ADK Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 You have a strange definition of "subsistence quality of life". Maybe we are all too greedy and want too many unnecessary things. Somewhere to live with water and gas/electricity/internet access and enough money to buy food and essentials and a most basic level of entertainment would be my defininition.
MooseBreath Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 yeah you never take this place seriously, you and Moose could be besties really. I get the feeling this is a new look fif for 2013. Ice cool and enigmatic with a tough, brave edge. Don't worry, she'll be back to being an effeminate nonce in no time
Guest Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 yeah you never take this place seriously, you and Moose could be besties really. I take the place seriously, sure, otherwise I wouldn't waste so much of my free time here. I like throwing out ideas, reading responses, listening to others' ideas. I can get a little heated occasionally but within a few days I've forgotten the details and moved on. Moose happens to be a racist but even he makes some valid points on some topics. I don't hide the fact that I'm a socialist but my socialism isn't blind, I believe in a safety net but socialism goes hand in hand with the community working for the community not living off it.
Guest Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 Somewhere to live with water and gas/electricity/internet access and enough money to buy food and essentials and a most basic level of entertainment would be my defininition. And in return for that what should you give?
The People's Hero Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I take the place seriously, sure, otherwise I wouldn't waste so much of my free time here. I like throwing out ideas, reading responses, listening to others' ideas. I can get a little heated occasionally but within a few days I've forgotten the details and moved on. Moose happens to be a racist but even he makes some valid points on some topics. I don't hide the fact that I'm a socialist but my socialism isn't blind, I believe in a safety net but socialism goes hand in hand with the community working for the community not living off it. I said to someone recently about benefits people looking for work being put to work cleaning out drains (ours are all messed largely as a result of the amount of silt and grit (to melt/prevent ice) being washed down them, coupled with leaves etc. They were mortified. 'Would you want to do that job' they said? 'No,' I replied 'I have a job'. Those on benefits should be given jobs to benefit the community. Tidy communal areas, sweep streets, clean out drains, scrub graffiti off wall. The problem is many of them don't have the issue of not being able to find a job, they just don't like any sort of work full stop.
Finnegan Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 A ****ing socialist?! You've been dribbling more Daily Mail than Webbo in the last seventy two hours.
Guest Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I get the feeling this is a new look fif for 2013. Ice cool and enigmatic with a tough, brave edge. Don't worry, she'll be back to being an effeminate nonce in no time Racist and misogynistic. I keep forgetting about his demeaning views on women as though they are a second rate life form.
Guest Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 A ****ing socialist?! You've been dribbling more Daily Mail than Webbo in the last seventy two hours. I realise that's why you've been so antagonistic. I beleive in true socialism, where a community helps each other out, not one where those who have and do pay for those who don't but won't. I am a socialist who has lived through Thatcherism. The English benefits system was set up with great ideals but over time it has been abused by some/many. Maybe you have taken my comments as a reflection on the whole or the majority - they haven't been, they are on the abusive minority but that minority is crippling the institution of benefits. Social welfare is of great importance but not an excuse for people to live without working for the good of the community.
Guest Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I said to someone recently about benefits people looking for work being put to work cleaning out drains (ours are all messed largely as a result of the amount of silt and grit (to melt/prevent ice) being washed down them, coupled with leaves etc. They were mortified. 'Would you want to do that job' they said? 'No,' I replied 'I have a job'. Those on benefits should be given jobs to benefit the community. Tidy communal areas, sweep streets, clean out drains, scrub graffiti off wall. The problem is many of them don't have the issue of not being able to find a job, they just don't like any sort of work full stop. I have always believed that after a certain period of searching and training then the unemployed should work in the community - not only is it beneficial to the community but also beneficial to the individual who regains the methods and principles of work whilst gaining experience and showing abilities. The best argument against "community work" is that it takes jobs from those already working. Of course if everywhere in our cities was clean and our services efficient and perfect this would be a great argument but they aren't. However I am not suggesting slave labour/ subsidised workers. I'm suggesting work to aid the community for those who can't get work for the benefit of all.
