Rincewind Posted 14 July 2015 Posted 14 July 2015 Well some of those proposals were also in the budget I think so it is connected weven if loosely. Of course if there is a thread specifically for that subject maybe a mod can move it tho the appropriate one or start a new thread. Even though some like to start a new topic thread for a slightest deviation but I try and look for the closest thread possible. Sorry if that upsets people
davieG Posted 14 July 2015 Posted 14 July 2015 Probably need a general politics thread, plenty of people post about politics regularly, not sure where else an article like this could go at the minute. Maybe there is one I've missed/forgotten about. Yeah I think we do actually. That's what this one was for http://www.foxestalk.co.uk/forums/topic/100556-post-election-blues/?hl=blues
Ollie93 Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 Not sure if this is the right thread, but views on this? Not sure if she is just plucking those figures out of this air but seems to have gathered a lot of publicity against Ian Duncan-smith.
Rincewind Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 Not sure if this is the right thread, but views on this? Not sure if she is just plucking those figures out of this air but seems to have gathered a lot of publicity against Ian Duncan-smith. The figures are from different sources. What annoys me about IDS is how he pours scorn over this sort of thing. He has even refused to meet reps of the Trussel Trust Shelter and other organisation and just uses his own contacts for figures. If he does not even listen to what others have to say how the hell can he form an opinion. He is also conceited in the way he thinks he is always right and everone else wrong. She is saying something and he is just smirking. Something that grinds my gears in people. There are also a number MP's (Labour and Lib Dem included) that rent out their second homes and claim back as expenses as they are not now allowed to claim on the mortgage. IDS overspent on his expenses card over a few months then he says that anyone can live on £7 a day. Not if he pays £35 for a breakfast he couldnt. What about electric gas transport rent/mortgage toiletries etc? And for someone with an illness or disabilitiy there are many drugs and medice not available on the NHS. There are people that cannot walk far so have to use public transport.
Darkon84 Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 The figures are from different sources. What annoys me about IDS is how he pours scorn over this sort of thing. He has even refused to meet reps of the Trussel Trust Shelter and other organisation and just uses his own contacts for figures. If he does not even listen to what others have to say how the hell can he form an opinion. He is also conceited in the way he thinks he is always right and everone else wrong. She is saying something and he is just smirking. Something that grinds my gears in people. Very nice of you to form your own opinion of him there without meeting him, especially following the previous sentence highlighted . The figures do sound slightly plucked from the air, with even Hislop questioning them. IDS didn't seem to be smirking either, he was taken aback and attempting to question allegations being thrown at him. Come on Rincey, you're as blinkered as the 'people who think the sun shines out of Cameron's arse', as I think you put it in the foxhunting thread. EDIT: That QT was June 2014 anyway, so I'm not entirely sure it still holds the same relevance?
Rincewind Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 Very nice of you to form your own opinion of him there without meeting him, especially following the previous sentence highlighted . The figures do sound slightly plucked from the air, with even Hislop questioning them. IDS didn't seem to be smirking either, he was taken aback and attempting to question allegations being thrown at him. Come on Rincey, you're as blinkered as the 'people who think the sun shines out of Cameron's arse', as I think you put it in the foxhunting thread. No. She works in the sector that involves meeting these people. He does not so if he does not converse with these people how can he know different. A few more stories here. If it was just one organisation or charity where these figures were coming from I would agree that they could be plucked from the air but I have met people who work with vulnerable people who have said the same. I am not one to bury my head in the sand and pretend these things do not happen.
Darkon84 Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 No. She works in the sector that involves meeting these people. He does not so if he does not converse with these people how can he know different. A few more stories here. If it was just one organisation or charity where these figures were coming from I would agree that they could be plucked from the air but I have met people who work with vulnerable people who have said the same. I am not one to bury my head in the sand and pretend these things do not happen. Still, let's not form opinions on people we haven't met eh? Mental Health covers quite a broad spectrum as well. I know people in that sector who have to deal with r@pists and murders, does that make them an expert on crime prevention? If every MP had to meet every single person from every walk of life in order to be able to give an opinion, they'd never get anything done. Every person has different circumstances particular to themselves. What do you suggest? Say IDS met these people you're saying he should have. Would you listen to what he has to say then? What about the next people and the next? Where do you draw the line.
Guest MattP Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 That video was from over a year ago and virtually all the figures she claimed turned out to be bollocks.
Sir Fynwy Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 I'd just like to thank all of you who are losing money based on the budget cuts for the extra few quid I'm saving on my tax bill.
Guest MattP Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 I'd just like to thank all of you who are losing money based on the budget cuts for the extra few quid I'm saving on my tax bill. No problem at all to be the position you are in you must have worked damn hard and made some serious sacrifices.
Sir Fynwy Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 I can see you've replied MattP but since I put you on ignore I don't have to read what you post.
Guest MattP Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 I can see you've replied MattP but since I put you on ignore I don't have to read what you post. No problem I was just saying no worries as you must have worked hard giving the responsibilities you have, you should be keeping a bit extra, it is your money after all. I'm sure you did read what I put though.
