UKIP couple have foster children removed from care

[Daggers]

I knew that if anyone was going to defend this it would be you.

Says the small-minded, tedious (benefit-claiming) apologist for right-wing nonsense.

[BunkMoreland]

Says the small-minded, tedious (benefit-claiming) apologist for right-wing nonsense.

High quality meaningful contribution there, bro.

[Rincewind]

If anything it will gain UKIP a few more votes this week in the by-election there.

I doubt UKIP leaders were thinking that when going to the press.

[lavrentis]

I love Farage, one of very few decent politicians. I think me, like many of his fans first saw him on YouTube, he is very media savvy but I don't mind that because he actually speaks great amounts of sense, done amazingly well to get UKIP to where they are today and speaks for the common man a lot more than other politicians.

[acooling08]

Listening to the interview, the council woman is a ****ing idiot, in fact perfect to be a politician, because she keeps avoiding the question over and over with the 'ethical needs' bullshit!

Stupid fvcking cow.

[Captain...]

I love Farage, one of very few decent politicians. I think me, like many of his fans first saw him on YouTube, he is very media savvy but I don't mind that because he actually speaks great amounts of sense, done amazingly well to get UKIP to where they are today and speaks for the common man a lot more than other politicians.

He is a good politician, for that reason I don't trust him. He speaks well and presents his case well, but I cannot support his ideology, it is very easy to criticise the eu and there are a number of flaws, but it has also done a lot of good in terms of business and free trade, freedom of travel ease of doing business with and in Europe. Things like that shouldn't be sacrificed over a few high profile yet ultimately insignificant cases like deporting hate preachers, or ridiculously interpreted health and safety rules. We need to be looking for a global way of working it is the only way to tackle the major problems of this world.

[davieG]

He is a good politician, for that reason I don't trust him. He speaks well and presents his case well, but I cannot support his ideology, it is very easy to criticise the eu and there are a number of flaws, but it has also done a lot of good in terms of business and free trade, freedom of travel ease of doing business with and in Europe. Things like that shouldn't be sacrificed over a few high profile yet ultimately insignificant cases like deporting hate preachers, or ridiculously interpreted health and safety rules. We need to be looking for a global way of working it is the only way to tackle the major problems of this world.

It should have stayed as a Common Market rather than going for a United States of Europe because most of the things you say are good could be covered by that.

Financial they are totally inept and seemingly corrupt..

Having said that I don't know enough about the consequences of leaving, I'd be more than happy to roll back the years to the Common Market status again.

[Zingari]

It should have stayed as a Common Market rather than going for a United States of Europe because most of the things you say are good could be covered by that.

Financial they are totally inept and seemingly corrupt..

Having said that I don't know enough about the consequences of leaving, I'd be more than happy to roll back the years to the Common Market status again.

Very true .

I wonder how much of what's happened since has been the product of a gradual evolutionary process or if it was the intention right from the start .

[Jon the Hat]

Very true .

I wonder how much of what's happened since has been the product of a gradual evolutionary process or if it was the intention right from the start .

Be in no doubt whatsoever that those in charge are completely set on a feredal Europe and have been from the start. To be fair to them, the middle ground where we are now doesn't work, so you either need that or back to the common market.

[Zingari]

Be in no doubt whatsoever that those in charge are completely set on a feredal Europe and have been from the start. To be fair to them, the middle ground where we are now doesn't work, so you either need that or back to the common market.

I believe you're right Jon . But that raises the questions of who is this shadowy elite who are dictating the path of sovreign nations .What is the point of national govt. Where is their powerbase ? What is the ultimate goal etc ?

Will federal Europe soon be considered as merely a half way stage with one world government the final endeavour ?

It's very easy to go down the conspiracy rabbit hole .

[Captain...]

I believe you're right Jon . But that raises the questions of who is this shadowy elite who are dictating the path of sovreign nations .What is the point of national govt. Where is their powerbase ? What is the ultimate goal etc ?

