stockyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Author Posted 14 February 2011 Captain S. I understand and appreciate your reticence. However, I would take issue with some of your analyses of recent matches. The game at Ipswich should have been abandoned. Regardless of the fact that ‘it was the same for both teams’, it was a disgraceful decision to persist in playing, all because it was on Sky. Preston! We failed to get three points because, in my opinion, Sven got it wrong. We were totally on top until Sven decided to bring on three subs. Unfortunately, none of them picked up the pace of the game, although Howard nearly scored with his first header. Moussa hadn’t played for months – and it showed and Oakley failed to make any impact. The smooth flow was disrupted, we lost control and Hulme did what we all knew he could do. Sheffield! Are not a bad side. We didn’t struggle but we had to work bloody hard. As such, we saw just how strong and courageous our defence is becoming. Only weeks ago, we would have caved in. This time, we didn’t! My premise that we are now a mid to upper Premier League is based on seeing both matches against Man City, Preston, Sheffield Utd, Millwall and Derby and takes into account the current squad and recent acquisitions.
Corky Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Until we lose and then we are destined for League 1. Let's just enjoy the fact we are winning, playing attractive football and climbing the table. We don't need to get too far ahead of ourselves.
Far Post Gerry Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 We're all City fans so we know how it works; plenty of misplaced optimism followed by heartache. That said, this does feel a bit different. Who knows what we can achieve? But for now, we're an in-form Championship side with a chance of making the play offs - nothing more. Let's be happy with that for now and see where we are in 12 months time.
AmyLGK Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Come on now people - calm down! Yes we are playing some fantastic football at the moment and I'm loving this part of the ride - but lets not get ahead of ourselves - there is a hell of a long way to go yet! We should just take one game at a time! I've learnt that if I think one thing will happen, the opposite usually does! So I'm just going to remain my usual pessimistic self and enjoy the fact we're having this incredible run in 2011 and hope that it continues! And hope that the teams above us drop some points - but they are all doing too bloody well at the moment! And Leeds can just piss off! erm - sorry I digressed then - UP THE CITY! :scarf:
artursteppe Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Other teams being the same quality as us and having the same luck doesn't make us a mid PL team Are you confusing me with someone else? You have quoted me, but I have never claimed we are a top ten Premiership side.
artursteppe Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 OK everyone, get some perspective from the following:- League Table since Paulo Sousa got sacked on 1st October 2010 Played Points Leicester City 22 43 Nottingham Forest 20 41 Leeds United 21 38 Cardiff City 21 37 Norwich City 21 37 Q P R 21 36 Swansea City 22 35 Table for current form ( last 7 matches ) Played Points Leicester City 7 19 Nottingham Forest 7 19 Cardiff City 7 15 Q P R 7 13 Swansea City 7 13 Leeds United 7 12 Norwich City 7 12 It is very tight - it should be noted that of the last seven matches involving the top seven teams only four have been lost - Swansea lost 2, Leeds lost 1, Norwich lost 1. The others all unbeaten in last seven games. What can also, with some credibility be considered, as I stated earlier, is that all those teams ( perhaps with the exception of Forest at the moment ) are scrapping, but feeling the pressure.
artursteppe Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Just another thought from an optimist:- We have to play the current top four ( three away from home ). We are at home against Burnley ( currently in 8th ). All our other ten matches are against teams in the bottom half of the table.
FoxyPV Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 I wouldn't mind this optimism as much if all our players actually belonged to us, but unfortunately they don't so I'm going to temper my optimism for now. Playoffs are the still a distinct possibility but it would require us to keep the form until the end of the season and other teams around us having a dip which I just can't see happening.
ithuriel Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 until we are in the PL we are a decent championship team, to think we are a PL team already and we deserve to be there because of who we have in our team is slighly foolish. whether we go up this year or not at least we have played decent stuff and humiliated derby county, it would be nice if we were to do the same to forest.
Captain... Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 OK everyone, get some perspective from the following:- League Table since Paulo Sousa got sacked on 1st October 2010 Played Points Leicester City 22 43 Nottingham Forest 20 41 Leeds United 21 38 Cardiff City 21 37 Norwich City 21 37 Q P R 21 36 Swansea City 22 35 Table for current form ( last 7 matches ) Played Points Leicester City 7 19 Nottingham Forest 7 19 Cardiff City 7 15 Q P R 7 13 Swansea City 7 13 Leeds United 7 12 Norwich City 7 12 It is very tight - it should be noted that of the last seven matches involving the top seven teams only four have been lost - Swansea lost 2, Leeds lost 1, Norwich lost 1. The others all unbeaten in last seven games. What can also, with some credibility be considered, as I stated earlier, is that all those teams ( perhaps with the exception of Forest at the moment ) are scrapping, but feeling the pressure. That's all fantastic but the only table that matters is the one that puts us seventh. We can all manipulate stats to prove our points, I'm not sure we would look so good on form if we took the last 10 games. Putting us in the same bracket as Forest does not tell the whole story, they have only dropped points to QPR in the last 7 games. Us? We've dropped points to Preston, bottom of the table Preston. Don't read too much into the stats until we have played some of the big boys, and that will be happening very soon.
