Defending to Deep?

[demon_dog]

Once again on Saturday we fail to hold onto a lead due to poor defending.

As is so often the case we take the lead then the longer the game goes on we seem to drop back deeper and deeper to defend constantly inviting the opposition onto us.

Will Gerry Taggart be able to sort out this problem we've had for the last few seasons?

Is it the quality of our defenders that lets us down?

Is it because we panic?

Or is it just a lack of confidence that we can win games if we try?

How do you set about correcting such a problem, you can't go onto the pitch and kick their *rses forward.

You can shout, rant and rave from the touchline, (can they hear you above the noise of the crowd)

Should the team captain be a defender who will give a well earned bo**ocking to anyone not doing as their told.

As I say it's a problem that needs sorting, can Gerry do it?

[Manwell Pablo]

We defend deep because A) we have a lack of pace at the back and B) Thats the way ahuhuh Gary likes it ahuhuh.

If we added some pace, maybe putting Chambers in a right back, we'd probabley be able to defend higher up the pitch.

[Wils]

I hate the fact that we bring everyone back for a corner,weve been doing it for years its stupid. Even QPR didnt have everyone back,when we clear it we put our selfs right under pressure again this really annoys me especially when were playing at home,maybe if its in the last few minutes or whatever.

As Mablo said a lack of pace is why we defend deep, we just encourage teams even more to rape our defensive which is quite and easy job.

[Thracian]

Once again on Saturday we fail to hold onto a lead due to poor defending.

As is so often the case we take the lead then the longer the game goes on we seem to drop back deeper and deeper to defend constantly inviting the opposition onto us.

Will Gerry Taggart be able to sort out this problem we've had for the last few seasons?

Is it the quality of our defenders that lets us down?

Is it because we panic?

Or is it just a lack of confidence that we can win games if we try?

How do you set about correcting such a problem, you can't go onto the pitch and kick their *rses forward.

You can shout, rant and rave from the touchline, (can they hear you above the noise of the crowd)

Should the team captain be a defender who will give a well earned bo**ocking to anyone not doing as their told.

As I say it's a problem that needs sorting, can Gerry do it?

No defence is impregnable if they fall back as a tactic and have no attacking outlets if they win possession.

And if you fail to close people down 30 yards from goal they are always likely to score.

The first part is down to the manager, the second the players will well know about already and has to go down as a lack of communication concentration quite possible brought about by the unnecessary team changes which unsettled a previously smooth-running team.

Both problems are simply sorted - or prolonged if the manager doesn't accept that he, or his staff, got it wrong.

[MPH]

im not saying its perfect, its just not our biggest problem....

we seem to have the players in MID and up front but but to get them working together is another thing...

I think one reason why we may play too deep is that its easy to get past our midfield....

[Fez of Mahrez]

We get caught all the time when we push up - notably against Plymouth when Ebanks-Blake kept getting in behind McAuley and Kisnorbo and even once or twice on Saturday. That's the risk you run by fielding two slow centre-backs - and we don't even have a pacy alternative at centre-back anyway.

It wasn't the defending deep that was the problem on Saturday, it was the closing down. Sheehan is awful at it. Porter doesn't seem to think it's important. Chambers was the worst of the lot. Even Bruno had an off-day. Don't get me started on the space afforded Leigertwood for his goal.

[Jimmy]

and we don't even have a pacy alternative at centre-back anyway.

Stearmans quite fast aint he, albeit untried at CB in the league

[Fez of Mahrez]

Stearmans quite fast aint he, albeit untried at CB in the league

He's never struck me as particularly quick, and I certainly don't think he should be anywhere near our first team at the moment. Sorry Rich.

[The People's Hero]

Defending deep is ok if

a) Your midfield and forward line are in the right place too, not leaving huge swathes of space, isolating the backline.

b) There are options in terms of distribution (often an outlet like a bigman to hold it up, or some pacy wingers who will chase everything) - yes, that's chase, Levi.

[Kilworthfox]

Our concentration levels have been pathetic in the last 10 minutes of a game since O'Neil left!

[Manwell Pablo]

He's never struck me as particularly quick, and I certainly don't think he should be anywhere near our first team at the moment. Sorry Rich.

Stearman! He's gangley, The on rushing midfielder with a cracking shot on him might pause to piss himself at his chimp like lankey apperance. This could help.

Sorry Rich, if you add James on Facebook I'll take it back.

[The People's Hero]

Stearman! He's gangley, The on rushing midfielder with a cracking shot on him might pause to piss himself at his chimp like lankey apperance. This could help.

Sorry Rich, if you add James on Facebook I'll take it back.

He's added me.

He just won't respond to my message.

Thus I fear Thracian will never be in receipt of Levi's signed 'support' shorts.

[Thracian]

Defending deep is ok if

a) Your midfield and forward line are in the right place too, not leaving huge swathes of space, isolating the backline.

b) There are options in terms of distribution (often an outlet like a bigman to hold it up, or some pacy wingers who will chase everything) - yes, that's chase, Levi.

If you believe the likes fo Kisnorbo will consistently pass the ball from deep defence to the flanks you really are an optimist. I'd put a ban on Kisnorbo passing more than 10 yards if I were his manager.

As for hit and chase, forget it. Total waste of time. You've already dismissed the only pacey player we've got. And without players of exceptional pace the defender should always win - and if they don't then it would be time for whoever to change their defenders.

Defending deep as a general tactic is a totally unnecessary risk.

Off bowling now.

[Manwell Pablo]

If you believe the likes fo Kisnorbo will consistently pass the ball from deep defence to the flanks you really are an optimist. I'd put a ban on Kisnorbo passing more than 10 yards if I were his manager.

