Cardiff or Swansea in the Premier League

[Mack]

I've never had a massive issue with the Welsh.

They get all unnecessary when England play them at sport and can get disrespectful and stupid, but in general they are OK neighbours despite their rip off prices to enter their country.

And I never had an issue with welsh teams playing in our leagues, until that day when Cardiff City got oh so close to an FA cup victory and the potential European spot that is provides via the ENGLISH FA.

Cardiff stated they would not represent the English FA in Europe, and at that point something snapped for me.

This pathetic 'Cut off your own nose to spite your face' anti English stance made me realise they don't play in our league for any other reason other than their own league is a joke, and if their own league was stronger they would be off in a flash.

So the question then arises that why should a team so anti the England enjoy the spoils of the richest league in the World? And if they are to complete in the Premier League should some written assurances be sought?

Personally I would throw them out of our league tomorrow. Any thoughts?

[Guest Bilo]

I dislike Cardiff because their playing staff is chockful of wankers as is their fanbase. That they're an arrogant, pretentious little club has little to do with their being Welsh in my opinion.

I do agree they need to choose which system they wish to be a part of though, FAW or the FA because their bi-national status has been used to Cardiff's advantage more than once.

[Corky]

Don't mind Swansea.

[Finnegan]

I've never had a massive issue with the Welsh.

They get all unnecessary when England play them at sport and can get disrespectful and stupid, but in general they are OK neighbours despite their rip off prices to enter their country.

And I never had an issue with welsh teams playing in our leagues, until that day when Cardiff City got oh so close to an FA cup victory and the potential European spot that is provides via the ENGLISH FA.

Cardiff stated they would not represent the English FA in Europe, and at that point something snapped for me.

This pathetic 'Cut off your own nose to spite your face' anti English stance made me realise they don't play in our league for any other reason other than their own league is a joke, and if their own league was stronger they would be off in a flash.

So the question then arises that why should a team so anti the England enjoy the spoils of the richest league in the World? And if they are to complete in the Premier League should some written assurances be sought?

Personally I would throw them out of our league tomorrow. Any thoughts?

Wow. Jesus. Where to begin?

Firstly, you what? You think Cardiff were turning down the chance to play in Europe because they "didn't want to represent England?" You're massively misinformed and being completely and totally ridiculous. Football is a sport about money, what club would turn down a place in Europe? ESPECIALLY one owned by as greedy twats as Cardiff.

The issue with Cardiff in the FA cup final was that, if they'd won it, they wouldn't have been ALLOWED a place in Europe, as things stand. I imagine the spot would have gone to Portsmouth regardless? The English FA said that they would NOT grant Cardiff a place. Eventually they backed down under pressure from Platini and UEFA but Cardiff lost anyway.

As for getting "unnecessary" and "disrespectful," it's a fucking sporting rivalry, untwist your knickers and relax eh?

Your persistent xenophobia is fucking boring, stow all of the ridiculous "I don't have a problem with the Welsh, BUT..." nonsense because it's blatant you do. I'm supposed to be the one with a chip on my shoulder, not the visa versa, the amount of shit you come out with on this forum about my country is absolutely ridiculous.

If I was as offensive about, say, Pakistan as you've been about Wales and the Welsh on here I'd probably have been banned by now for being racist.

[Bert]

Cardiff and Swansea have been in our league for years now. Not one bit bothered if they go up, because if they do they'll have earned their right to be there.

What I do think, is Cardiff should have some sort of punishment due to their irregularities by now. How many times have they been threatened by admin? Broke a transfer rule too?

[Darkon84]

Cardiff wouldnt have been allowed to play in in Europe because they are not under the ruling of the English FA.

Similar to stories that came around last week about them being involved in some sort of third party business. However, there was to be no actions against them because they do not answer to the English FA, only the league and the Welsh FA. And as the Welsh FA has no laws against the thrid party bullcrap, there were to be no actions.

Both of those points make it a bit unfair. In my eyes, if you are playing in the country and its leagues, you should abide by the rules of the countrys FA.

Im not sure how much of that made sense, i went in to typing overdrive as the boss was looking at me funny so i had to get it done quickly haha.

Reading will go up anyway

[Finnegan]

Cardiff and Swansea have been in our league for years now. Not one bit bothered if they go up, because if they do they'll have earned their right to be there.

What I do think, is Cardiff should have some sort of punishment due to their irregularities by now. How many times have they been threatened by admin? Broke a transfer rule too?

Spot on.

Cardiff's ownership is disgusting, it really is, and it's an embarrassment to the club and it's fans that they're tarnished with the reputation their board are giving them. (Though, whilst Mandaric was no way near as bad, we really shouldn't be the first to cast stones.)

But Swansea and Cardiff have been part of this league system for time immemorial, people just need to get the fuck over it and find something else to moan about.

[Ford Super Sunday]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/may/06/fa-faw-cardiff-swansea

I think it's disgusting that a French team plays in the Rugby Super League, and two Italian teams play in the Magners League.