Bob Weasel Fox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 As much as I admire your optimism, let's not get ahead of ourselves. We've still got a hell of a lot of a hard work to do, not only to get into the Premier league, but to establish ourselves as a PL team once more. Very true, im trying to have loads of confidence about our situation as we are playing good football etc but lets not let ourselves get cocky as we will come back down to earth with a bump!
Captain... Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Just another thought from an optimist:- We have to play the current top four ( three away from home ). We are at home against Burnley ( currently in 8th ). All our other ten matches are against teams in the bottom half of the table. From the pessimist, it would be better to be playing all the top 6 so we can take the points off them that we need, (I'm an optimistic pessimist). Whereas you are a pessimistic optimist, if we are as good as the orignal poster says, then we should be relishing takng on the big boys and beating them, not being thankful most of the rest of our games are against bottom half teams. Just being argumentative for the sake of it on this one...
Bob Weasel Fox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 I don't feel in any way silly. What was said was that we'd need to produce Championship winning form between now and the end of the season to realistically finish within a very competitive top six. This at a time when we were throwing away points left, right and center and looking absolutely dreadful away from home. Who could have foreseen that we'd start 2011 as we have? Even you, the wildest of optimists, couldn't have seen this coming. We've been brilliant. I'd also like to remind you of the games we've got coming up and the fact we aren't actually in the play-offs. Don't misunderstand me, I hope desperately we go up - I'd love it. Nobody's said otherwise, nobody's "writing us off," people just recognize that it's a Herculean effort and we shouldn't be piling on ridiculous amounts of expectation. Bravo! Spot on! Lets keep the dream real and more than anything lets keep cheering the boys on until the final whistle of the final game. Up the Foxes
artursteppe Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 I wouldn't mind this optimism as much if all our players actually belonged to us, but unfortunately they don't so I'm going to temper my optimism for now. Playoffs are the still a distinct possibility but it would require us to keep the form until the end of the season and other teams around us having a dip which I just can't see happening. 15 games to go, and all the other teams, beside Forest, are having dips compared to us. I think I can explain all this pessimism - so many people when they were kids hoped for the special present for Christmas and birthdays, and were so often disappointed that now they just dare not hope too much in case they are hurt again. It's all perfectly understandable. However, I had those same disappointments, but they didn't shatter my dreams.
samjohnson Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 A win is a win... 3 points are 3 points that count towards the progression through the Championship... Even if it means the odd desperate performance - But they way we are passing the ball , keeping it down instead of playing hoof-ball to strikers that can't control lofted balls. Im happy with everything that Sven has done so far
artursteppe Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 From the pessimist, it would be better to be playing all the top 6 so we can take the points off them that we need, (I'm an optimistic pessimist). Whereas you are a pessimistic optimist, if we are as good as the orignal poster says, then we should be relishing takng on the big boys and beating them, not being thankful most of the rest of our games are against bottom half teams. Just being argumentative for the sake of it on this one... What? Of course we can beat the top four. We are better than them! What I am saying is We might even be able to win ALL our remaining matches. I AM AN OPTIMIST with no apologies!!!!!
Bob Weasel Fox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 From the pessimist, it would be better to be playing all the top 6 so we can take the points off them that we need, (I'm an optimistic pessimist). Whereas you are a pessimistic optimist, if we are as good as the orignal poster says, then we should be relishing takng on the big boys and beating them, not being thankful most of the rest of our games are against bottom half teams. Just being argumentative for the sake of it on this one... Im a pessemistic pessemist so we will finish 7th
luckyalex13 Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 i think we can beat any team in this division if we play like we did against the dirty rams, confident, classy, slick and solid at the back, but there is always that nagging thing there which most leiecster fans have that we will blow it at the death. i really hope not as i believe this is our year. it is just so tight this seaon for the play offs. IN SVEN WE TRUST!!