Will federal Europe soon be considered as merely a half way stage with one world government the final endeavour ?

It's very easy to go down the conspiracy rabbit hole .

Why is it a conspiracy to aim for one world government? Surely that is what we should all be aiming for as without it we will never be able to tackle true world problems, such as running out of resources, climate change, depletion of fish and other species, pollution of the atmosphere, human rights violations, war, terrorism, poverty, sickness, disease.

There are some massive barriers to that, the main one being religious and political tensions, but as long as countries don't lose their national identities and culture and heritage, I am fully in support of a global government.

[Zingari]

Why is it a conspiracy to aim for one world government? Surely that is what we should all be aiming for as without it we will never be able to tackle true world problems, such as running out of resources, climate change, depletion of fish and other species, pollution of the atmosphere, human rights violations, war, terrorism, poverty, sickness, disease.

There are some massive barriers to that, the main one being religious and political tensions, but as long as countries don't lose their national identities and culture and heritage, I am fully in support of a global government.

Whether or not you or anyone else believes the ultimate goal to be altruistic doesn't alter the fact that it is still a conspiracy . It is an act planned and orchestrated by a group of people in secret , and as far as I'm aware this long term global aim is not the will of the people, so they are hardly democratic in their nature .

If it is such an altruistic aim , why not come right out and tell us ?

Why do societies make out that everyone who believes in these long term objectives to be paranoid lunatics ?

[Jon the Hat]

The fact that the majority of people don't particularly want closer integration with other nations, yet political elites pursue it anyway is not democracy, and history tells us that political systems which are not democracy can turn bad pretty quickly.

[Captain...]

Whether or not you or anyone else believes the ultimate goal to be altruistic doesn't alter the fact that it is still a conspiracy . It is an act planned and orchestrated by a group of people in secret , and as far as I'm aware this long term global aim is not the will of the people, so they are hardly democratic in their nature .

If it is such an altruistic aim , why not come right out and tell us ?

Why do societies make out that everyone who believes in these long term objectives to be paranoid lunatics ?

I'm sure there are some people who want a global government, there already is a step towards it with the UN and G8 meetings, but it is not enough as we have seen with things like the Kyoto agreement, too many countries are only interested in themselves, and don't see us as one world, it's almost as though they believe we must have enemies and conflict to survive.

Of course there will be some who would look to exploit a global society and global government, just as there are those that seek to exploit the current set-up, if there are groups working in secret to try and orchestrate this then it may well just be because they don't think this world is ready for it yet, how can we have any sort of global government with what is happening in Palestine and Syria and North Korea at the moment, and any half measures will not be successful.

The fact that the majority of people don't particularly want closer integration with other nations, yet political elites pursue it anyway is not democracy, and history tells us that political systems which are not democracy can turn bad pretty quickly.

You state that as fact, but I disagree, when discussing Europe and our involvement there are many good things that have come out of it that we now take for granted, and allow the bad things to pollute and warp our view, I am sure that everyone here has benefited from the ease of travel through Europe, and a number have benefited from working in Europe, or with Europeans over here, and despite its abuses we are all better off with the European Bill of Human Rights, despite a couple of high profile cases recently, and despite everything that has happened in the last few years we are financially stronger now thanks to being in the EU than we would have been if we had never joined. Yes there have been mistakes and the handling of Greece and other impoverished countries may yet prove to be one of them, but overall it has done more good than bad.

But then people get into stupid arguments over things like changing the weights and measures, not being able to call it a Cornish Pasty if it wasn't made in Cornwall.

As for democracy and the will of the people, it doesn't work in situations were people do not know the full picture and people are easily swayed by high profile yet ultimately insignificant incidents, like Abu Katada (sp), and don't appreciate the benefits of such a union as they are now so used to them, the media has too much sway in these matters, not to mention party politics and the enforced choice between 2 parties that will argue black is white if the other party says the opposite meaning we can never get any serious debate on such matters, but then we are moving off the point here.

