Chandler Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 It's a fair question isn't it? And the reason why I ask it is obvious: what HARD evidence is there to suggest that we could possibly mount a promotion challenge? And please, don't give me all this 'we have improved since Adams left' bullshit because it just aint true. Just because we sign a load of mediocre Jocks, draw all the time and hover above the drop zone doesn't make us next year's promo contenders. If we can manage 60 points say, then I might be persuaded (albeit reluctantly) to give Levein a chance to atone for his DISASTROUS stewardship to date. So Craig it's either 60 Pts or your P45.
Craig Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 It's a fair question isn't it? And the reason why I ask it is obvious: what HARD evidence is there to suggest that we could possibly mount a promotion challenge?And please, don't give me all this 'we have improved since Adams left' bullshit because it just aint true. Just because we sign a load of mediocre Jocks, draw all the time and hover above the drop zone doesn't make us next year's promo contenders. If we can manage 60 points say, then I might be persuaded (albeit reluctantly) to give Levein a chance to atone for his DISASTROUS stewardship to date. So Craig it's either 60 Pts or your P45. 91278[/snapback] We've signed one, Stephen Hughes.
Louise Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 We've signed one, Stephen Hughes. 91280[/snapback] And he's arguably the best player we've got.
breadandcheese Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 You raise a good question, if sounding a little like Alan Sugar on the telly. 60 points or you're fired. As I wrote in another thread, I do not think we should accept mid-table mediocrity next season. The gap between us & the play-off teams is currently large, however it is easily bridgeable. This is based on our goal difference being quite comparable, and in some cases superior to most of the teams above us (including play-off teams). It has been our inability to convert draws to wins that has cost us. Compare our number of defeats with those teams above us and you will see that we do not compare badly on that front either. The fact is that this is a bad league. As I keep banging on, if we can bring in 2 or 3 good players and work hard on the training ground (focusing on organisation, positioning, stamina, drive, etc), we should close the gap on the play-off teams. This is particularly so if we manage to go on a good run at the start of the season and get the confidence up. I think automatic promotion will be well beyond us next season, but we should expect to be challenging for a play-off place (maybe just missing out, but challenging none-the-less). Anything less than that and I will regard it as another failure.
Knighton Matt Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 i'd certainly settle for mid-table mediocrity if i could see the club were generally making progress. the problemn with MA towards the end was things had gone very stale and i personally (along with a few thousand others i would imagine) couldn't see the club making any progress. whilst the results haven't significantly improved since CL came in i am far happier because he is clearing out the deadwood and bringing in young hungry players which hopefully will be to the long-term benefit of the club. therefore as long as progress is being made i'll be happy with mid table mediocrity.
Frenzied Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 Patience is a virtue. One serious problem LCFC has is the fact that too many of the fans are fickel and know little about football, so when an obvious improvement has occured in a very short space of time they fail to notice. It took Taylor more than a season to undo O'Neill's good work; it's going to take more than a few months for Levein to undo the mistakes of Taylor, Bassett and Adams.
Ric Flair Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 There were no signs of Derby doing what they have done this season, or Preston or a few other clubs. There were no signs of the bird that shit on my head this morning, things happen. If it's happened in the past it can happen again, clutching at straws I know!! I won't accept a season like we've had this season again, but having said that I recognise that it takes time to change things. I've seen improvement under Levein but not in terms of results, which at the end of the day is all that matters. Levein's the business though, i'm confident he is and all these same debates we keep having will be all forgotten, I hope!!
Who ate all the pies? Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 Adams stewardship this season was hardly breathtaking! Get your rose tinted, Adams loving, galsses off and get used to life under Levein! Some people honestly, at least we have signs that we may have a team for the future not just a team of old donkeys!