reynard Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 That's all fantastic but the only table that matters is the one that puts us seventh. We can all manipulate stats to prove our points, I'm not sure we would look so good on form if we took the last 10 games. Putting us in the same bracket as Forest does not tell the whole story, they have only dropped points to QPR in the last 7 games. Us? We've dropped points to Preston, bottom of the table Preston. Don't read too much into the stats until we have played some of the big boys, and that will be happening very soon. Actually the form table shows up some interesting facts. Based upon current 8 match sequences and IF carried on to the season's end the final table would look somehting like this. Forest 95 points qpr 84 swansea 83 leicester 83 norwich 82 Cardifff 82 leeds 76 If you look over a slightly longer period and take into account each sides last 5 home games and last 5 away games then multiply by the games each club has remaining at home and away then the final table could look like this forest 92 points qpr 88 points Norwich 85 Leicester 82 Swansea 79 Leeds 78 Cardiff 77 Hull 74 Basically it looks at this level as potentially being very close. Against us is the fact that we have to maintain our current level of form which has largely been established by playing lower ranked teams. We also have to hope that none of the top 6 improve their current form and thus increase their end point total. Personally I would be very (pleasantly) surprised if we can continue our current point per game ratio but I don't think it is that likely. Another stat aginst us is the record of the top 6 against sides in the lower half of the league. So far they have only lost 15 times between them all to sides in the lower half and I suspect we actually account for 4 of those (leeds away,swansea,Cardiff,Forest home) when I suspect we were in the bottom half. In the last 3 rounds of matches the top 6 have only lost one match to a side outside the top 6 (norwich at Milwall) which combined with the other stat suggests they are not going to drop many points from games not played against each other. There are sides who can make a difference who are not going to make the top 6 and for me the key games are not only those between the top 6 and between us and the top 6 but it is how many points will be dropped/gained at potentially tough away fixtures. for eg Crystal Palace Middlesborough Ipswich Doncaster Barnsley All these teams have decnet home records and could take points off the top 6 I suggest we need them to do so. We are an emerging team but are not the finished article and we still have ahell of a lot to do to even make the play offs let alone win them. Also currently Milwall are the form side at home so I'm very pleased we don't have to go there again this season.
Fox1651 Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Im a pessemistic pessemist so we will finish 7th im an optimistic optimist - we will overhaul Qpr and go up as champs
FoxyPV Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 15 games to go, and all the other teams, beside Forest, are having dips compared to us. I think I can explain all this pessimism - so many people when they were kids hoped for the special present for Christmas and birthdays, and were so often disappointed that now they just dare not hope too much in case they are hurt again. It's all perfectly understandable. However, I had those same disappointments, but they didn't shatter my dreams. Forest are on an amzing run of form. Granted the others in playoff positions aren't playing as well as us but they still have the advantage of their initial good start. I'm more concerned about Burnley and their run of reasonable form than those in front. i think we can beat any team in this division if we play like we did against the dirty rams, confident, classy, slick and solid at the back, but there is always that nagging thing there which most leiecster fans have that we will blow it at the death. i really hope not as i believe this is our year. it is just so tight this seaon for the play offs. IN SVEN WE TRUST!! We're not Forest
Captain... Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Actually the form table shows up some interesting facts.... Well then, we might as well not play the rest of the season and just get on with playoffs. (Sorry I'm in a flippant mood) What your calculations fail to take into account is the quality of opposition played in the last 10 games and the quality to be played. Also the fact that form is temporary. All you have really shown is that if we maintain this current form we will get in the playoffs, but we kinda know that anyway. We could still win the league, or we could fade away to mid table obscurity, but hopefully we will make the playoffs and then give a good account of ourselves, it would be nice to do over Cardiff in the Semi's then beat Forest in the final, but we will just have to wait and see.
OzFox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 we are no longer a good championship team. This is because we are now, in essence, a mid to upper Premier League team. That's an eye catching read, Stockyfox. I just hope you're not "Egg-on-face Fox" in a few weeks time. There's a long way to go yet
luckyalex13 Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Forest are on an amzing run of form. Granted the others in playoff positions aren't playing as well as us but they still have the advantage of their initial good start. I'm more concerned about Burnley and their run of reasonable form than those in front. We're not Forest
LCFC_FoRdY Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 We have an excellent side, with class premier league players (Aanholt, Bruma, Mee, Naughton especially) But i think there may be a problem with strikers, the yak is fabulous, but i think vassel may be a problem. We just need a Michael Owen, who goalhangs and scores crap, on the line touch-in's. If we get him then we would probably be good enough to establish ourselves in the premier league...
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