What I guess I am trying to say is that Europe has been good for us, but we take all that for granted now and focus on the negatives then of course people will want out, but that would be disastrous for the country and shouldn't be decided by a referendum.

[Zingari]

I agree with much of what you say Capt . and in the short term ( post WWll) there does seem to be on balance plenty to be happy about the EU being for the greater good and maybe that is the intention of the driving forces at the moment ( although I very much doubt it), but as Jon said centralization of power into a small undemocratic elite will almost inevitably lead to a more malign dictatorship.

The masses will become ever more enslaved and powerless as the possibility of any sort of revolt becomes more and more futile .

What I find interesting in these debates is the way that over a period of a very few years , the emphasis has shifted from the premise of NWO being the product of the over imaginative conspiracy minded groups , to one of acceptance that it will in all probability happen in the distant future , but will be a cause of rejoicing .

[BoneDog]

She was/is a Project Advisory Group member of "Common Purpose" which is thought by many to a shadowy left wing Fabian organisation

That explains alot. She's defo not neutral if she belongs to that organisation. F*&k eds.

[Carl the Llama]

A lot of people in here clearly have an interest/concern with the powers of the EU.

Wikipedia to the rescue!

The key thing that the conspiracy nuts need to bear in mind is this:

All proposals or decisions made by the EU are done so either by the officials directly elected by us, or by officials elected/chosen by them after being given the mandate to do so on our behalf.

[Guest MattP]

Protecting a child from being brought up with discriminatory values by supporters of a party that wishes to end the promotion of multi-culturalism and abolish the Human Rights Act.

That's not vindictive or left wing, it's just common sense.

Should supporters of facism, holocaust deniers or the BNP or EDL be allowed to foster children whom the state have a responsibility to ensure their welfare?

Oh my lord lol lol

I honestly have no words for this, what sort of a person actually are you?

Like everyone (except Nick of course) has said, a quite incredible decision that baffles any sane person, hopefully this person will be out of a job very very soon. Completely incapable.

[Parafox]

"The children have been in care proceedings before and the judge had previously criticised us for not looking after the children's cultural and ethnic needs, and we have had to really take that into consideration with the placement that they were in."

That says it all for me.

Sod the childrens best interests or the fact that the foster placement was secure and stable or the fact that they had 7 untroubled, successful years as foster carers.

As someone who has had the heartbreaking experience of having my grandaughter summarily removed from our family (and from our care) due to a percieved "risk" of loud and aggressive arguments between us and her birth mum (our adopted daugther), I have no faith in the social services making considered and appraised decisions. They knee-jerk without fully taking into account all circumstances.

What WAS the risk to these children? If the foster carers have had a number of previous placements, then it is highly likely that this would have been a short-term placement. How old are the children? Are they of an age where they are likely to be indoctrinated by any political views? Do we withold foster placements for Jehovas Witnesses on the basis that they hold religious beliefs that prevent certain medical interventions?

It's a poor decision not least for the children who have been in previous placements. Any move has a huge negative impact on children who, in later life, find it hard to trust and attach to others because each time they get moved on they get disrupted and they have no sense of security or trust.

If they were at genuine risk, then fair enough, but I believe this was borne out of fear of criticism, not what was best for the children.

[Guest MattP]

http://www.bbc.co.uk...litics-20287061

Hope any parents who have adopted don't make it clear they are members of the Labour party.

Temporary curbs imposed in 2005 to protect the British labour market are set to expire on that date.

The Labour Party have said they would support any moves to extend the ban.

But some experts predict a large number of immigrants from Eastern Europe, which Labour has warned could put pressure on British jobs and wages.

[Guest MattP]

Going to be a very very busy day for Rotherham Social Services tomorrow with potentially 5,000 people's children to remove from them.