England Portugal match thread.

[AKCJ]

Oh yeah, how stupid of me.

 

That one game alone shows us that we are at least as good, if not better than the world champions.

 

Almost as if we didnt get totally fvcked over 2-0 in the first half too.

 

Funny how a diamond vs Turkey and Portugal looks absolutely abject isnt it.

 

AKCJ for England manager. Hes always right.

 

 

go to bed, you've had enough.

[Donut]

go to bed mate

 

Nope.

 

Its incredible. The formation has proven to be absolute rubbish already.

 

Lord knows what instructions youd give them going onto the pitch.

[AKCJ]

Nope.

 

Its incredible. The formation has proven to be absolute rubbish already.

 

Lord knows what instructions youd give them going onto the pitch.

 

lol

 

How is it proven to be more rubbish than any other formation we've played?

 

We've been awful in all of these warm up games bar the half an hour we played that formation and we bossed the world champions.

 

Out of interest, who would you play?

[Donut]

lol

 

How is it proven to be more rubbish than any other formation we've played?

 

We've been awful in all of these warm up games bar the half an hour we played that formation and we bossed the world champions.

 

Out of interest, who would you play?

 

Id have to go something like this:

 

 

-------------------------Hart

 

Clyne------Smalling--------Cahill------------Rose

 

----------------Dier-----------Wilshere

 

Lallana------------Alli/Rooney-------------Sterling

 

-------------------------Kane

 

There is no way of utlising Kane AND Vardy as a partnership successfully that ive seen so far.

 

Kyle Walker shouldnt be anywhere near the team. He cannot defend.

 

If the team wants to play a possession based game, which it looks like its the way forward, Vardy's over the top threat isnt there anyway and i dont want to see him playing wide left.

 

Lallana and Sterling have had some positive influence today, and Sterling is one of the few with a direct running style that can cause problems too.

 

Id favour Alli as the number 10. Could play him in front of Wilshere

[AKCJ]

 

Give over you wum.

[Donut]

 

Give over you wum.

 

Every club except Leicester plays a system like this, the diamond throughout the friendlies has been piss poor, the tournament will be piss poor, and we can get a new manager.

[AKCJ]

Every club except Leicester plays a system like this, the diamond throughout the friendlies has been piss poor, the tournament will be piss poor, and we can get a new manager.

 

How can you say that it has been poor when we've played it once (for half an hour) and we've scored three past Germany?

[Donut]

How can you say that it has been poor when we've played it once (for half an hour) and we've scored three past Germany?

 

Played it v Turkey and was crap. Played it tonight and it was crap.

 

You think when it comes to tournament football, teams are gonna slap 3 past Germany?

[AKCJ]

Played it v Turkey and was crap. Played it tonight and it was crap.

 

You think when it comes to tournament football, teams are gonna slap 3 past Germany?

No we didn't?

 

We've played a 4-3-3 today.

[Donut]

No we didn't?

 

We've played a 4-3-3 today.

 

Course we didnt.

 

It was MEANT to be a diamond, it ended up as fvck all with strikers playing as defensive midfielders.

[Donut]

And theyd play as defensive wide men in the tournament too

[AKCJ]

Course we didnt.

 

It was MEANT to be a diamond, it ended up as fvck all with strikers playing as defensive midfielders.

 

We played a 4-3-3.

 

Perhaps if you opened your eyes and actually watched football matches then people would take your opinions seriously.

 

This debate is just fueling the forum's opinion of you. You don't have a clue.

[Legend_in_blue]

I honestly think if you asked 50 people coming out of the stadium tonight what formation was played in that game, you'd get 50 unique answers to your question.

You can call it what you like, I'll just go with Woy's total shambles of a system, formation whatever. It was clueless.

[Donut]

We played a 4-3-3.

 

Perhaps if you opened your eyes and actually watched football matches then people would take your opinions seriously.

 

This debate is just fueling the forum's opinion of you. You don't have a clue.

 

The whole forum? youre the only one that follows my every post like some sad stalker twat.

 

They ended up 4-3-3 because Kane and Vardy ended up playing as defenders. They were picked to play as strikers with a man behind them in the number 10 role.

 

Thats a diamond.

 

Dier was picked as a holding player. The base of the diamond.

 

Our one good bit of play came tonight when we played with some width. There aint no width in playing a diamond. Not unless you want to expose two average full backs.