Teeno Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 I personally wouldn't accept mid table next season. I think it is clear we have made vast improvments since Cl has been incharge and these things take time, Adams left us in a poor state and Cl has done well in getting rid of crap like Benji, Scowcroft, Makin and Pressman, and offloading the older players with no future at the club like Elliott and Keown and has replaced the likes of them with better players like Hughes, Maybury, McCarthy etc. I've said this for a long time and I stand buy it we have a very good team for this division and have an awsome midfield, we just need someone to convert all the chances we create. Connolly has yet to prove himself and MDV doesn't seem to be the answer. If we can get a decent goalscorer in at the club then I think we have the potential to be one of the front runners next season. In recent years have seen no end of players come and go, but under Levein I think he will be cementing a team that will get used to each other and a team with a future that we can relate to aswell. I'm looking foward to next season and have high hopes that we can do well.
filbertway Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 I personally wouldn't accept mid table next season.I think it is clear we have made vast improvments since Cl has been incharge and these things take time, Adams left us in a poor state and Cl has done well in getting rid of crap like Benji, Scowcroft, Makin and Pressman, and offloading the older players with no future at the club like Elliott and Keown and has replaced the likes of them with better players like Hughes, Maybury, McCarthy etc. I've said this for a long time and I stand buy it we have a very good team for this division and have an awsome midfield, we just need someone to convert all the chances we create. Connolly has yet to prove himself and MDV doesn't seem to be the answer. If we can get a decent goalscorer in at the club then I think we have the potential to be one of the front runners next season. In recent years have seen no end of players come and go, but under Levein I think he will be cementing a team that will get used to each other and a team with a future that we can relate to aswell. I'm looking foward to next season and have high hopes that we can do well. 91314[/snapback] totally agree with you there teeno
Simon Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 There were no signs of Derby doing what they have done this season, or Preston or a few other clubs. 91304[/snapback] Actually I had Preston down for play-off contenders... people thought I was mad! As for us, I think we should be up there challenging for the play-offs, at the very least I would accept top ten, but that is only if I can see major on and off the field improvements. And Chandler if we DID make the play-offs would you come back on here and publicly apologise, or would you spout more crap about the days of Mr Adams?
Chandler Posted 11 April 2005 Author Posted 11 April 2005 There were no signs of Derby doing what they have done this season, or Preston or a few other clubs. 91304[/snapback] Actually I had Preston down for play-off contenders... people thought I was mad! As for us, I think we should be up there challenging for the play-offs, at the very least I would accept top ten, but that is only if I can see major on and off the field improvements. And Chandler if we DID make the play-offs would you come back on here and publicly apologise, or would you spout more crap about the days of Mr Adams? 91323[/snapback] ...only on the understanding that if we DON'T make the play offs you will publicly apologise for the crap that you have spouted about Levein? Fair deal?
Simon Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 Not the play-offs, but if we dont make the top 10, yes I will. I realise Rome was built in a day, and Levein isnt only building something, but rebuilding something from someone elses mess. But if we dont make the top ten the yes I will consider that failure.
TrickyTrev Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 In a word. No. If we are not challenging fr the play offs the fans will turn on levein as he has had time and money to bring in his own players and we should be able to contend for the play offs at least. I actually like most of the signings Levein has made and feel we are only a player or two away from being a good team. Pretty confident for next year if we get ina striker and a defencive mdfielder who will allow our creative players to get frward.
Chandler Posted 11 April 2005 Author Posted 11 April 2005 Not the play-offs, but if we dont make the top 10, yes I will. I realise Rome was built in a day, and Levein isnt only building something, but rebuilding something from someone elses mess. But if we dont make the top ten the yes I will consider that failure. 91342[/snapback] Knew you'd bottle it... I seem to remember a rubbish ex manager who only needed one season to get us promoted automatically with shit players, no signings and no money. Funny that...
TrickyTrev Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 Inheriting the ebst squad in the division by a long way. We were up againsta Sheffield Utd side with Steve Kabba up front that season. <_<
kenny Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 Mid-table would be tough to accept but i think i would accept it myself, because CL is genuinely building for the future at the moment. Under Adams we would have to say no, because an adams team would be retiring or out of contract in 6 months time. By the end of next season if we do not get promoted the mccarthy will still be only 22, hughes 24, maybury 27 etc. However they will all have had an extra years experience in the fizzy league, i think its important to give CL as much time at the club to 'show what he can build' as MA had. What we have to look at is what CL is doing here, would the club be in the same position in pre-season if MA was here as it is now CL is here. I would say yes in terms of league position but at least we have a core of players that a) have a contract next year and B) deserve a contract next year.