Reprehensible!

And while we're at it, why are those c*nts at Berwick playing in Scotland. Disgrace I say!

They're a damn sight better than most clubs in the Football League, and while they're competitive and offer something to the FL, then why should they have to move 'cos they're Welsh?'

When they can't offer something to the FL then they will do what Wrexham did, drop down to the Conference.

It's strange that this debate only seems to crop up when either team is in danger of doing something good. Getting promoted to the Prem, winning the FA Cup. Something we can't do at the moment, so when a non-English team goes and does it. OH NOES, it's not fair!

I dislike Cardiff like most people, but other than that, the only thing annoying about the two clubs is the fact they're both horrifically long to get to (in away day terms) and we never seem to win there).

[Dickie Greenleaf]

Swansea and Cardiff have been part of this league system for time immemorial, people just need to get the fuck over it and find something else to moan about.

[Simmo86]

Swansea just for the fact if there in the Prem it means they've beaten Forest!

[lcfcadam]

The issue about them being Welsh doesn't come into it in the slightest for me. I can't stand Cardiff because they're a club with appalling ownership, many vile players, and a slightly larger than usual contingent of twattish fans. Their success has come partly through dodgy dealings and endless let-offs on the part of the authorities.

Swansea on the other hand seem to be well run, with lots of young exciting talent on the pitch who have achieved their successes through pure merit (not stretching / breaking every single rule in the book ala Cardiff).

So it's a no-brainer really...

[ajthefox]

Don't want Cardiff to get promoted, wouldn't be too bothered about Swansea though.

Can anyone briefly explain to me why it is they are in the English league and not the Welsh?

[Finnegan]

Don't want Cardiff to get promoted, wouldn't be too bothered about Swansea though.

Can anyone briefly explain to me why it is they are in the English league and not the Welsh?

... because... there isn't a fully professional Welsh league?

Not being funny but that's pretty flippin' obvious isn't it?

The English spent centuries trying to pretend that Wales was, literally, just a part of the same country (as opposed to a fellow member in the same union.) Seamless integration of Welsh teams into the English league system is just one of many, many fairly small products of that relationship.

Don't like it? Shouldn't have invaded.

[RedHux]

My only issues with them is the weird thing about the FAW having any sort of say over anything in the English leagues and Cardiff's peculiar ability to dodge having to pay for anything.

Other then that I'm ok with having welsh clubs in the football league and if they're promoted then they've obviously been good enough to be there (financial rule bending aside). It seems to me that Swansea have been quietly putting together a very decent side so hats off to them.

[Mack]

You are wrong mate.

The FA did give Cardiff the green light to represent the English FA in the UEFA cup, but Cardiff snubbed that in favour of a potential 'Wild Card' from UEFA.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-561830/Cardiff-qualify-Europe-beat-Portsmouth-FA-Cup-final.html

As both Cardiff and Swansea are knocking on the door of the Premier League this situation needs clearing up before we end up in another potential problematic situation.

I read recently that Cardiff are also looking at dropping out of the FA cup in favour of the Welsh cup as an easy back door to European football.

I dont like the whole way this situation is handled, and personally I would rather see them both in the league of Wales.

Yes I went fishing a bit for a 'touchy taff' and low and behold one came along just in time!!

I suppose the other option would be a British league with a British FA. That would of course mean a Britain National team, and given the current fashion for Nationalism amongst the home nations you'll have more chance of getting a whale up your arse.

[Finnegan]

Did you actually even read the article you posted? No where there did it say "Cardiff told the FA to fuck off, because they'd rather not be in Europe at all than have to represent an English competition! Ya boo sucks to you Pommy!"

It says, and I quote, ""We just believed that if Cardiff did win the Cup and were not given qualification for the UEFA Cup then for sporting reasons we would look to offer them a wildcard."

[Mack]

Did you actually even read the article you posted? No where there did it say "Cardiff told the FA to fuck off, because they'd rather not be in Europe at all than have to represent an English competition! Ya boo sucks to you Pommy!"

It says, and I quote, ""We just believed that if Cardiff did win the Cup and were not given qualification for the UEFA Cup then for sporting reasons we would look to offer them a wildcard."

The facts are this....

Cardiff originally were turned down for a UEFA cup place with the English FA.

The English FA changed their minds.

Cardiff said they would rather play in the UEFA cup as UEFA Wild Card.

I dont want to argue any more.

I knew writing how I felt would lead to abuse, but bollocks I dont care, it's how I feel.

This matter needs clearing up now before any more issues arise.

[Finnegan]

When "writing how you feel" is another bunch of xenophobic, provocative shit then I'm sad for the day it isn't met with abuse.

[Mack]

When "writing how you feel" is another bunch of xenophobic, provocative shit then I'm sad for the day it isn't met with abuse.

I think the xenophobia prevails much more strongly on your side of the border than ours.

I fail to see how the Welsh can have their cake and eat it when it comes to football.