 

Weve got a lemon in charge, a lemon coach who failed at Valencia, a lemon in Lewington who stands on the sidelines shouting his headoff and having no impact whatsoever, and were going to look awful in the tournament

[Dan]

I feel sorry for Vardy because I think he's yet another victim of the closed shop mentality that pollutes this England side. There's a really backwards mentality about this England side. It's like an arrogance, almost. From the off Vardy has been played out of position, been given different instructions to what he plays so well at Leicester, and yet when his flaws are exposed we see that as a reason to knock him, to drop him from the side, to say he's worse than Rashford (who I'm getting absolutely sick of the overhyping) etc... Hodgson even said something about him needing to prove himself on the left - why? What benefit is that to Vardy or Hodgson himself? Vardy is a limited player, everyone knows that, Vardy knows it himself - that's why he's modelled his game around making the most of what he is good at and he's done it so well that he's become a real weapon. Hodgson would rather snub that, and would rather put him in a weaker position almost to prove that he's less deserving of a forward role than Kane or Rooney.

 

Kane's another point tonight - I thought that system was absolutely awful. No balance what so ever, no creativity, no spark, damper than a dishcloth, and Rooney's central position forced Vardy & Kane out wide and guess what, Kane was awful. Just like the mistake we made when we had him on loan here, we nullified what strengths he has and tried to get him to do more than he's capable of. Kane isn't blessed with a load of skill or creativity himself and it showed. He's similar to Vardy in the sense that he's got limitations to his game, and England almost went out of their way to expose them. I doubt that'll be the case again with Kane though, because we've decided he's our forward for the next 10 years no matter what he does now. Sturridge is another, undroppable no matter how he performs.

 

Everything about the England set up is rotten. The manager is an idiot, the FA are a shambles more bothered about pandering to sponsors than winning trophies and no-one seems to have the desire to change things. The players as well, a lot of them know they're in no matter what they do - what good is that for motivation to anyone? It tells certain players they don't have to try and others that they can try all they want, there's only one winner.

 

People like to hide behind the patriotism side of things, and I am proud to be English, I want my country to show balls and get countries envying the way we go about our business, and I don't want the team to fail because I know of the amount of people who'll be going out there having potentially the best few weeks of their lives, they're optimistic football fans at the end of the day and I can't knock them, but seriously I won't shed a tear when we're knocked out in France. We deserve everything we get and I'm truly fed up of it.

[AKCJ]

The whole forum? youre the only one that follows my every post like some sad stalker twat.

 

They ended up 4-3-3- because Kane and Vardy ended up playing as defenders. They were picked to play as strikers with a man behind them in the number 10 role.

 

Thats a diamond.

 

Our one good bit of play came tonight when we played with some width. There aint no width in playing a diamond. Not unless you want to expose two average full backs.

 

We played a 4-3-3 because Vardy and Kane were out wide and Rooney was down the middle up front.

 

Clear as day.

[Larry_LCFC]

No wonder the players look confused to **** when we can't even decide what formation we're playing. No clear direction at all.

[DJ Barry Hammond]

Played it v Turkey and was crap. Played it tonight and it was crap.

 

You think when it comes to tournament football, teams are gonna slap 3 past Germany?

The diamond is a very difficult formation to pull off, I will give you that, but given the squad that's been picked Roy best hope it works - yet that will only work if it's employed correctly.

For a start, the defence need to press higher, so the midfield have less space to cover. The full backs would also sit a little higher in a defensive position and the tip of the diamond would sit into midfield to make a 3 defensively so the strikers can work as a two to close down the edges of the defense in an attempt to prevent a quick switch of flank that will kill you.

The other key is that the tip of diamond doesn't just stand at the tip of the diamond in an attacking sense - that player does a lot more in wider areas, given he's got the licence to do that and the lack of width the formation gives you - it's no good having just fullbacks giving you width because it means as soon as you get the ball out to them the ball has to come back inside, making if easy to defend against.

Now having seen the Euro 96 England line up, we could effectively try to copy that like this;

Hart

Walker - Smalling - Bertrand

- Stones -

Alli - Henderson - Wilshire - Sterling

Kane - Vardy (or Rooney if we must)

When you look back, it was very interesting to see how Southgate was employed in that tournament and my feeling is Stones could be quite effective doing the same type of thing.

The thing I like about this formation and a similar one used by Bobby Robson in Italia 90 is that is has a defined structure, but easily morphs into different looks in both attack and defence. The down side with trying to use these now is that there was clearly a fair amount of work that went into them on the training pitch to make them effective.

[Donut]

We played a 4-3-3 because Vardy and Kane were out wide and Rooney was down the middle up front.

 

Clear as day.

 

I think the poster below said it all.

 

You see things like no one else does, but your holier than thou attitude leads you to believe youre the oracle. You arent.

 

The team was picked as a diamond, if were going with the round pegs outlook.

 

It ended up looking like play wherever you like, because the diamond tonight was a shambles.

[Donut]

The diamond is a very difficult formation to pull off, I will give you that, but given the squad that's been picked Roy best hope it works - yet that will only work if it's employed correctly.

For a start, the defence need to press higher, so the midfield have less space to cover. The full backs would also sit a little higher in a defensive position and the tip of the diamond would sit into midfield to make a 3 defensively so the strikers can work as a two to close down the edges of the defense in an attempt to prevent a quick switch of flank that will kill you.