Simon Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 Not the play-offs, but if we dont make the top 10, yes I will. I realise Rome was built in a day, and Levein isnt only building something, but rebuilding something from someone elses mess. But if we dont make the top ten the yes I will consider that failure. 91342[/snapback] Knew you'd bottle it... I seem to remember a rubbish ex manager who only needed one season to get us promoted automatically with shit players, no signings and no money. Funny that... 91350[/snapback] Bottle it? No, its entirely consistent with my previous posts if you look...
kenny Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 Not the play-offs, but if we dont make the top 10, yes I will. I realise Rome was built in a day, and Levein isnt only building something, but rebuilding something from someone elses mess. But if we dont make the top ten the yes I will consider that failure. 91342[/snapback] Knew you'd bottle it... I seem to remember a rubbish ex manager who only needed one season to get us promoted automatically with shit players, no signings and no money. Funny that... 91350[/snapback] That ex-manager inherited some of another managers best signings (albeit not all), the key to our promotion push that year was Taggart, Elliott, Izzet and Walker, they were helped with a few key signings dickov deane et al, but the players were there to start with. A massive contrast to the ones CL inherited. Also all of O'Neills signings bar a few came from the lower leagues and so adapted well to life in the fizzy. Adams signings?? Dublin, Dabizas, Scowcroft etc all seem to have an air of 'i deserve to win this because i used to play in the prem and while im here shall i sign an autograph.' They have not adapted to this league at all well.
Guest Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 what HARD evidence is there to suggest that we could possibly mount a promotion challenge? 91278[/snapback] What HARD evidence is there to suggest we couldn't possibly mount a promotion challenge? Unless Chandler, you've got your crystal ball out again.......
reynard Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 chandler raises an interesting dilemma. the nearest situation we have had as a club to this is the year we only survived in this league because only two sides were relegated. The following season i believe we reached the play off final against blackburn. I don't think too many of us fans expected that at the end of the previous season. i think there was quite a clear out of "dead wood" then as well so anything is possible even if at the moment things don't look too clever. if in a years time we have not seen a dramatic improvement then i think Leveine may well desreve chandler's vitriol but i am prepared to give him until then.
Chandler Posted 11 April 2005 Author Posted 11 April 2005 Inheriting the ebst squad in the division by a long way. We were up againsta Sheffield Utd side with Steve Kabba up front that season. <_< 91353[/snapback] I think that Portsmouth might have something to say about that. And Forest too at the time. And the Blades reached two Cup semis with the likes of Tonge, Brown and Asaba. And while we're at it I seem to remember the gloom that descended when we won promotion. Nobody thought that we could possible survive in the Prem with the likes of Summerbee, Rogers, Benjamin Impey et al? Sorry, the current squad, even taking into account MDV is altogether a better one. But it is in P16 - 14 places below the promo side at the same stage of the season. I seem to recall that we were only two wins off a play spot when Adams resigned. For a coach of Levein's 'brilliance' that should have a piece of piss shouldn't it?
dog_4 Posted 11 April 2005 Posted 11 April 2005 Chandler doesn't think we have improved. well we are putting out a younger team and playing footy on the deck. Thats an improvement to me and levein has sed we are still a million miles away from what he wants. i tink we are improving all the time and can kick some ass next season. fresh faces and a pre season were levein can set up and build a deasent team and i tink we can win the league. adios peeps.
Chandler Posted 11 April 2005 Author Posted 11 April 2005 what HARD evidence is there to suggest that we could possibly mount a promotion challenge? 91278[/snapback] What HARD evidence is there to suggest we couldn't possibly mount a promotion challenge? Unless Chandler, you've got your crystal ball out again....... 91376[/snapback] The same crystal ball Lisa that I looked into when Adams left. What did I see? Championship struggle. What did you lot see? The Premiership. So who's wearing the rose tinted specs, Lisa? And now the hard evidence about why we won't mount a promotion challenge next season. In a word... Levein.
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