acooling08 Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 Probably not, but perhaps for offenders serving time for minimal offences. Definately not for murderers, rapists etc
lavrentis Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 A politician on the news summed it up perfectly 'those who break the law can't make the law'.
MikeyT Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 A politician on the news summed it up perfectly 'those who break the law can't make the law'. Totally agree.
Benji Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 The middle ground would be almost impossible to agree on, everyone has different moral affections to different offences maybe influenced by their own experiences as a victim etc So that leaves all or nothing, and for me its a resounding nothing. Although, the vote today will mean no change to the current law, which has been denounced by the ECtHR, so all that money we're saving on cuts and tax rises is going to now be spent on fines
Fosse Boy Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 I interviewed an ex-convict a few months ago and the way he saw it was that being sent to prison was the punishment, while the sentence itself should serve to help rehabilitate and turn people's lives around. Allowing prisoners the right to vote would help enhance their feeling of self-worth within society, rather than feeling apart from it. So innovations (not sure if that's the right word really but oh well) such as allowing convicts for lesser crimes the right to vote may help them to go out into society after their sentence is served with more desire to make something of their lives and less desire to stay in the cycle of re-offending. A politician on the news summed it up perfectly 'those who break the law can't make the law'. Hmmm, nice soundbite. Sure he was up late thinking that one up. Hardly works though does it. For starters I'd imagine every poster on this forum has broken the law at some point in their life, and secondly electing Members of Parliament in a representative democracy hardly constitutes "making the law". In his defence, it does rhyme.
Christoph Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 No. You lost your rights when you broke the law.
Leicester_Loyal Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 No they shouldn't. I'll prepare myself for the do-gooders that say they should.
MPH Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 I interviewed an ex-convict a few months ago and the way he saw it was that being sent to prison was the punishment, while the sentence itself should serve to help rehabilitate and turn people's lives around. Allowing prisoners the right to vote would help enhance their feeling of self-worth within society, rather than feeling apart from it. So innovations (not sure if that's the right word really but oh well) such as allowing convicts for lesser crimes the right to vote may help them to go out into society after their sentence is served with more desire to make something of their lives and less desire to stay in the cycle of re-offending. Hmmm, nice soundbite. Sure he was up late thinking that one up. Hardly works though does it. For starters I'd imagine every poster on this forum has broken the law at some point in their life, and secondly electing Members of Parliament in a representative democracy hardly constitutes "making the law". In his defence, it does rhyme. when people have served their time and have ' been rehabilitated back into society' then that might be a different issue altogether.... in all honesty i agree with the very catchy phrase that was used..
Fosse Boy Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 when people have served their time and have ' been rehabilitated back into society' then that might be a different issue altogether.... in all honesty i agree with the very catchy phrase that was used.. That's my point though, in the opinion of an ex-offender not enough is done on the inside to rehabilitate and make these guys feel like they have any worth within society. So, when their time is served and they're released they aren't fully functioning rehabilitated members of society and the cycle of re-offending is destined to repeat itself. Funnily enough the guy I interviewed also said he didn't believe the sentences for most crimes were long enough either, because they don't provide enough time to fully rehabilitate convicts.
Bellend Sebastian Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 The level of attention this is getting is frankly bizarre. As someone on the radio pointed out this morning, it's not as if the prison population are known for their political participation. I'm not saying whether or not they should have the vote, I don't give a toss, and I strongly suspect the majority of prisoners don't either
FoxyPV Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 It's just another way to disenfranchise the poor.
Captain... Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 No. You lost your rights when you broke the law. So you have never broken the law? Can someone clear something up for me, are ex-convicts allowed to vote? Reading the posts it looks like it's a no. I feel that your punishment is a removal of liberty, that includes some of your rights, but once you have served your sentence you should have those rights restored (obviously in some cases such as peadophilia they shouldn't be allowed to supervise children but these are the exceptions rather than the rule). When you consider that most politicians are less trustworthy than your average burglar, and the only reason that this is an issue is that they are trying to manipulate constituencies so that they get a better chance of winning the seat next time, it all seems a little hipocritical.