The other key is that the tip of diamond doesn't just stand at the tip of the diamond in an attacking sense - that player does a lot more in wider areas, given he's got the licence to do that and the lack of width the formation gives you - it's no good having just fullbacks giving you width because it means as soon as you get the ball out to them the ball has to come back inside, making if easy to defend against.

Now having seen the Euro 96 England line up, we could effectively try to copy that like this;

Hart

Walker - Smalling - Bertrand

- Stones -

Alli - Henderson - Wilshire - Sterling

Kane - Vardy (or Rooney if we must)

When you look back, it was very interesting to see how Southgate was employed in that tournament and my feeling is Stones could be quite effective doing the same type of thing.

The thing I like about this formation and a similar one used by Bobby Robson in Italia 90 is that is has a defined structure, but easily morphs into different looks in both attack and defence. The down side with trying to use these now is that there was clearly a fair amount of work that went into them on the training pitch to make them effective.

 

Good post.

[DJ Barry Hammond]

Good post.

And to be clear - at times it looked like a 4-3-3 because of how far Rooney was pushing forward, but I don't think that was the designed instruction, given how Sterling played it as he came on, before being moved out wide.

At least tonight was a tactical first - Germany pioneered the inverted fullbacks, we tonight pioneered the inverted defensive forwards. Don't think it will catch on - if you play forwards with the intention they will score you goals, you want to get them more touches inside the box - I can't think of many that Vardy or Kane had or real chances that fell there way (Rooney was in the way for a couple, appearing like a third striker).

[Donut]

You can see just how weak Hodgson is as manager, he has players like Kane and Vardy, he thinks i absolutely have to pick these players because theyve scored loads of goals this season, so i absolutely have to pick them

 

But then i absolutely have to pick Rooney, hes my captain and tallisman, so i have to have all three of them involved.

 

But in doing that, i have to also pick Alli because hes the golden boy in the team and the surprise package and if i left him out, the public would be asking serious questions as to what im doing.

 

But hang on, someones already in Alli's position. Oh well, he has to be in somewhere.

 

But I also have to fit someone like Wilshere in somewhere, because ive took him to the tournament off the back of no football all season. So if i dont play him, people are going to be saying its a waste of a player in the squad.

 

So ill just throw everyone together into whatever formation will accomodate them, no matter how bad the performances are as a team, or how out of position or uncomfortable the individual players are with their roles, so at least i can say they were all on the pitch and we were "giving it a go" and playing to our individual quality strengths.

 

Its absolutely crap.

 

If we were going to play like we were tonight, just get Vardy off the pitch. 20+ goals or not. Get someone on like Sterling who will run both ways and offer some proper width.

 

Get Kane through the middle if it means sacrificing Rooney, do it.

 

If it means making the team structually better with a less talented player, just do it.

[AKCJ]

I think the poster below said it all.

 

You see things like no one else does, but your holier than thou attitude leads you to believe youre the oracle. You arent.

 

The team was picked as a diamond, if were going with the round pegs outlook.

 

It ended up looking like play wherever you like, because the diamond tonight was a shambles.

 

 

We didn't play a diamond tonight.

 

Anyone with half a brain cell can work that out (you'll need help with that). That's nothing to do with a "holier than thou attitude". It's just speaking the truth.

[Donut]

And to be clear - at times it looked like a 4-3-3 because of how far Rooney was pushing forward, but I don't think that was the designed instruction, given how Sterling played it as he came on, before being moved out wide.

At least tonight was a tactical first - Germany pioneered the inverted fullbacks, we tonight pioneered the inverted defensive forwards. Don't think it will catch on - if you play forwards with the intention they will score you goals, you want to get them more touches inside the box - I can't think of many that Vardy or Kane had or real chances that fell there way (Rooney was in the way for a couple, appearing like a third striker).

 

Yep,agreed totally. The intention was not what we got tonight. Rooney was trying to play as the "shadow striker" if you like, if youre talking in say football manager terms, and he played the role quite well individually, but it was at the detriment of the team

[AKCJ]

And to be clear - at times it looked like a 4-3-3 because of how far Rooney was pushing forward, but I don't think that was the designed instruction, given how Sterling played it as he came on, before being moved out wide.

At least tonight was a tactical first - Germany pioneered the inverted fullbacks, we tonight pioneered the inverted defensive forwards. Don't think it will catch on - if you play forwards with the intention they will score you goals, you want to get them more touches inside the box - I can't think of many that Vardy or Kane had or real chances that fell there way (Rooney was in the way for a couple, appearing like a third striker).

 

 

We were playing a 4-3-3 and then Sterling and Lallana came on and we played a 4-2-3-1.

 

Come on lads, this isn't technical stuff. Anybody who saw the game could work that out.