether our manager can do that. I have my doubts and MM is a ruthless man and that's a good thing for this club as we've had nancy boys run this club for far too long and look where it's got us. 3 years in the arsehole of a division and no sign of improvement. How this club can still be worth the same as it was when the shareholders rescued us 4 years ago is beyond me, but if MM has offered them their money back then it's their lucky day. Won't quote your entire post but I think thats a pretty accurate appraisal of the state of play. I wouldn't go as far as to say that I would be opposed to replacing Kelly, but all too often we have ended up getting rid of a manager and have been unable to replace them with somebody better. We will never get anywhere doing that even with money. If we could get a manager lined up who would be an improvement I would be for it. I just don't like the idea of sacking the manager then going round the houses looking for a replacement, being unsuccessful and making a bad appointment because of a lack of alternatives. I think we might as well keep the average manager we have got than getting another who is not going to offer the club anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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