As for hit and chase, forget it. Total waste of time. You've already dismissed the only pacey player we've got. And without players of exceptional pace the defender should always win - and if they don't then it would be time for whoever to change their defenders.

Defending deep as a general tactic is a totally unnecessary risk.

Off bowling now.

Defending how up the pitch is a bigger risk

Espiecally when you don't have the players to implement such a tactic.

I personally think we should find a happy medium.

[The People's Hero]

If you believe the likes fo Kisnorbo will consistently pass the ball from deep defence to the flanks you really are an optimist. I'd put a ban on Kisnorbo passing more than 10 yards if I were his manager.

As for hit and chase, forget it. Total waste of time. You've already dismissed the only pacey player we've got. And without players of exceptional pace the defender should always win - and if they don't then it would be time for whoever to change their defenders.

Defending deep as a general tactic is a totally unnecessary risk.

Off bowling now.

You like to employ rhetoric to suggest you understand the game but it is so so clear that your understanding of the game operates on an almost school playground level.

We have to defend fairly deep due to the lack of pace across the backline.

Your comments about the distribution of Kisnorbo are noted, but if you read my post, you'll see that one of the conditions I list is that the midfield and forward line position itself correctly as not to leave huge gaps. This would leave a simple ball on from the centre halves to Clemence/Weso/Kishishev, providing they make themselves available.

This is all immaterial anyway, you just have a big chip on your shoulder about Porter's poor form. We won't get any sensible discussion out of you as you're just not capable of it when you're in this sort of mood.

[Fez of Mahrez]

Defending how up the pitch is a bigger risk

Espiecally when you don't have the players to implement such a tactic.

I personally think we should find a happy medium.

Mystic Meg always looked quite smiley.

[The People's Hero]

Mystic Meg always looked quite smiley.

[Kilworthfox]

Mystic Meg always looked quite smiley.

Mystic Meg and Russel Grant at CB for me now

[Daggers]

It was an outstanding strike.

Sometimes teams deserve to score, that was worth a goal.

[Fez of Mahrez]

It was an outstanding strike.

Sometimes teams deserve to score, that was worth a goal.

I love you Daggers (ginger snaps) but really... that is so wrong. We let them knock it about like they were warming up before he hit it (with no-one closing him down).

[Daggers]

I love you Daggers (ginger snaps) but really... that is so wrong. We let them knock it about like they were warming up before he hit it (with no-one closing him down).

The problem did not lie in a defence being TOO (God that's been annoying me) deep or otherwise. From the minute we put a right back on the wing and sent Hume back up front the whole side went to 6's and 7's. Then putting a slow defensive midfield player on the left wing mixed it up further.

As a whole unit the players lacked awareness, belief and leadership (on and off the park).

As a team we went to sleep and they scored a sweet goal.

This isn't a matter of defending deep - it boils down to fitness of attitude and awareness...and seeing as Megson said it he goes up in my estimations.

[eaststandtom]

Once again on Saturday we fail to hold onto a lead due to poor defending.

As is so often the case we take the lead then the longer the game goes on we seem to drop back deeper and deeper to defend constantly inviting the opposition onto us.

Will Gerry Taggart be able to sort out this problem we've had for the last few seasons?

Is it the quality of our defenders that lets us down?

Is it because we panic?

Or is it just a lack of confidence that we can win games if we try?

How do you set about correcting such a problem, you can't go onto the pitch and kick their *rses forward.

You can shout, rant and rave from the touchline, (can they hear you above the noise of the crowd)

Should the team captain be a defender who will give a well earned bo**ocking to anyone not doing as their told.

As I say it's a problem that needs sorting, can Gerry do it?

I am a lot more comfortable with Citys defense than on previous seasons. Its great to see a left back able to play the ball out of defence with his right foot and with some pace and ability in Sheehan. N’gotty has added some strength (shame about stearman but he can still improve) and kisnorbo has the heart of a lion. My only concern would be with both kisnorbo and mcauley playing the lack of real pace through the centre. I like mcauley, he is competent and strong, but not at the expense of kisnorbo and would like to see a pacey centre half with him.

[demon_dog]

I don't think it's necessarily down to pace.

Remember Elliott, Taggart, etc were not particularly fast, yet were very good defenders.

I think it's probably down to awareness and confidence.

You know that the player alongside is capable of winning the ball, you are aware that if not, to whom the ball is likely to be passed to.

A lot of this comes from experience.

As some peolple have also stated, this is where the midfield come in, they not only come and help defend, but when they get the ball can pass it out to either wing or forward to a striker.

I agree that when we defend corners or free kicks just outside the box, that we flood our area with players.

This not only creates chaos, it give less chance for our keepr to get the ball. Also with no forwards near the halfway line we have no outlet for the ball.

Thracian seems to think that this is a problem easily solved, I disagree, we have now had at least 4 managers that have not solved the problem.

Lets hope Taggart can.

[eaststandtom]

I don't think it's necessarily down to pace.

Remember Elliott, Taggart, etc were not particularly fast, yet were very good defenders.

I think it's probably down to awareness and confidence.

true but they were both at their best in a 3!

[Thracian]

The problem did not lie in a defence being TOO (God that's been annoying me) deep or otherwise. From the minute we put a right back on the wing and sent Hume back up front the whole side went to 6's and 7's. Then putting a slow defensive midfield player on the left wing mixed it up further.

As a whole unit the players lacked awareness, belief and leadership (on and off the park).

As a team we went to sleep and they scored a sweet goal.

This isn't a matter of defending deep - it boils down to fitness of attitude and awareness...and seeing as Megson said it he goes up in my estimations.

He oversaw those nonsensical decisions. He might have gone up in your estamation but he went down another notch in mine.