Guest MattP Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 Although if you (or anyone for that matter) do earn a few quid and feel guily about it wanting to pay more to help the worse off then no one should be stopping you, there are thousands of charites out there dedicated to helping them, just give the extra to them, they'll probably do a better job of it as well. You shouldn't need governments to reditribute your wealth, people should be capable of doing it themselves.
leicsmac Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 Although if you (or anyone for that matter) do earn a few quid and feel guily about it wanting to pay more to help the worse off then no one should be stopping you, there are thousands of charites out there dedicated to helping them, just give the extra to them, they'll probably do a better job of it as well. You shouldn't need governments to reditribute your wealth, people should be capable of doing it themselves. You'd think so and in an ideal world I'd agree with you, but the world around us means (for the most part) sadly not. Altruism is still something alien to the evolutionary principle and as much as I love the idea of universal free will, self-interest is still a pretty overriding force. Unfortunate really, because we're probably the one species that's actually aware of this conflict and therefore able to do something about it. People need to have something directly affecting themselves before they take direct action that might disadvantage them. Of course there are a few exceptions, but they're in the minority for the most part. I don't know - perhaps there might be something in the future that comes along that gives humans as a whole a little perspective, but we'll see.
davieG Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 You'd think so and in an ideal world I'd agree with you, but the world around us means (for the most part) sadly not. Altruism is still something alien to the evolutionary principle and as much as I love the idea of universal free will, self-interest is still a pretty overriding force. Unfortunate really, because we're probably the one species that's actually aware of this conflict and therefore able to do something about it. People need to have something directly affecting themselves before they take direct action that might disadvantage them. Of course there are a few exceptions, but they're in the minority for the most part. I don't know - perhaps there might be something in the future that comes along that gives humans as a whole a little perspective, but we'll see. Or a facebook campaign. that usually gets people donating by the bucketful even if it's not the most worthy cause.
Sir Fynwy Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 You'd think so and in an ideal world I'd agree with you, but the world around us means (for the most part) sadly not. Altruism is still something alien to the evolutionary principle and as much as I love the idea of universal free will, self-interest is still a pretty overriding force. Unfortunate really, because we're probably the one species that's actually aware of this conflict and therefore able to do something about it. People need to have something directly affecting themselves before they take direct action that might disadvantage them. Of course there are a few exceptions, but they're in the minority for the most part. I don't know - perhaps there might be something in the future that comes along that gives humans as a whole a little perspective, but we'll see. I do plenty of volunteering and support a few good causes of my choice, I just don't understand how taking money from people with very little and giving it to me has a positive effect on our society in general, however the working poor's loss is Cancer Research or my local pubs gain.
Frank to be Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 Had a funny chat at work yesterday with a couple of one party contractors, tory boys, who are now pig sick that this budget means they'll have to pay a few thousand pound per year more in tax. It's only fair that they'll pay more similar levels of tax as employees, but did find it funny that the tories have trumpeted their job creation, much of it the self employed, and sold themselves as the party of 'get up and go', and have then gone an laid down some seriously punitive measures on independent self employed people. The tory boys at work are fuming
Guest MattP Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 Haven't you pretty much just agreed with the Tories reasoning (despite probably not intending too) in that last sentence you have written? The argument they put forward to cut the top rate of tax is so people spend more money and that in turn helps jobs, businesses etc which spending extra money down the pub would do.
Stadt Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 I start reading leicsmac's post and I just have to give up, I've got nothing against him but I can't be arsed to google what 3 or 4 words mean every time he posts
leicsmac Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 Or a facebook campaign. that usually gets people donating by the bucketful even if it's not the most worthy cause. I think people are becoming inured to even that now. Too many 'not the most worthy' causes. I do plenty of volunteering and support a few good causes of my choice, I just don't understand how taking money from people with very little and giving it to me has a positive effect on our society in general, however the working poor's loss is Cancer Research or my local pubs gain. Totally agree with that. I start reading leicsmac's post and I just have to give up, I've got nothing against him but I can't be arsed to google what 3 or 4 words mean every time he posts I'm sorry man, that's me being a daft academic and teacher. Too much time reading and writing papers and other stuff and not enough getting out and actually having fun.
Darkon84 Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 I start reading leicsmac's post and I just have to give up, I've got nothing against him but I can't be arsed to google what 3 or 4 words mean every time he posts I suggest you have a read of the encyclopedic implementation, of a pre-meditated orchestration of demotic Anglo-Saxon. I'll be sure to offer you my most enthusiastic contrafibularities afterwards
Webbo Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 I'd just like to thank all of you who are losing money based on the budget cuts for the extra few quid I'm saving on my tax bill. You've earned it, good luck to you.
Stadt Posted 15 July 2015 Posted 15 July 2015 I suggest you have a read of the encyclopedic implementation, of a pre-meditated orchestration of demotic Anglo-Saxon. I'll be sure to offer you my most enthusiastic contrafibularities afterwards nah
Rincewind Posted 16 July 2015 Posted 16 July 2015 I asked my doctor about electrical engibeering and he said I should ask my hairdresser.
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