I was absolutely disgusted and enraged at the manner in which God save the Queen was treated at the hands of Welsh fans during the Wales vs England game, meanwhile we let the Welsh club sides ply their wares in our leagues.

I get the impression from the rows that have been ongoing over a GB football team for next year's Olympic games that the Welsh and Scottish FA have a chip on their shoulders.

I think the boundaries between Wales and England in a sporting sense overall have become far too blurred.

[RedHux]

Is it even possible to get "absolutely disgusted and outraged" over the treatment of the nation anthem?

I'd seek anger management if that sort of thing wound me up.

[ajthefox]

The facts are this....

Cardiff originally were turned down for a UEFA cup place with the English FA.

The English FA changed their minds.

Cardiff said they would rather play in the UEFA cup as UEFA Wild Card.

I dont want to argue any more.

I knew writing how I felt would lead to abuse, but bollocks I dont care, it's how I feel.

This matter needs clearing up now before any more issues arise.

It would've been rude of Cardiff to just go straight for the wild card, but since the FA turned them down in the first place they've got every right to put two fingers up to the FA out of principal imo.

[Finnegan]

I think the xenophobia prevails much more strongly on your side of the border than ours.

I disagree completely, actually. Having lived both sides of the border I have to say that perceived attitudes towards the English by the Welsh are largely a myth. People in Cardiff bemoan people in Swansea just as much as the English and those from the North West of Wales are prone to be just as grumpy about those in the South.

We get a bee in our bonnet when it comes to sport but so what? I think a bit of banter and rivalry is a good thing, it makes sport interesting and the English give as good as they get.

Meanwhile, the English media persistently perpetuate the English sentiment that it's perfectly fine to mock the Welsh, we're an easy target and we're expected to take feelings ranging from belittlement to out-right mistrust with good humour and told we just have "a chip on our shoulder" if we dig back.

I was absolutely disgusted and enraged at the manner in which God save the Queen was treated at the hands of Welsh fans during the Wales vs England game

I wasn't, it was fucking hilarious. But then I'm not some sort of jingoist nationalist that thinks my country's national anthem is some sacred piece of ancient culture that should never be mocked or cheapened. We booed yours, you booed ours. We just outnumbered you.

Besides, as I said earlier, don't like it? Shouldn't have invaded.

meanwhile we let the Welsh club sides ply their wares in our leagues.

You mean ply their trades, and the hell has that got to do with anything?

I get the impression from the rows that have been ongoing over a GB football team for next year's Olympic games that the Welsh and Scottish FA have a chip on their shoulders.

Again you massively miss the point (I shouldn't sound so surprised.)

The issue there is that Wales and Scotland recognize that we defy the FIFA / UEFA regulations that state that members should be internationally recognized sovereign states (hence Kosovo's rejection on purely technical grounds.) We aren't. We keep our status because we're founder members and because we've got a hundred years of history on our side.

What we don't want to do is rock the boat. It's alright Blatter insisting that he doesn't see it being a problem, but what if it becomes a regular occurrence? What if future FIFA committees decide it DOES reflect badly on our claim? Easiest and the safest thing for us, in regards keeping our status as a recognized football association, is to refuse to participate in a united British team.

It has absolutely nothing at all to do with refusing to be recognized as British, hating the British or hating the English.

Edit: And who are you missing out on anyway? Bale, Ramsey and maybe - at a push - Craig Gordon?

[lcfcadam]

I was absolutely disgusted and enraged at the manner in which God save the Queen was treated at the hands of Welsh fans during the Wales vs England game, meanwhile we let the Welsh club sides ply their wares in our leagues.

Christ, with our totally bullshit national anthem I find it pretty hard not to boo it myself if I'm there when it's being performed...

[Webbo]

The issue there is that Wales and Scotland recognize that we defy the FIFA / UEFA regulations that state that members should be internationally recognized sovereign states (hence Kosovo's rejection on purely technical grounds.) We aren't. We keep our status because we're founder members and because we've got a hundred years of history on our side.

I'm not questioning what you say, but I can't see why that would be a problem. The Faroe Islands aren't an independent country yet they've got there own team.

The more teams there are in FIFA the more matches there are meaning more revenue for them. I can't see FIFA wanting to change that.

[Finnegan]

I'm not questioning what you say, but I can't see why that would be a problem. The Faroe Islands aren't an independent country yet they've got there own team.

The more teams there are in FIFA the more matches there are meaning more revenue for them. I can't see FIFA wanting to change that.

And the Faroe Islands aren't, as far as I'm aware, regularly teaming up with Denmark and Greenland to play in the same shirt and under the same flag at the Olympic games?

Edit: Just like to add, however, that that's taking things off on something of a tangent - I'm not actually saying that I'm either pro or anti the British Olympic side. I'm just explaining that Scotland and Wales' reason for not participating is concerns over their sovereignty in the eyes of FIFA and not some issue of anti-English or anti-Britishness.