Guest BlueBrett Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 You don't go to prison these days unless you have done something pretty serious so I don't really think the 'depends on the severity of their crime' argument stacks up. I don't really know what it is like in prison. How much access to current affairs and news coverage do they have? There isn't much point in giving someone who is ignorant of the relevant issues the vote just for the sake of it or based on some lofty ideas about human rights. In truth I'm not really sure I care (my only concern would be that due to the poor education and outdated ideas about political identities likely to be held by many convicts The Labour party would enjoy a boost in support, but I realise that my preferences don't really have much bearing on the issue). The only other thing I would say is that I'm not really sure how it would work logistically. Would votes cast by prisoners register in the constituency where the prison is located or would their vote transfer to the place they lived before incarceration? The former would be ridiculous in my view because you would be left with a situation in which thousands of votes, which would ineveitably have a significant impact on the outcome, were being cast by people who never had lived and probably never would live in the area concerned.
acooling08 Posted 10 February 2011 Author Posted 10 February 2011 It's just another way to disenfranchise the poor. It's not really about wealth. I don't accept being poor as a reason to steal or break the law in other ways. Any person rich or poor can vote so long as they don't commit a crime. Would you really give the murderer that caused the argument, or any other murderer for that matter, the right to vote?
Houdini Logic Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 Only if they look like they're not going to vote Tory
MPH Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 That's my point though, in the opinion of an ex-offender not enough is done on the inside to rehabilitate and make these guys feel like they have any worth within society. So, when their time is served and they're released they aren't fully functioning rehabilitated members of society and the cycle of re-offending is destined to repeat itself. Funnily enough the guy I interviewed also said he didn't believe the sentences for most crimes were long enough either, because they don't provide enough time to fully rehabilitate convicts. that's a separate issue altogether.
m00nie Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 I interviewed an ex-convict a few months ago and the way he saw it was that being sent to prison was the punishment, while the sentence itself should serve to help rehabilitate and turn people's lives around. Allowing prisoners the right to vote would help enhance their feeling of self-worth within society, rather than feeling apart from it. So innovations (not sure if that's the right word really but oh well) such as allowing convicts for lesser crimes the right to vote may help them to go out into society after their sentence is served with more desire to make something of their lives and less desire to stay in the cycle of re-offending. instead of molly coddling the prisoners they should have a hard sharp shock treatment. would be a lot more effective in stopping them re offending and making them make something of there life.. prison is way to easy so its no deterrent at all. they should have no right to vote imo.
MPH Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 instead of molly coddling the prisoners they should have a hard sharp shock treatment. would be a lot more effective in stopping them re offending and making them make something of there life.. prison is way to easy so its no deterrent at all. they should have no right to vote imo. Valid point. Living here in the states and you often see prisoners walking the roads picking up litter wearing a big orange shirt with the words PRISONER on the back...
m00nie Posted 10 February 2011 Posted 10 February 2011 Valid point. Living here in the states and you often see prisoners walking the roads picking up litter wearing a big orange shirt with the words PRISONER on the back... where as here they would be too busy in there cells watching free tv, waiting to go to the free gym, whilst eating there free 3 meals a day, and getting to play pool n table tennis, in there clothes they dont have to wash themselves, eating there chocolate n sweets n smoking there cigarettes they bought from the money they had sent in from outside whilst complaing they cant vote...
Maybes Posted 11 February 2011 Posted 11 February 2011 A politician on the news summed it up perfectly 'those who break the law can't make the law'. This
acooling08 Posted 11 February 2011 Author Posted 11 February 2011 Not worth it Nah mate, make your argument. I'm interested to see how you will justify your point.
Zingari Posted 11 February 2011 Posted 11 February 2011 The level of attention this is getting is frankly bizarre. As someone on the radio pointed out this morning, it's not as if the prison population are known for their political participation. I'm not saying whether or not they should have the vote, I don't give a toss, and I strongly suspect the majority of prisoners don't either i agree , but they will be now that lawyers are seeking out huge compensation claims for them.( and huge fees for themselves ) i suspect that lawyers looking for a new gravy train are at the bottom of all this , not any great concern for human rights .
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