The People's Hero Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I have always believed that after a certain period of searching and training then the unemployed should work in the community - not only is it beneficial to the community but also beneficial to the individual who regains the methods and principles of work whilst gaining experience and showing abilities. The best argument against "community work" is that it takes jobs from those already working. Of course if everywhere in our cities was clean and our services efficient and perfect this would be a great argument but they aren't. However I am not suggesting slave labour/ subsidised workers. I'm suggesting work to aid the community for those who can't get work for the benefit of all. Well, exactly. There are loads of arguments against it in principle and I expect judging by the amount of rubbish that Maidstone might be looking for a 'litter-clearer' or whatever as a real job, but the streets are a state so why not go for this? There are also loads of those environmental police type people who try to fine people for dropping a cigarette.
Webbo Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 A ****ing socialist?! You've been dribbling more Daily Mail than Webbo in the last seventy two hours. Don't drag me into this. I've been avoiding the political debates recently.
ADK Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 And in return for that what should you give? I would say nothing.
Finnegan Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 Don't drag me into this. I've been avoiding the political debates recently. I've been avoiding all debates for months. I've properly slipped lately.
The People's Hero Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I've been avoiding all debates for months. I've properly slipped lately. Is it still a debate if we all just regurgitate half-informed and ill-reasoned diatribe again and again whilst quoting each other but never really attempting to understand what others think or have to say? If so, I love debating.
Guest Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I would say nothing. So in your world people should be given a reasonable life without having to do anything. Why can't we all do that?
ADK Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 So in your world people should be given a reasonable life without having to do anything. Why can't we all do that? I don't believe that the majority of people would ever choose to do nothing though.
Trav Le Bleu Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I don't earn a bad salary, but I'm ok considering my overall package, if you like, which includes some benefits which make a direct comparison difficult, but I have had serious conversations with my wife about how we would be better off (we have kids) Sell them into slavery?
The People's Hero Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 Sell them into slavery? They will never have a dream of manumission if I don't, so really its the least I can do.
Finnegan Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 These threads need Daggers and Nick so I can just be lazy.and watch. Are they currently seconded to TB?
MooseBreath Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 I think a combination of mattp and flowwolf thoroughly russled their jimmies and they're currently hanging out in a cave on the edge of a cliff somewhere in the med, hosing each others naked bodies down with pumped sea water while they formulate excuses as to why they have been so soundly defeated, and eventually, I suppose, a plan of attack for returning to the forum. Although daggers is no doubt getting used to a daily length of back scratching.
Finnegan Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 You really should write for Mills and Boon, you're wasted here.
The People's Hero Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 You really should write for Mills and Boon, you're wasted here. Matt Mills and David Boon? I wonder if they would be a worse centre back partnership or opening partnership or comedy duo in the pub? Only one way to find out.
Rincewind Posted 4 January 2013 Author Posted 4 January 2013 All I get is £71 pw plus rates and rent. I do not consider that to be a small fortune as Moose says In fact I am gradually getting closer to my overdraft limit because the cost of living does not go down for the unemployed. They have to pay the same for a lot of things as those on a decent salary and I do not mean booze and fags. They cannot claim for gas and electricity which is rising all the time. This also hits low income families including those on tax credits which there are many. I just about exist. The daft thing is that in July I can claim pension credits which is nearly double JSA and still claim benefits and the it is quite legal. The Job centre people and their Govt dept will be happy that I am off their books and another dept will be giving me more for not working. DC will clap his hands with glee exclaiming the unemployment figures are down. I still won't live like a prince but I will be better off than now and if I budget the same as I have been doing who knows I might be able to go out more than once a month.
Daggers Posted 4 January 2013 Posted 4 January 2013 Some smaller people get off their arses and solve their own housing problems.
Rincewind Posted 4 January 2013 Author Posted 4 January 2013 Some people live in fantasy land and think solutions are easy.
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